It is a Public disgrace to see our so called President, campaign at the state level...and we had to pay for it!! This individual is abusing every power he can all with the company of our money. I am ashamed this man is our President.

It looks like the GOP Loonies are doing a good job F..King our nation up for their 1% Buddies !!!!!!!!!!!!!

@roadlesstraveled At least he is sticking up for the rights of the average worker. What is TRUELY shameful is taking away workers rights and blocking the voters from having any say. What say you?

State Rep. Shanelle Jackson, D, said the law guaranteed Snyder’s defeat in 2014,

Yeah, you folks guaranteed us that Walker was gonna get recalled, too.

Nice touch by the Unions forcing school closures today so that the teachers could go scream in futility.

This is why you never ever vote for Republicans. Did they run the elections saying they were going to destroy workers rights? Hell no, they do it out of the kindness of their Corporate donors pocketbooks. I'm no fan of Unions, even got fired for making fun of Unions, but I sure as hell know why they came into existence. I guess when your kids work next to you in the sweatshops, you'll understand their purpose too, only a little too late.

Bravo Michigan!!!!!!!

The Right To Work House Bill 4003 has passed.

Now when the great Governor Rick Snyder signs it Michigan will begin its move into the 21st century economy we all know we need to compete in.

All we can hope for is that the goonions and the useful idiots that support it don't become violent and start vandalizing and rioting like they did in Wisconsin. This is what happens when desperation sets in and the unions realize they have done much more to damage our great Republic than help it.

Thank you for your courage and patriotism Michigan.

Now let's start to create real jobs for real Americans.

How is this destroying individual worker's rights? "Right to work" legislation gives individual worker's the right to choose whether or not they wish to be in a union instead of forcing them to belong to a union.

Why do so many people think if unions die out we'll all be working in sweat shops? Only 7% of private sector jobs are unionized, but somehow these people have been holding the line for everyone else? That seems unlikely. Now the public sector is 37% unionized so their impact is obviously more extensive.

Still, that works out to 11% of the total workforce being unionized. Regardless of this legislation, it seems unions are on their way out.

(Bureau of Labor Statistics, 2011)

That's what people don't seem to understand dave20121. The right-to-work laws just say that you can't be forced to join a union to get a job. And if the union is such a great thing for the workers, they'll join it.

But what the unions are afraid of is that the workers will see that they don't want to be in the union and that will kill off the unions. Or that the workers may form their own collective-bargaining co-op, and be an alternative to the high-dues union, and the result again is the death of the union.

People keep saying that the unions have to bargain for everyone. But the laws (at least here in Indiana) are that they have to bargain for everyone if there is no other bargaining party. All the unions have to do is state that they are bargaining for only union members, and that makes the non-union workers into their own bargaining agent. The result is that the union is then only negotiating for the workers in the union.

Welcome to Michigan!!

Home of the new American soup line.

"Please sir can i have some more?"

Salud

THE AMERICAN WORKER IS FINALLY BEING FREED FROM THE CHAINS OF UNION COERCION AND CORRUPTION!

If the unions are so vital and so beneficial why do they need to force their "rights" on the workforce?

If the unions are so good at bargaining they should have no problem attracting more members who will support their efforts.

America was NOT built on the shoulders of government or unions. It was built on the shoulders of industry. Steel, oil, auto, energy, manufacturing were all the drivers that created the strongest and most envied economy in history.

It's good to see so many Americans supporting workers rights to choose. It's curious how the Liberals/Progressives are Pro-Choice about everything else but this.

Their hypocrisy is overwhelming.

There is a serious trend in this nation sponsored by Corporations who now control specific sections of our political parties and the take over is increasing at an alarming rate. Corporations know very well when the few outweigh the demands of many and the few have no ultimate power to yield their results even for a short period of time they will always win and corporations now even sway judicial systems ( Judges, Supreme court judges ). One must ask one self of why Republicans are turning their backs towards a certain segment of society, which are identified as the average American worker who only financial means to survive are the upper salaries they receive via participating with union stewardship. Obama clearly stated that this move has nothing to do with the strengthening or weakening of the economy, but purely it is political and the only people(s) being targeted are higher salaried average workers which in color contrast or both white, black and Hispanic and democrats. You would think the extremest republican contortionist obstruction tactics came to an end after the Election, but the madness train still rolls on. These republican politicians are deaf to the sane reasoning presented to them and they fell they must continue to pursue the total destruction of a certain class in our society. Peaceful protest does absolutely nothing these days and you can not protest corporations as you do not know who to protest against and with that said, a protest must be mounted directly towards the stewardship of this government of America in which corporations reside and it must be done in massive numbers unimaginable in scope. 2014 is a long way away and the effects of this decision today opens the door to more raping and shackling of today's workers. These laws do not effect the technical or professional white collar industries but only the mid level salaried workers across America.

This is not the 20's or 30's when unions where inherited with thugs and drafted it's memberships with forceful tactics, but these modern unions today have provided sophisticated policies and work place admenments which have enhanced the average workers rights and benefits and have allowed a small class of workers to enjoy some fruits of a higher standard of living but again there are these hell bent republican politicians who see the workers as some type of national threat or consider them communist in respect to their demands that they are both human and deserve better in life.

I see a great war in America's very near future which is not a world war or racial war nor it be a civil war, but a class war with disastrous results. Innocent people of all color will be victims behind the madness of the republican political extremist machine which show hints of Hitleratism here in America and the present administration is powerless to stop the forward motion of hateful progress and only the judicial judges can halt this progress if not for the judges also being persuaded by Corporation takeover of America.

Jim-

America was NOT built on the shoulders of government or unions. It was built on the shoulders of industry. Steel, oil, auto, energy, manufacturing were all the drivers that created the strongest and most envied economy in history

Auto workers UNION.

Steel workers UNION.

Electrical workers UNION.

Pipe fitters UNION.

The list goes on and on.

Sorry Jim, but UNIONS built America.

It's good to see so many Americans supporting workers rights to choose. It's curious how the Liberals/Progressives are Pro-Choice about everything else but this

Nice Right Wing talking point.

Now, go watch Hannity and listen to Rush for more BS you can shovel.

Salud

Studies show that right to work legislation lowers wages 6-8% in states that have them.

Good job Republicans, great way to support the 1%.

i feel bad my words were so strong in my post above. I should have just said: if you wanted to change state laws by campaigning, why did you become President of the United States????????????? Why
don't you just go be a senator again....isn't that what your doing anyway???

Right to work law doesn't mean the unions are banned, it just gives people a choice whether to join a union or not, I worked for a company for 28 years that was union and yes I was in the union, guess what the business I worked for is no longer it went bankrupt with the help of the union!!!!!!

If unions are such a necessity than why are unions AGAINST choice? Give the worker the choice of whether to join the union or not. Since unions are SO good (as I keep hearing) and employers will simply take advantage of the worker if NOT in a union then the law should not make a difference. Everyone should still be flocking to the union begging to join. So if unions are so good a "choice" shouldn't matter - should it?

Unions saved America from Slave Labor, if you don't like Unions move to China !!!!!

No unions in China, this is the way of the GOP !!!!!!!!!!!!

AG99, I worked for 2 companies that killed the union and at both of them management lower wages. The first company simply fired everybody then hired all tempts, the second company brought in a lot of new people, trained them to do the jobs then fired everybody that made $12 an hour up to $25 per hour, which was all of us. the average pay per hour now is $8.50 to $9.00.

Republicans are killing unions, and when they're gone you will see companies one by one start lowering wages because there will be no one to say they can't.

Nobody can say it won't happen, because it is happening right at this very minute.

Republicans are paying companies to ship their jobs overseas where the labor is cheap, now with no union protection do you really think these very greedy CEO's are going to keep wages where they are when the can cut pay and increase theirs and their stockholders income?

If this union killing trend republicans are on is not reversed, I predict that within ten years, a starting pay of $10 per hour will be the dream job.

Everything republicans do is geared toward helping the rich get richer at the expense of everybody else. why is that simple fact so hard for a lot of people to understand??

Roadlesstraveled: Why are you apologizing? You are spot on. This president cares nothing about the country or the people - only his power. So even though our president has NEVER worked a day in his life in the private sector, and would know an income statement from a personal statement, he believes he knows how to get an economy going again - but doesn't.

He is a Community Organizer in Chief and instead of ASKING the business community what is needed to get this economy going he instead goes to his Saul Alinsky "Rules for Radicals" book to find out the best way to damage a country and attain MORE power.

This president is shameful and divisive but will go down in history as the president with the WORST economic recovery in United States history.

ABSOLUTLY the right thing to do....at 18 yrs. old,on my first day as a bus mech, I was cornered by the time clock by the shop steward,in jersey,and was told I would have to pay $500 initiation fee to keep my job...I did,and when the drivers went on strike,we did a'sympathy' strike,and we lost 3 weeks pay....nice job union..$875 per year for nothing.....I was in AFGE..before I retired,...in '95 when the gov. shut down,we were told to contact our reps to find out what separation code to use to collect unemployment...called and called....still waiting.....$352 a year for nothing....Right to work implies that you won't have a union stooge extorting money from you to keep your job....Unions did good things 80 years ago,....now they are political money machines...........let them join the DO-DO bird................U.S. Army Disabled Veteran.

AleChild

@roadlesstraveled At least he is sticking up for the rights of the average worker. What is TRUELY shameful is taking away workers rights and blocking the voters from having any say. What say you?

what rights are you referring to...the right to buy the presidential election via unions? really what right. Are you no longer allowed the pursuit of happiness, to carry a fireare, freedom of speech...what right are you talking about?? Or do you mean the rights of only union members like the bill of rights states in article 11?

The Republican Death Star in Michigan just powered up, and fired. Can't wait to see how this movie ends!

Topane: You clearly have never taken a college economics course. A business CANNOT just lower wages. They must pay MARKET wages to be competitive. So if this firm replaced $12 to $25 an hour jobs with $8.50 to $9.00 an hour then the former was being paid higher than market wages. However, MORE jobs were created at the same time (look up Marginal Revenue Product and Marginal Resource Cost).

It was either that OR jobs move overseas. You see you CAN'T have it both ways. If unions force inflated wages then outsourcing makes sense. If you want to keep jobs in the U.S. then you must let wages go to market wages.

roadlesstraveled

I was referring to the right to a safe workplace and fair compensation. You do realize that the ones that do not want the unions to survive are the same ones that made them necessary in the first place. It is a shame that you would rather see history repeat itself, rather than learn from it.

And thanks for the copy of the constitution.

Where did you get your info Eric? The B of Labor Statistics show wages INCREASED in Right to Work states.

40 hours work week = Union

Lunch break = Union

Maternity Leave = Union

Vaction = Union

Healthcare = Union

Livable wage = Union

So if anyone hates unions maybe we should go back to no unions. How did that work out for us? NOT GOOD. I don't work for a union but I LOVE them for what they did for this country most good for workers.

I work in Virginia got fired for something that was not my fault. Everyone knew it and admitted it but due to the right to work laws. I got a sh!t sandwich and was told to get the F-IN OUT.

Got another job.

It's like that can slap you in the face and tell you to shut the F-IN up slave.

Finally a great day for Michigan!! Workers will no longer be under the tyranny of the unions. Freedom of choice is always best! If the workers still want to join the union, that will be their right. If workers choose to not be a member of the union that will now be their right!!

And I see those Michigan teachers caring so much for their students... This is EXACTLY why people are fed up with the effects of modern day unions. In this day and age when resources are scarce, student grades are failing, here we have teachers deciding unilaterally to put their needs ahead of the students.

But you won't see one liberal on here defending that...

Today is a sad day for organized labor. Its just what the "job creators" want less pay, less benefits and more hours. With the attitude of if you don't like tough $hit find another job. I'm so lucky I self-employed and I my only employee.

TomasGrande

Jim-

America was NOT built on the shoulders of government or unions. It was built on the shoulders of industry. Steel, oil, auto, energy, manufacturing were all the drivers that created the strongest and most envied economy in history

Auto workers UNION.

Steel workers UNION.

Electrical workers UNION.

Pipe fitters UNION.

The list goes on and on.

Sorry Jim, but UNIONS built America

Good God, another “You didn’t build that” bobble head!

So, Tomas, tell me when was the UAW started? It was in 1935 wasn’t it? By then Ford and GM already had millions of cars on the roads.

Sorry Tomas, but industry built America.

So, Tomas, tell me when was the United Steelworkers Union started? It was in 1942 wasn’t it? By then steel bridges were spanning rivers and skyscrapers were reaching for the skies.

Sorry Tomas, but industry built America.

The list goes on and on.

Now, if you believe unions built America, tell me what do they produce? How much do they add to our GDP? How many exports are they responsible for?

They produce nothing, they add nothing to our GDP and they export nothing.

Nice try Spanky, try to keep up.

To all Union supporters:

It's not 1910. We have laws that have addressed all the issues that Unions sought to remedy. All that's left to fight for is to protect lazy old workers from getting fired.

BTW...worked in a union warehouse when I was younger - old guys did NOTHING. It was a graveyard shift and many senior workers disappeared to go sleep somewhere while the younger people busted their asses covering for them. It was the most dysfunctional place I ever saw.

Solutions: Why do you have your panties all in a wad? Nobody has taken away the right to HAVE a union!! Now people have the right to decide WHETHER to join a union or not. And if the unions are SO great won't everybody STILL flock to unions? If employers are actually taking advantage of workers then won't they STILL join the union?

The ONLY reason you could reasonably get upset and bent out of shape is if you think the ONLY reason someone would join a union is because the union thugs FORCE them to join a union or get their kneecaps broke. And we all know THAT can't be the case!!

So this decision should have NO affect on union membership - right? Won't everybody STILL see how great the union is and even if given the CHOICE would happily run to the loving arms of the union?

So why are you upset? If unions are SO great they shouldn't lose ANY union members!! I guess we will have to see:)

OK Liberals/Progressives.

Your incessant and pedestrian whining about how your fragile little psyche is constantly damaged by the mean, nasty, evil, corporate bogeyman is getting a little tedious to listen too. If you’re so vulnerable, so delicate, there’s only one logical solution to your problems.

TAKE OVER ALL THE FORBES 2,000 INDUSTRIES AND MAKE THEM THE SHANGRI-LA YOU SO REVERE.

1. Go to business school for 4-8 years; learn about accounting, economics, human resources, management, payrolls, benefits, ethics, inventory and a few hundred other aspects of running a business. Especially a Forbe’s 2,000 business. These are the root of all evil in your self-pity world.

2. Now, after accumulating over $200,000 in student loans, go get a real job. Work your way up the corporate ladder based on merit rather than tenure. This will be an unknown accomplishment for you but you’ll pick it up quickly I’m sure. You have such superior intellect as compared to the rest of the world, right?

3. Once you achieve your position as CEO or president of the company refuse to accept any more than $1 dollar a year in salary than your highest paid employee. No perks, no stock options, no bonuses and no golden parachutes because you know these are all the root of capitalisms failure.

4. Now, do not allow your company to make ANY profits because as you all so proudly proclaim, profits are bad. Tell any investors and shareholders that they will most likely lose money if they invest in your company because that’s the cause of all the world’s problems, greed.

5. Let the unions dictate all your wages, benefits and pensions because unions only care about the “little guy”. We know the unions would never use any of the rank-and-files money for anything political or imprudent like that, right?

6. Let the EPA, environmentalists and other happy groups determine how, where and when you can produce your product. They, of course, are only concerned with protecting lizards, smelt, turtles, trees and other cute things, right?

7. Oh, and make sure you tell Barrack Hussein you are willing to pay much more in taxes to help all those who don’t want to work. It’s a free country and it’s your responsibility to support them even though they can work but just don’t want to. It’s only fair. RIGHT?

See how easy it is? Seven (7) simple steps. This is all you Liberal Progressives have to do to create the utopia of social and economic justice for the collective.

Good Luck! ! ! !

topane: The issue isn't really whether we have unions or not; it's global competition. Unionized workers just can't compete with China. Protecting our markets would go a long way towards stopping the trend towards temp employees.

40 hours work week = Union

Lunch break = Union

Maternity Leave = Union

Vaction = Union

Healthcare = Union

Livable wage = Union

i get all those too and im not in a *gasp* union. How say Ye.

this president is all about control!! he gets nervous if people want to think for themselves.. hes all about squandering jobs .. he may take us off the fiscal cliff because he is arrogant then all our taxes go up.. but he hass the gall to tell our govenor he does not agree with right to work!! give me a break bravo gov. Snyder for finally sticking up for Michigan and REAL job growth..listen up unions Michigan needs to be competitive with other states stop being so GREEDY and only thinking of your wallets!!!!

I was just noticing the picture on the home page and there were lines of liberal protesters with tape over their mouths. Is there somewhere I can help contribute and buy more tape? What a blessing it would be if we could get tape over the mouths of EVERY liberal in this country. Now THAT would be utopia!!

Jim-

They produce nothing, they add nothing to our GDP and they export nothing

Good lord. Another paid Koch Brother troll.

Keep advocating lower wages and poor working conditions, Jim.

Your hatred for unions comes directly from the kool-aid swill Rush and Faux have been feeding you.

Glad to see you are continuing to support economic policies that make the wealthy - wealthier and the poor - poorer.

No need for the constitution anymore, eh Jim?

Forget "We the People", its all about the Rich and the Corporations screwing the little guy and gals in order for them to get richer.

"Corporations are People, my Friends", because People, are now slaves.

Salud

Pro-

What a blessing it would be if we could get tape over the mouths of EVERY liberal in this country. Now THAT would be utopia!!

Or, you could just give them a bar of soap and lead them to the "showers".

Nice to see you keep putting down people standing up for Freedom and their Rights.

Wouldn't expect anything different from a Republican.

Salud

Tomas: Interestingly you suggest I am putting down people standing up for Freedom and their Rights. But don't you have it backwards? This now ALLOWS the people of Michigan to have the FREEDOM to decide what they think is in THEIR best interests!! NOBODY is telling these people they CAN'T join a union but don't they have the RIGHT to make that decision?

So you see you contradicted yourself. You suggest I was putting down the people standing up for Freedom and their Rights but ACTUALLY I was putting down the people trying to TAKE AWAY the Freedom and Right to decide for themselves what is in their best interest. Why are you SO against people making decisions for themselves? I thought the Democrat party WAS the "party of choice"? I guess not.........

This is not good for America, time to dump the GOP !

All they care about is the Super Rich !

Obviously, the Dems missed the memo on Rhetoric after the Gabrielle Giffords shooting.

"There will be blood, there will be repercussions," State Democratic Rep. Douglas Geiss, speaking on the House floor on Tuesday, warned ahead of the votes.

TomasGrande

It’s amusing to read your cute little talking points about the evil trolls and those mean, nasty, spooky Koch brothers. You have no idea what you’re talking about but that never stops you Libbies from just blathering on. If you did you’d know they’re actually Libertarians much more than they’re Republicans. But that wouldn't fit into the talking points you've been told to memorize would it?

Why are you Liberals/Progressives so content to just be middle class? Why do you allow Barrack Hussein to minimize and limit your accomplishments to just being mediocre? Why are you so afraid to take a chance, take a risk in life and try to be more than just Joe-Lunch-Box? Haven’t you ever aspired to be more, to be better, to be wealthier? It must be so difficult going through life with such low self-esteem, no ambition and fear of failing.

You see, that’s where you limp-wristed Liberals/Progressives differ so much from Conservatives and other real Americans. Yes Tomas, we do support economic policies that make you wealthy, and if you are wealthy you can become wealthier. We will support you when you succeed but more importantly we will also support you if you fail. We are not afraid of failure because, contrary to your convoluted belief that no one should fail and we should all be equal, we understand that failure is part of success. If our children don’t win their T-ball league we don’t expect them to get a symbolic trophy just because they tried. Their ego’s aren’t as fragile as you bleeding heart Liberals are.

Speaking of Constitutions, what do you Liberals/Progressives care about it? You’ve been trampling and spitting on it for a century with your dysfunctional and unsustainable social and economic justice for the collective nonsense. Your boy-toy Barrack Hussein openly admits he doesn’t believe the Constitution is a “Charter of Negative Liberties”. He and your party have shown your disdain for the Constitution, Federalism and our Republic. Hell, most of you knuckle-draggers think we’re a Democracy, there is no intelligent explanation for that.

Like I stated in my previous post, if you don’t like how our corporations are managed, take them over and run them in the Utopian fashion you so wish for. Of course you Libbies won’t, you expect someone else to do it for you and you just sit around all day and complain that everyone isn’t working hard enough to give you all the things you want.

Remember Tomas, America offers equal opportunity, not equal outcomes.

Greed isn’t someone wanting to keep more of what they earn, its people demanding a greater share of money that someone else has earned.

Salad

Great post Jim!! Well done!! I know it will go over the head of most liberals on here, but it was a great read!

Pro-

Tomas: Interestingly you suggest I am putting down people standing up for Freedom and their Rights. But don't you have it backwards?

Bravo!

Beautiful Karl Rove circular argument.

But, No.

Pro, lets call a truce.

In my opinion, the working class have been getting screwed for 30 years.

In my own 35 years of working experience, I have never witnessed such hatred for unions, and I think the non-union supporters are advocating ecomomic policies that screw the middle class.

Salud

Wow, Right to work for less, what's next import Chinese workers !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jim-

Why are you Liberals/Progressives so content to just be middle class? Why do you allow Barrack Hussein to minimize and limit your accomplishments to just being mediocre? Why are you so afraid to take a chance, take a risk in life and try to be more than just Joe-Lunch-Box? Haven’t you ever aspired to be more, to be better, to be wealthier? It must be so difficult going through life with such low self-esteem, no ambition and fear of failing

Quite frankly, your perception of me, and other Democrats, and what we believe in and stand for, is truly frightining and incradibly naive.

All due respect, but you really don't know anything about Democrats. All your pre-concieved notions i.e. "limp wristed", lazy, is all a lie.

Yes Jim, somewhere, somebody TOLD you what Democrats are, and you swallowed it whole because you like thinking Democrats are the problem.

In reality, it is you that has many psychological disorders.

You and your friends have quite the elitist and self-righteous mocking attitude that normal people find offensive and in all honesty, associate with rich, preppy, spoiled brats who have had everything handing to them their whole lives.

You're a bully, and you need to put people down to make yourself feel worthy.

Sorry Jim, but I like all Democrats represent most of America, and we are hard working, God Loving, constitutional supporting Americans who don't like being taken for a ride by some fast-talking charlatan.

Sorry you can't accept that.

I highly recommend you seek professional help.

Salud, or as you mockingly say, Salad.

Patriotic American U.S.A.

Wow, Right to work for less, what's next import Chinese workers !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hmmmmm, I sure hope not. But you may want to ask Barrack Husseins "Jobs Czar", he seems to have quite the affection for China.

The chairman of the President Barack Obama's Council on Jobs and Competitiveness, Jeffrey Immelt, the CEO of GE, praised China this morning on CBS:

"China is changing," said CBS host Charlie Rose. "It may be being stabilized as we speak. What does that mean for China and what does it mean for the United States? Should it change expectations?"

"It is good for China," said Immelt. "To a certain extent, Charlie, 11 percent is unsustainable. You end up getting too much stimulus or a misallocation of resources. They are much better off working on a more consumer-based economy, less dependent on exports. The one thing that actually works, state run communism a bit– may not be your cup of tea, but their government works." 12/10/2012

Kinda scarey ain't it? Our own jobs czar promoting communism. He even got the cute little "may not be your cup of tea", pun in there.

You Libbies must be so proud of Barracks Job Czar.

ProBusiness, What planet are you from, companies cannot lower wages, you wanna bet?? there are different ways they do it.

(1) fire you then hire you back at a much lower pay

(2) bring in tempts, pay them no benefits

(3) change your job classification to a lower pay rate, you are still doing the same job, only with a different title

(4) decrease your healthcare package- more money out-of- pocket the same as lower pay

Pro, you cite market wages, but that is for the office workers only, out on the shop floor is another world, there is no such thing as fair wages.

There is an unwritten rule when working in a factory, never discuss your salary because you will get your co-worker mad if he finds out you make more money than he does, or you will get mad if you find out he makes more. There is no solid payline.

My job title was Heavy equipment operator, I was given the option, except a title change to Hi-Lo Driver at lower pay, or they would have to let me go, I still had to do the same job only my title would change, I left. and you said companies can't lower pay, you wanna bet??

Tomas,

I've read your responses back to Jim and can only say that it is you that is in need of professional help. Where in his response is he a bully? Yon on the other hand use phrases like equate Jim as having psychological disorders. I've seen the responses from the most liberal posters on this board and have seen outrageous claims about every action a Republican does but when a Democrat does something equally outrageous, I see it's defended like it's owed to them. Democrats like to brag about Obama going to Harvard, but yet isn't that one of the most rich, preppy, spoiled colleges around that produce elitist and self-righteous graduates? Surely you can see that Obama has been of that character. He hasn't worked a real job, yet somehow claims that he understands the struggles of the middle class. If people buy that, then perhaps they are not that intelligent as left would like to see themselves.

I thought liberals were in support of individual rights!?!? Or, is it only the right to choose regarding abortions? Against the right for individuals to choose to belong to a union or not. Against a parent's right to educate their child in a different school district. Either you are for individual rights or you're not.

NOW: the unions will be forced to actually earn their membership. The will have to go to each and every employee and prove to the employees that they are better off if the union represents them. And they will have to be cost effective to do that. If the union gets you an extra $1.00/hour, but union dues are $1.50, there is no point in joining the union.

The unions will have to bargain with the employers to make sure that their members get a better deal than non-members. They really will have to represent the workers, not just their own interests. There will still be many "union shops," just as there were in the days before the law allowed the unions to require membership.

If pay rates are reduced, it will be because the unions have not been doing the job they are paid to do.

The dems are only concerned about the money the unions provide for their elections, nothing more. I live in a right to work state (Texas) and we have unions and they bargain. The only thing they can't do is force everyone to participate and that's a good thing. If I worked for a union shop, I would not want my money going to support obama and crew and that is what happens to a lot of the money unions collect. Michigan is better off with the new law. What's sad is that many of the people who were shouting out there weren't even from Michigan. If unions were what the people wanted, they wouldn't have needed, or even wanted, outsiders involved in their business.

This law has nothing to do a worker's right to choose whether to join a union or not. It's all about removing collective bargaining from the equation.

The unions in Michigan and the rest of the rust belt made many very extreme concessions to help save the auto industry. Sure, it was in their own interest to do so, but they did it.

What this law comes down to is that employers won't be forced to deal with unions any more. Now, they'll be able bring payscales down across the board because there won't be a body in place to negotiate wages any more.

Faux News and gasbags like Rush and Hannity are spewing the party line that this is about a worker's choice. Pure nonsense. There's nothing wrong with making all workers belong to the organization that represents them.

A lawyer must belong to the ABA to practice law. A doctor must belong to the AMA. A dentist must belong to the ADA. Yet I don't hear Rush and Sean calling for the abolition of these labor organizations. Could it be that they've got big dollar lobbyists working for them on the Hill spreading "campaign contributions" around?

As one of the self-satisfied RWNJs posted, greed is not wanting more of some one else's hard-earned money, it's squeezing every last penny out of record earnings and paying out obscene CEO bonuses and stockholder dividends while the middle class workers who helped you make those record profits are expected to produce more every day while earning less every year.

Tomas, don't expend a lot of energy debating these guys. They're the gullible target audience for Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh. They believe that the Koch Brothers are "Libertarians", which is code for right wingers that don't necessarily get their marching orders from the RNC. But they can't explain why those "Libertarians" pumped hundreds of millions of dollars into campaigns for wide-eyed, slackjawed Tea Bagger hllbillies all around the country, can they?

Not all doctors belong to the AMA and not all dentists belong to the ADA. However, they are all required to be licensed in the state they are practicing.

WARNING!

I'm in my 80s and I can tell you that while unions need as much fixing as our government, doing without either of them will make us all very sorry.

I was there in person when unionism began to take hold and before that the working class had a miserable life chained to the wheels of industry like slaves.

We already see the continuous decline in worker's pay while the Corporation CEOs and the top brass make millions and even billions.

Corporate America has done fine over the last 50 years. What have they to complain about? Our trade policies stink and set us up to have to compete with slave labor instead of doing like we said we would before most of you were born. The plan was to put tarrifs on imports from low wage countries which would protect our way of life and actually improve that of other nations.

If corporate American thinks people used to our kind of freedom and life style will settle for the crap they are forcing us to accept they will get yet another surprise in 2014 when we get rid of plenty Republicans that are kiss asses for corporate pigs at the trough. Where the Fock are the Conservatives?

How many of you can remember before unions when child labor was going on and people had to work 16 hours a day and not even get by?

It is not the working people that cause the recessions and depressions, it is the hogs that can't get enough that destroy the balance in the economy. I ASK YOU, WHO WILL HAVE ANY MONEY TO BUY THE GOODS THE RICH GUYS HAVE TO SELL IF THE CONSUMERS ARE DIRT POOR? Anybody have an answer?

As to overspending: Why in hell are we in a series of endless wars? Why are we spending heavy on weapons that won't do sh!t against terrorists? I'll tell you why, because it's a scam to relieve us of our money.

I could go on but PLEASE trust me that has seen it live and in color, without unions and a people's government, we will be chained to the wheels of industry and owe everything and own nothing.

You're right, Dave. They don't all belong to the national organizations. But the do all belong to one kind of professional association or another, all of which employ lobbyists to further their political goals.

Who does the average worker have representing them?

Yet everyone on the right feels a deep burning need to criticize unions for political activity. Why are they so bothered by a movement representing the American worker?

Rockefeller, Carnegie, Ford et al would have been abject failures without workers to run their mills, refineries, and factories. Should only the men at the top have had a say? Doesn't sound very American to me.

Mike from AZ

The unions in Michigan and the rest of the rust belt made many very extreme concessions to help save the auto industry.

They didn’t save the auto industry. They saved Chrysler and GM, who by all rights should have been allowed to just go through the normal legal bankruptcy process as Mitt Romney stated. The rest of the “auto industry”, Ford, Toyota, Volkswagen, Mercedes, BMW and all the other companies would have survived as the bankruptcy proceeded. Remember, GM still owes us $43 billion dollars and, hell, we saved Chrysler and then sold it to the Italians, now they benefit from any profits. That was brilliant wasn't it?

A doctor must belong to the AMA.

ROTFLMAO!!!!

Obviously you have no idea what you’re talking about. Less than 29% of doctors belong to the AMA, it’s just another scam organization like the goonions who want you to believe you have no value of your own and you need them to care for you and negotiate your career.

greed is not wanting more of some one else's hard-earned money, it's squeezing every last penny out of record earnings and paying out obscene CEO bonuses and stockholder dividends while the middle class workers who helped you make those record profits are expected to produce more every day while earning less every year.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

Now, now Mikey, your typical Liberal/Progressive rage, anger, hate, bias, bigotry, racism and hypocrisy is showing. Yes, all the middle-class Republicans just can’t wait to pay “out obscene CEO bonuses and stockholder dividends” while they just happily produce more every day.

Mikey, be honest, how dark and scary is that world of Liberalism/Progressivism you live in? Do you walk around looking over your shoulder often to make sure the latest contrived bogeyman isn’t following you around again? Isn’t it embarrassing living in your delusional world of conspiracies by the big, mean, spooky, rich, hob-goblins? Or those real scary people like Ann Coulter, Rush, the Koch Brothers, the Wright Brothers and Big Bird.

LMAO!!!!!

Of course you have no shame or self-respect left in your life after your contemptible parents, peers and teachers indoctrinated you to the point of fear. Just because you have no discernible skills that you can negotiate wages on doesn’t mean most others don’t. Like I’ve said before, this “inequality” you Limp-wristed Libbies have been projecting so long is your responsibility to fix. You’ve had decades of time to go to school, get a real degree in business administration, climb the corporate ladder for 20-30 years, become CEO’s of the big mean, nasty, corporations and redistribute all that money in your social and economic justice manner.

Now don’t worry, we don’t really expect you incapable Libbies to do anything that responsible in your lives, it would require ability, ambition and pride, we know you have all been stripped of these virtues by the Progressive mentality of dependence.

So you big-forehead, unibrow, mouth-breathing, knuckle-dragging, bobbleheads need to just accept your incompetence and let us real Americans get our great Republic back in order. Once we fix the 100 years of damage your redistributionist nonsense for the collective has caused we’ll make sure we get all you little Libbies some nice repetitive mundane jobs so you can at least feel like functional people again.

We’ll try to be “fair” and keep it all on a “level playing field” and make sure you get a “living wage”.

Will that work for ya, Spanky?

Listen a$$hole- you know nothing about me and even less about my parents.

I do hold a degree in Business Administration, and I've been working in manufacturing management for close to 3 decades.

I've seen the glad-handing political used car salesmen that rise to the upper levels of corporations and don't have any desire to reach those heights. I quit climbing the corporate ladder by choice so I could spend my days with real people and real Americans, not the white shoe country club types that you seem to worship so desperately.

Just because you are the first in your family to graduate from 8th grade and now can compose semi-literate posts on your laptop in your mom's basement doesn't mean you have any right to talk down to anyone.

You ignorant boob- we don't live in a republic. We live in a democratic republic, which is something I'm sure I could never make you understand. Even the Romans (who ran an actual Republic) understood the importance of the voice of the common people.

I've wasted enough time on you. Go back to your dungeons and dragons game.

@Mike from Az: I don't know the facts, but for the sake of moving the discussion along, I will concede that it is plausible that the majority of all doctors, dentists and lawyers belong to some professional organization that employs lobbyists. One small significant point that I want to make...they all have the individual right to choose if they want to belong to an organization or not.

Right to choose shouldn't just apply to contraceptives and abortions.

Not lawyers, Dave. Their license is controlled by the bar association.

Mike from AZ

You're right, Dave. They don't all belong to the national organizations. But the do all belong to one kind of professional association or another, all of which employ lobbyists to further their political goals.

WOW!!!!

You just can't stop the incessant whining can you Mike? Do you honestly believe that all Republicans or Conservatives belong to "one kind of professional association or another"?

More importantly, do you actually believe everybody needs some magical "third party" to do all their negotiations and arrange their lives for them? I guess when you've been so indoctrinated into believing the government must do everything, from raising your children to caring for your geriatric parents, the emotions must be overwhelming.

Memo to Mike: Not everyone in the world needs someone to hold their hand through life. But then again, as our criminal government Public Education system graduates illiterates, I guess it's easy to understand your confusion.

Yet everyone on the right feels a deep burning need to criticize unions for political activity. Why are they so bothered by a movement representing the American worker?

We're bothered Mike, because your coveted goonions have done nothing for the "American worker" for decades. Other than take your union dues and redistribute them to their cronies in the public and private sectors.

Have your wages gone up significantly in the past 20 years? Other than the FMLA of 1993 have the goonions added any other holidays or days off to the work-year? Have your benefits been significantly improved? Have you been guaranteed job security for any length of time?

If not, why not?

I have and I have never been a member of a goonion. And I saved all those union dues you have been giving away willingly.

Also, if it wasn't for Rockefeller, Carnegie, Ford, Edison, Tesla, McCormick and thousands of others your cherished "workers" would still be living on farms, riding in a horse and buggy, reading by candle-light and dreaming of flying.

These are the genius that have allowed unlimited travel, global communication, flight, the internet and thousands of other inventions that make up the world as we see it today. These are the men that brought us out of an agrarian society and created a level of commerce unseen in history. These men are what cause todays and tomorrows entrepreneurs to excel to even greater success.

Yes, workers are necessary, but without the genius of what you dependent masses like to call the "Robber Barons", we wouldn't be much further than sending telegraphs to each other and marvelling at indoor plumbing.

Michigan enacts right-to-work law

By Andre Damon and Jerry White

12 December 2012

Michigan Republican Governor Rick Snyder signed “right-to-work” legislation into law Tuesday evening. Michigan, the birthplace of the United Auto Workers 75 years ago and one of the most heavily unionized states in the country, becomes the 24th state in the US to adopt the anti-worker measure.

The law, when it takes effect in April, will bar collective bargaining agreements that require workers to pay union dues or fees as a condition of employment. In contrast to its misleading name, the measure is aimed at undermining collective resistance by workers to attacks on jobs, living standards and working conditions. In states with such laws, workers on average earn $1,500 less in annual wages and have fewer benefits.

The passage of the bill by the Republican-controlled state legislature and the inability of the UAW and other unions to mount any serious opposition reflect both the political bankruptcy of these organizations and the erosion of any genuine mass base of support among workers for them. The UAW and the rest of the official unions are justifiably held in contempt by most workers, after more than three decades in which they have systematically betrayed every struggle and collaborated with the employers in the shutdown of factories and the imposition of mass layoffs and one round of wage and benefit cuts after another.

These organizations, notwithstanding their investment portfolios and armies of overpaid officials, have been exposed as Potemkin villages, which exist entirely at the pleasure of the ruling class. Once a section of the corporate-controlled political establishment withdraws its support and decides to do without the services of the unions in suppressing the class struggle, they are helpless.

The last thing the unions want, and what they fear above all, is a genuine movement of the working class against the attacks of big business and both of its political parties. Tied to the corporations by a thousand strings, they have based themselves for decades on corporatist union-management committees and slush funds. They have virtually abolished strikes, devoting their energies to blocking any collective struggle by workers. They are viscerally hostile to the workers they nominally represent…

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/dec2012/mich-d12.shtml

Mike from AZ

Ahhhhhhh yes Mikey, nothing pleases me more than to see a little limp-wristed Libbies alleged brain exploding in your typical rage, anger and racist braggadocio.

Yeah, all you wannabe Libbies have a “Business Administration” degree. From” Idon’trememberwhere “ university. And of course you all “quit” climbing the corporate ladder to pursue your more self-satisfying hedonistic needs hanging out on Newsvine.

So, tell me Mike, who is supposed to fix all these complaints you and your narrow-minded cabal have about the world as we know it? Who is going to fix all this inequality, wage disparity, unfairness, unlevel playing fields, living wage and “glad-handing” you all sit here day after day and complain about?

You’re obviously too busy spending your days with real people and real Americans, so I assume you’re not interested, right? Not that any of us would even imagine any of you little Libbies doing anything to fix any of the problems you and your ideology created. You’re all very capable of creating one crisis after another with chaos being your main contribution for a century under the guise of Progressivism, but you can’t come up with any solutions other than your dysfunctional social and economic justice and redistribution of the successful to your incompetence.

You see the problem Mike? There’s always an excuse from you alleged educated “business administration” phonies. Instead of working your way up to the top of the ladder, you prefer that someone else do it for you, because you’re hangin’ out with the “real” people. You’re a phony Mike. You’re no more a businessman than I’m the Queen of England. Even if you are, you’re a coward just like most Liberals/Progressives. You don’t want to sacrifice your precious time or effort to fix the problems and indiscretions of the world, you want me or someone else to do it the way you want it done.

Guess what Mikey? It ain’t gonna happen.

Get off your little wannabe a$$, get a real job, make a difference in the world or do what you Libbies do the best, nothing.

By the way, we are a Federal Constitutional Republic with a Representative Democracy. I know you have no idea what that means when you start telling me the Romans “ran an actual Republic”. And yes, you wouldn’t ever make me understand what a “democratic republic” is, because the two forms of government—a Republic and a Democracy—are not only dissimilar, they’re antithetical. I’m sure you know what the difference between a form of government versus the type of government is, right? I doubt you do so we’ll just end this friendly little discussion here.

If I were you Mr. Business Administrator, I’d give up, you’re losing this discussion big time, and the funniest part is, you don’t even know it.

So, having said that, I’ll call it a night, gotta be to work about 9ish.

I find debating with you Libbies very similar to shadow boxing. After about 15 minutes 2 undeniable truths emerge.

1. I’m tired.

2. I always win.

Have a great night Sparky.

TomasGrande

Jim-

Keep advocating lower wages and poor working conditions, Jim.

Texas is a right to work state, I've been here for over 13 years and I've yet to work in a sweatshop, my lowest paying job was back in 1999 and that was 10.50 an hour working in a tobacco shop.

All this fight proves is that Obama and the Democrats feel people are too stupid to think for themselves. If joining a union is in everyone's best interest, then why do Democrats feel that need to be forced into it? If it is so great why wouldn't everyone be lining up to join? The Democratic Party is nothing but lemmings, just a bunch of followers incapable of thinking for themselves.

So many clowns on here saying RTW laws take away rights of the worker...

These laws allow people to get a job without HAVING to join a union, therefore GIVING a worker rights...

Pull your heads out people....the air is cleaner outside the anus...

Why no mention of the union thugs that punched a reporter and tore down a tent and the thugs had to be pepper sprayed. Probably because the reporter was from Fox therefore a conservative. Had it been a liberal reporter being beaten up by a Tea Party protest it would be front and center 24/7. But that doesn't fit into the CBS, NBC, ABC agenda of keeping their libbies in the dark. So violence and threats are ok as long as it's from the left. HYPOCRITES! Hey JimSpence and Pro -- excellent reads -- I'll be laughing all day, thank you for your well thought out and humorous thoughts!

If all these people are worried about getting FIRED from their work, and or possible reduce pay... Suggestion to all..Start your own business to succeed in your grand scheme of being rich..Wait that goes against the union concept, as they will need to pay people more to..Share the wealth dare I say. Wow! what a concept, yet wait this was what our forefathers suggested years ago.

People that disagree with this concept, please stand in line so others may work for you. Remember this is a free country to do as you wish, be it Poor, or Rich. and also Middle class isn't union anymore, just wanted to remind those that feel that all Middle class is union only from the Union Trumpeters, cause I know none of them speak for me.

Hey Libs-

Please explain why you so vehmently support a womans "right" to choose to kill her unborn baby but do not support a workers right to join, or not join, a union. Me confused with the liberal logic once again....

Trusted

Did they run the elections saying they were going to destroy workers rights? Hell no, they do it out of the kindness of their Corporate donors pocketbooks

The BLS statistics show that worker wages actually increased faster for non-union employees than for union employes in right to work states.

Aside from the increase in wages, and the fact that employers move to right to work states, the only difference between a right to work state and non-right to work states is that the employees don't have to contribute to the union or even join the union.

AG99

The unions only can result in higher benefits, higher wages, better than federal worker protection. The negative is they fail to grasp the real costs for businesses to operate and can make their workers lose their jobs, such as Hostess.

73% of the jobs shipped over seas are union jobs. Only 13% of non union jobs get shipped overseas.

Tomas

Home of the new American soup line.

Michigan has been a growing soup line for years. Detroit has plowed blocks of abandoned homes. Becoming a right to work will help more people have jobs.

Jim Spence.

E AMERICAN WORKER IS FINALLY BEING FREED FROM THE CHAINS OF UNION COERCION AND CORRUPTION!

Now if we can free people from the twisting of facts by the Progressives!

Tomas

The steel industry, and auto industry were built before unionization. Now fast forward to today, GM was bankrupt and expected to become insolvent again in the last couple of years. Part of the problem was GM giving far to much to the unions in hopes of destroying Ford, Chrysler, and AMC.

Part of the reason Steel companies went bust was they gave the Unions the choice of accepting a hold on wage increases to add government mandated anti pollution equipment or more wages. The Steel companies that the unions took the wage increases were gone in 4 years.

I know someone who was laid off from the Ford City PPG plant. These guys had great wages, but as competition was increasing and healthcare was starting to rise drastically, the company asked their employees, both management and labour to start paying for the health insurance. All plants except the Ford City plant accepted the change. The Ford City Plant was closed, and and many in the plants management were offered jobs at the remaining plants.

Clearly you know nothing about cause and effect.

Dotties girl,

Had it been a liberal reporter being beaten up by a Tea Party protest it would be front and center 24/7.

Or if didn't happen it would have been invented to have happened.

This really isn't about worker's rights or the middle class. It's all about the money the unions will no longer be able to give to the Democrat party and that is the only reason Obama is out there campaigning. Right To Work is actually Right not to have to give your hard earned money to political parties, candidates, and issues that you don't agree with.

Eric

3 out of 4 studies all university professors, show that the wages of right to work states increased, not decreased. Even the Bureau of Labour Statistic shows that the wages in right to work states increase.

6 - 8% is the wage difference that even the unions use in negotiations between northern and southern states, in a reasonable understanding that it costs more to live in northern states than southern states. Most right to work states, are southern states.

Patriotic America

Unions saved America from Slave Labor,

True, they certainly did. However, since the 1920's much of what they fought for has become federal law.

I think there still is a place for unions, but what unions must do is become more educated in economics, so that they are bargaining, they are reasonable with their demands so they don't drive jobs to China.

Why do I say this? 93% of union jobs are lost to China. Only 13% of non-union jobs are lost to China.

Just wonderin

My dad worked for a chemical plant. He was union and also a union shop steward. At first the Union did awesome things by increasing wages and benefits. But then, the union didn't know when to quit demanding. So, the unions went on strike one time for more wages and literally polluted product shipments to Japan because the company wouldn't cooperate with the union. Japan rejected the shipments and cancelled the contract causing the company to close that section of the plant and lay people off.

Then my brothers managed to get hired, but that lasted just about one year. For the new union contract the unions demanded large wage increases. The company told them that sales were down. That did not matter. The company finally said, okay, we will give you your requested increase but we have to cut jobs. The union took that offer and both of my brothers got a pink slip.

At it's peak the company employed 350 people. Today, that company is down to barely 100. If the Union realy cared about jobs, it would have backed off the first time the company offered a concession that meant losing union jobs.

Pro Business

A business CANNOT just lower wages. They must pay MARKET wages to be competitive.

Mostly this is true, but Not always. I have seen union deals that permitted older guys to keep their high wages, but new hires would start at much lower rates and not increase as quickly as the senior members.

Solutions

40 hour wor kweek - Federal law for years.

Maternity Leave - Federal law for years now.

Vacation - Federal and state laws now.

Healthcare - was originally offered only to key management. Then it was offered to employees, particularly skilled employees as an incentive to sign on. Then the Unions picked it up in the 60's. Since 1970, healthcare became an employer recommended source by the federal government. Now the ACA mandates health insurance for everyone.

Livable Wage - until recent history, yes, but today, the supply and demand of the special abilities (market driven now) is a bigger factor than unions.

The Biggest things the Union does today, is make firing bad employees impossible, provide a pension to members (they actually try to cheat some people out of those pensions), bargain for above average benefits, and be a source of politcal funds and muscle for the Democratic party.

Q22

old guys did NOTHING

Yup. My brother was a welder for a rail car building plant. The old guys would take the easy positions to weld and give the younger guy the most dangerous and difficult welds to do.

ToPane

(1) fire you then hire you back at a much lower pay

No, they lay you off when there is no work, and then hire people with less experience for less money when the work returns.

(2) bring in tempts, pay them no benefits

Yes, some do this, but clearly you don't understand the job market today. If a company is hiring Temporiaries today, it is because they have no expectation for the work load to continue. Coming soon is people's work week being dropped to less than 30 hours to avoid paying for ACA mandated benefits that the company could not afford. But, unknown to you, the employers are wanting to is end their handling of health care plans and give the money they could afford to the employees so they can buy their own plan. But, No, the ACA will fine them if they don't have a healthcare plan or purchase one that matches what the fed demands as a health care plan. Then, on top of that, there is a tax on employers of a "large" enough size to fund the ACA.

(3) change your job classification to a lower pay rate, you are still doing the same job, only with a different title

No legitimate employer does this. More often the employer will change your job classification so the good employee can continue to get pay raises and not leave.

(4) decrease your healthcare package- more money out-of- pocket the same as lower pay

ToPane, this was already done for years. Most Employers contribute about half of the cost of insurance. When they do this, they are not only saving themselves money, but also the employees. MOST employers only did this to lessen the impact of Health insurance increasing 20% a year. Now they are doing it because the ACA mandates were new 30% more than the previous year.

My wife's insurance was supposed to increase 29%. Her employer got a insurer recomendation to increase
co-pays on prescription drugs to bring the increase in premium down to 9%. This was done with her advanced knowledge, just like most employers do for their employees.

She and I both have worked for a variety of employers that had more than 25 employees. In those employers, employees got a choice of coverage and premium amounts that would be offered by the company. Most employees actually choose the lower cost plans with the higher deductibles and co-pays.

Dave

Liberals are only in support of individual rights that will gain them voting blocks. That is why they are so convoluted on what they support and don't support.

Dirp

What you will see is people leave the unions, and return if their wages and benefits become reduced. This is unlikely to happen. If the Employers can unload the unions, they can keep the benefits and wages lower than what the unions may demand but comparably higher considering the employees are not paying union dues.

In that sense, unions disappearing totally is not a good thing.

Mike Az

only 14% of all doctors belong to the AMA. The Far majority of the members are retired and/or those who are ideologs or Teach Medicine.

And Mike I have a business degree, but all this depends upon which management style you favor or if you are a believer in Keynsian Theory or not.

And Mike,

Kensian is a managed economic theory that fits the best with Marxist theory. The whole down fall of the theory is the thinking that people who can run an economy are smarter than the average people. Control economies fail worse than capitalist theories. The amusing thing is that no matter how much you try to replace capitalism, it still works inside any theory, just in the form of a black market.

DB Akron, you have no idea what the hell you're talking about, I am not talking about something I heard, I stated a fact! People where I worked were fired, the company called them 2 days later and offered them their jobs back at $5.00 an hour less.

Change workers job classification along with pay grade happens a lot, whether you believe it or not.

Our health insurance was only good at hospitals emergency room, you can be treated there but that's all.

The company brought in temps, went to court a won the right for tempts to vote to see if we wanted to keep the union, the temps were threaten by the temp service and voted no, 336 of us were fired, the place is now running full steam ahead with 3 shifts, all temps.

you can talk all that garbage to somebody that wasn't there and don't know, but don't run your BS at me because I do know and I was there.

The good old dogs are playing in Quicksand, 2014 the GOP Tea Loonies will lose everything !!!!!!

Good old dogs doesn't produce the initials GOP. And by the end of the next year the liberals will be running away, retreating in droves!

Does GOPigs fix your initials ??????????? Sir # 2.2 !!!

Wisconsin lost the Senate and gained grounds in the house due to their passing this legislation. Walker nearly got recalled, except a lot of citizens felt this wasn't the kind of law to recall a Governor. Wait till Walker is up for election again. I'll be he's toast.

Eric, Bet you $10,000.00 you are Right !!!!!!!!!!!

@Eric: I guess you failed to look at Wisonsin's 2012 state election results. Republicans control the state Assembly and the state Senate.

Elections have consequences libs!

Key words

Walker nearly got recalled,

And no, when his term is up and the state is in better shape, only then will be recalled. For ANOTHER term.

Looks like the Koch Busters got one over the people of Michigan, this is a big win for the 1% Mega Rich Folks, now they are Guaranteed their Lavish life Styles !!!!!!!!!!

• So let's see -- the Republican controlled Michigan legislature passed this bill in a lame duck secession, with NO debate allowed, NO hearings, NO outside testimony allowed and police guarding the doors of the state house. Yep -- this is the american way!!!

You have to love the endless hypocrisy of liberals. They claim elections have consequences in Washington, where in fact nothing changed. Same president, same Democrat controlled Senate, and same Republican controlled House. But in a state where the election did change control, you better not make any changes we liberals don't want. What happened to elections have consequences? The underlying truth is that liberals are afraid people might like the change, and that unions will lose money and not be able to donate as heavily to liberal candidates. Union membership is on the decline anyway, after all they have helped drive most union jobs overseas.

@ Charlie,

Sucks when your own methods get used against you huh?

Go cry me a river Timberlake...

ursula, your democrats spend more money than the republicans! So are you saying that the democrats are for the wealthy and not the working man? You know if the union had of stayed out of politics, and not spent their members money, mayb e this wouldn't have happened. Some union members, don't care for the democratic party that the union supports and the unions told them this is what we are doing with your money and if you don't like it, kiss off.

welcome to real hope and change. Take a good look Obama.

Squash the union....you mean by giving a person the right to decide whether to belong to a union or not....how exactly is that squashing the union?

All this does is level the playing field, of course the unions are against it they don't like having to do that, or compete which they can't do either.

Unions are bankrupting most industries and states and cities, it has to come to an end or things will get much worse.

Before my son joined the pipe-fitters union in Texas, he was a welder at a big non-union plant without a single raise in four years. Now he's steadily employed in his 3rd year of a 5-year apprenticeship program, classes two nights a week and on-the-job training towards a solid trade. I guess you can look at unions as the 'bad guys' for business, but they also give people an opportunity for a solid future. And yes, they encourage their members to vote democratic, but no one's forced to do so.

@unreal-3070801 Prove that democrats spend more than republicans. I dare you.

All you have to do is look at the growing welfare rolls and you will see where the Dems spend more and more and more just to secure the uninformed's votes.

Look at the big handout to the UAW through the GM/Chrysler bailout!

The GOP Tea Wackos are destroying our Country so their 1% buddies can control Americas work force !!!!!!!!!!!!!

See, another place the dems are spending. On idiot bloggers like PA USA

Did someone hit you in the head with a Crowbar ?????????????????

Are you "OK" ????????????????????????

@unreal, and red states use more government benefits than blue states.

This was all purely political and there will be a backlash. Wait for 2014.

@unreal-3070801

Spend more money than republicans. Did you even know Bush was president for 8 years and during those years we had record spending and record unemployment.

Where the F-IN where you when George Bush Jr was in Office for 8 years and came in there with a surplus from Bill Clinton.

To much fox news you betcha

OMG using the BS "Clinton left a surplus" thing again???? You are not convincing anyone. It was all "creative accounting". Read up. And lib/progressives are the educated ones.

MIAW: You wear yoru ignorance like a true Koch Sucker.

jcngam

do you have something stuck in your throat? Spit it out, it probably doesn't belong to you.

Corporate thugs, watch your party lose seats in the next election.

Studies show that right to work states have 6-8% lower wages.

unreal, it's probably just bad Tea, after he Spits it out he will be like a new man !!!!!!!!!

Eric,

Studies show that right to work states have 100% lower union dues.

This bill does not outlaw or bust unions, but it will greatly weaken them. In my opinion a person who doesn't pay dues to the union but grabs all of the benefits that the union affords them is a free rider. Perhaps a poor analogy but much like HCR mandates a person to have insurance in hopes of eliminating free riders, right to work laws is another GOP way to create free riders. The GOP knows that most people will catch a free ride, take the benefits and not contribute to the union. With fairness as a rule to get the union benefits people should have to pay their dues. In effect, union membership will diminish and therefore their ability to organize and grow will stall.

By the way, I keep reading the false impression that union dues are taken directly for political campaigns. That is not true there are union dues for general lobbying and separate (non mandatory) dues if people want to contribute to union Political action committees. All in all this bill is another way for the GOP to push and reward irresponsibility and free riders. Must be from the same people who want to kill Obama care and who refuse to get insurance. Those "self made men, completely independent types" whose idea of a health care plan is to just go to the emergency room when they are sick.

Michigan you may not like the outcome in the long run. Typically, decreasing the influence of unions goes hand in hand with lower pay for their members and for the work force in general. Lower pay for everyone can lead to less buying power, less sales tax and less ability for the state to handle its financial obligations. Another point, especially in weak financial times, employeers will pay what they think they can afford not what the market truly dictates. Their feeling is that they will pay not a fair wage based on experience and skill rather they will pay as little as possible. In their mind the employees should just be lucky to have a job.

As a side note I saw that the bill passed by 58 to 51 simple majority. Whether you like or dislike this bill, I wish the US Senate could pass things without the need for a super majority and filibuster nonsense.

Yellowdog-Mark D

"In my opinion a person who doesn't pay dues to the union but grabs all of the benefits that the union affords them is a free rider"

You bring up a very good point sir, like how 47% of people don't pay taxes but get entitlements and demonize the people that do pay their taxes and expect them to pay more and more.To be "FAIR" everyone should pay the same tax rate. My poor/middle income friends never once paid me a salary and benefits.

Triple D,

The 47% of americans who don't pay taxes account for those in poverty, those who are retired, those in the military and those who don't make enough to qualify for income tax rates. Now if your discussion wants to include Tax reform (outside of the flat tax) that is a discussion I am willing to take. However, the tired mantra that 47% pay no taxes and are merely takers is not true. The electorate surely didn't buy it. The 47% are paying their fair share. Those people pay sales tax, payroll taxes that go toward SS and Medicare.

Usually I would be happier to be talking to someone with Triple D's, but I digress.

I love how so many individuals are touting the 1% sitting high and mighty, except those who back the Union are Liberal/Democratic in nature, and lining the Unions pockets.... You're effectively giving your money to the 1% yourselves. And they're not operating a business! So hypocritical. Get over it. Your points are self-defeated.

The proposed laws are Union busting. Fool.

gary rath, which keep you from having choices...its their way or no way...we saw that with Hostess regardless of the management.

here, here.

Gary: You are wrong. This law is not union busting. This law is choice. Isn't it liberals that claim a person should have a "choice"? Except when it comes to education or working.

If unions are such a necessity than why are unions AGAINST choice? Give the worker the choice of whether to join the union or not. Since unions are SO good (as I keep hearing) and employers will simply take advantage of the worker if NOT in a union then the law should not make a difference. Everyone should still be flocking to the union begging to join. So if unions are so good a "choice" shouldn't matter - should it?

Pro-

I got to hand it to you Pro, you have picked up on the Hannity/Rush talking point in record time.

You are correct in that this doen't bust unions.

Yet.

This fight in Michigan has just begun.

Hypothetically speaking;

Joe has a NON-union widget shop that just opened on the Right side of the street. Everyone flocks to Joe to work for less pay because it's new and people want to work, but Joe can dictate the wages and benefits. Joe is able to produce his widgets cheaper, because he pays cheaper, and thus Joe's business thrives, and the Union Widget shop on the Left side of the street goes under.

As time goes by, workers at Joe's complain because their wages haven't gone up, but everything from food to gas to housing has.

Joe says sorry, but if you don't like it, there's the door, because Joe knows some other poor schmuck will work for him in a flash.

So you're right.

No union "Busting". Today, that is. But certainly in the not too distant future.

And thus begins process of ending the middle class and turning America into a two-class society.

It was like this in America BEFORE unions existed.

Why, for the love of god, do people want to be enslaved by the lowest bidder instead of being empowered and respected for getting an education and experience and getting paid what they are WORTH.

My question is, how was it that earlier in my life, Democrats AND Republicans worked side-by-side on union assembly lines and BOTH earned wages enough to raise families of 6, 8, even 10 kids; go on vacations, send their kids to colleges, and save for retirement but now, it's not acceptable?

In my opinon, the only thing that has changed is the demonization of unions BY Faux, Rush, etc, AND the greed of the Uber wealthy to keep all the money for themselves, instead of it being spread out amongst the Middle class like it use to.

Salud.

Like the Republican want women and gay men to have a choice right?

Dam you are dumb.

Mr. ProBusiness. Are you frickin' nuts? Employers don't give a crap about their employees. We're all expendable product to them. The unions brought fairness to the average American and upon their demise we will all be making third world country wages living in shacks. The rich don't give a crap about the rest of us and we need unions to keep the playing field level. My company is non-union and the only reason we have decent salaries is because of the standard set down by the unions. So take that in your free market and shove it.

TomasGrande - Very good rebuttal and example for ProBusiness.

ThomasGrande: If you open a "widget" business, doesn't it make sense for you to actually make a profit by lowering over-headi ncluding the costs involved in hiring and training employees? If you hire people at a certain wage, they agree to work at that wage. If this worker finds another job that pays a higher wage, they are free to go and take the higher paying job... this is an example of a free market. The employee also has a right to keep working at the lower wage and just complain about his or her lot in life. Or the "widget" employee could continue working at his job, attend night school and get a business degree, save their money, and bootstrap their own business startup to make a better and more unique "widget"...

Been there, done that.

You realize there was a time when there were no unions in America.

I believe Henry Ford wanted his employees to make a decent wage so they could aford to buy a Ford.

So, you are saying Americans are STUPID enough to purposefully want LOWER wages, POOR working conditions, CHILD labor laws, WORKING 7 DAYS a week laws, NO RiGHTS, NO UPWARD MOBILITY, NO chance at improving their future and their children's future?

Looks like the real THUGS are the anti-union, anti-middle class, anti-living wage Republicans.

Salud

oh yeah, America is just going to let people be abused by their employer because they are not union anymore...talk about scare tactics

thomasgrand, if you have a union, you deal with thugs, it's that simple. What worked in 1919 doesn't work today. Right now, the union is good for taking your money, kissing obama's ass and protecting the non productive employee's job.

it's called choice and its called democracy..you can still join the union if you want to .it's just not a closed shop so you can't be forced to.and if the unions can't convince workers to join that's just too bad for them....the citizens of Michigan voted for this...elections have consequences....hahaha.

Frankly the Unions failed when they associated themselves with organized crime. That connection is, by the way. still there.

I know a lot of the new hires that were shortchanged by the Union signing on to the two tier pay scale that say they will drop out of the union once this is in place.

Why pay union dues for getting less than half what the guy next to you gets paid for the same job?

Union has done nothing but screw them and then add insult to injury by forcing them to have to jion the union and pay dues!

unreal-

thomasgrand, if you have a union, you deal with thugs, it's that simple. What worked in 1919 doesn't work today. Right now, the union is good for taking your money, kissing obama's ass and protecting the non productive employee's job

"Thugs?"

LMAO

You do realize the term "Union Thugs" comes from Rush Limbaugh, Shawn Hannity, and Frank Luntz, don't you.

You do realize that term is use as a scare tactic created by and used by the Right Wing Media, don't you?

Yep, Looks like the Koch Brothers have their paid bloggers out in force today to help demonize the Labor Unions and create a Slave Labor society again here in America.

Cheap labor, no rights, no upward mobility.

Sounds like Philippines labor camps right here on American soil.

Goodbye Freedom.

Goodbye Middle Class.

Goodbye American Dream.

Say Hello to sweat shops.

Next, the Republicans will be advocating slave labor trade and the end of child labor laws.

Salud

You do realize the term "Union Thugs" comes from Rush Limbaugh, Shawn Hannity, and Frank Luntz, don't you.

You do realize that term is use as a scare tactic created by and used by the Right Wing Media, don't you?

Tomas, I just lost what little respect I had for you. Were you born last week or what? The term union thugs has been around for a heck of a lot longer than those which you point the finger at for coining it.

Um...who were the people that were ripping down/trampling tents in Michigan today? I would certainly use the term thug to describe that. Oh...but wait a minute...that was the tent for the group that is in favor of Right To Work...so that makes it okay right?

Tomas - The term Union Thug has been around long before Limbaugh and it is well earned. Ever since the major labor Unions aligned themselves with organized crime the name has been appropriate. They have often used (and still do) violence and intimidation to get their way. Not everyone in a union is a thug but many who represent unions are the very definition of a thug.

Tomas...Please stop speaking as if you are my Middle Class Stewart...

gary, obama may havea lot of power and is probably god like in your eyes, but he can't send troops to michigan, and I'm sure he would want to. How are you going to get the egg off your face, if Michigan begins to show growth?

Only the Governor of Michigan has that power. Over Michigan cities and communities.

the majority of the low income, low minimum wages and food stamp states are the right to work states and they are mostly red states....why is that?

Unreal, Growth is truly the question isn't it? However, I would recomend that you look at Wisconsin to see what has happened there. Our New Job growth is , or almost is the lowest in the country. And cronyism is coming back strong. I guess if you are a good ass kisser, this is your time. If you are an average worker, too bad. Lower wages, unsafe working conditions, yup, I'd say we lost big, and everybody is going to pay

So you want to abrogate the will of the people and democracy when you don't get your way..typical liberal,,,,love the system when it goes your way..try to resort to violence when you don't....Give it a try and you will see real blood in the streets and it may be yours

Yes Gary I'm sure that is what Hugo Chavez or Putin or Castro would do. Course there are some rules about using US troops on its own citizens........guess that wouldn't bother you.

the majority of the low income, low minimum wages and food stamp states are the right to work states and they are mostly red states....why is that?

And the broke states are mostly blue states....why is that?

Gary be careful what u ask for. You would look good wearing a turban and your wife in a jilbab and bowing to Allah

No, Obama and his idiots want to bring Gitmo here to the US. Nothing like putting a @!$%# ton of terrorists right on our own soil. But then again, this is the stupidity that Obama brings to the White House. SO Gary-are you so in love with your God Obama that you are ok with his ridiculous spending: $4 million for 17 days off, $115K for his kids spring break, sending millions over to Syria, endorisng Morsi's attempt at dictatorship and absolute power? I mean, really...what is it about this fool that you sheep are so in love with? Do you even realize he talks out of the left side of his mouth about how for the lower and middle classes he is and the rich and Republicans are evil? But then out of the right side, he spends like a super rich a**hole and makes no apologies for it. He has time to meet with some anti-American reject who acts like a moron for money but isnt considered with our economy, has made NO effort to bring justice to the victims of Benghazi and hasnt made any damn 'change' for anyone that he preached for to get re-elected. He wants to punish the wealthy and enslave the poor to the government so they depend on him for their food, shelter, insurance, etc. This isnt Republican scare tactics-its the damn truth and obvious to anyone who can see and hear.

harleybleswoman......I actually think they are mostly blue states that are the main welfare and food stamp states. I know that Texas is a RED state and our unemployment is some of the lowest in the nation. We do have quite a problem with illegal aliens in our school system that do tend to keep the GPA down, not because they are dumb but english is a second language.

Gary should be water-boarded.

the majority of the low income, low minimum wages and food stamp states are the right to work states and they are mostly red states....why is that?

Because they still have to pay the high prices for goods produced in the wage inflated, under producing unionized blue states to live.

Price a foreign car made here against a GM car of the same size and quality. You will see what exorbitant wages get you.

Q22... I guess it is because the "blue" states have to pay for the what the "red" states call entitlements, like defense spending and farm subsidies(paying farmers not to work).

spot on!

That says it ALL!

If it is going to strengthen the Union...why protest it?

John in battle creek, who gave the majority to the republicans in Michigan? was it non union members from texas, iowa, nebraska? No, it was the voters from michigan. So they won, you lost, grow up, get over it, or move to a new state that is closed shop!

Why the hell do unions always say the Right to Work for Less? No one is forcing you to work for less. The only people who will make less is the union bosses and representitives.

The referendum to add "closed shop" to the Michigan state constitution was soundly defeated by double digits in the most recent election.

The union's need to do a better job of stating their case to individual workers. They need to find out what resonates with the individual worker in order to increase their base. It's something they should have been doing for years.

It appears that John does not even know what the Bill says.

The GOP in Michigan had to do this under a lame duck session. They lost seats in the election and The Kochs weren't sure it would pass next year.

I grew up with my father and grandfather in a UNION my father even being a union steward for years. AS time progressed my father was promoted to management (thus doing away with him being a member of the union------union rule for this particular union). My father had already began to see how the unions and their greed was destroying the company he loved. He enjoyed his job and planned on retiring from there when time came. Unions make it impossible to get rid of bad employees and then the company has to hire more works to pick up the lousy works slack............then the new workers see that the lousy worker keeps drawing the same salary as them and keeps getting raises..............so the new workers start slacking too. Eventually no one is working and the company closes or has to file bankruptcy because the unions have asked for more than they have to give the employees. SOUNDS LIKE WHAT IS HAPPENING TO OUR ECONOMY. Everyone can not be a chief.

Michael

Yea

yes!!...people can see for themselves what really works........

Bill, are you ready to work for $8 an hour?

Bill, are you ready to purchase a $40,000 car/truck for only $30,000??

Gregor1956, if you don't like the salary then don't work there!

mhrjhn-

Gregor1956, if you don't like the salary then don't work there!

Yeh, Gregor.

Go work across the street at the competitor's 8 dollar an hour job!

Better yet, get a education loan for $60,000 and get a Master's degree. Then you can work across the street for 8 dollars an hour.

Because you're hard work and investing in yourself to better your economic situation means squat when all the 1% ers are having 8 dollar an hour jobs.

Sorry Gregor, but you are just a chump for the 1%ers.

(Hope you appreciate sarcasm).

Salud

Its call attracting talented workers as sucessful businesses need successful employees. I'm sure the competitor will pay this individual more if they think they can bring value to their company.

Debbie, is this the same democrats that ran out of their state, and stopped goverment, cause the didn't like the way things were going? Is this he same democrats that had a recall of Gov Walker and he survived? You are a work of art and a poor loser.

Debbie- Last I heard, Wisonsin employment numbers were better than the national average! I don't understand where you get your slanted facts from.

Debbie, it's always so refreshing to hear from someone who is on the ground floor and seeing first hand how these types of laws work. Unfortunately, all of the Obama haters can't see the forest for the trees and believe anything that comes out of Rush's mouth.

Elections have consequences and in Michigan you lost....go cry me a river

Also, Wisconsin never passed "right to work" legislation.

According to republicans in Michigan, they opted for proposing "right to work" legislation because many Michigan companies were leaving to Indiana, which recently passed "right to work" legislation.

If union's and union supporters firmly believe this is bad for the employees, then they need to do a better job of conveying that information to the individual employees. Earn each membership.

Hey unreal, did you try out for fire dept or police and couldn't cut it? You sound like a sorry sac my friend.

alechild, what network hasn't stated that the last election cost over 2 billion dollars and that, your god, spent more that Romney? Are you saying that all the networks are wrong.

has more to do with the nature of the work performed and supply and demand..your table doesn't prove your point at all.

What about the other 36 states? There are 24 "right-to-work" states so the country is divided pretty much even, yet you give an uneven amount of information...

The reason for right-to-work state laws is spending out of control. Compare average state debt per capita in right-to-work states versus non right-to-work states: $9,456 versus $16,486.

Why do you think Greece is having all of it's financial problems? When you don't have the money to pay for the benefits sacrifices have to be made.

Georgia is a right to work state.

@#17: Georgia, North Carolina and North Dakota are all "right to work" states. But, it is true, that the median income in states that are not "right to work" vs those that are "right to work", is higher. However, when you factor in cost of living, it negates the increased income.

Union workers and their leaders are communist. It's always evident because they want everyone to be equal.......except them. What's the story with that old fat f&%k in the AT&T hat last night. Poster child for useless.