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President Barack Obama on Wednesday suggested that some Republicans had begun to soften their opposition to increased tax rates on the wealthiest Americans, but sharply warned the GOP against looking to tie their budget fight to an upcoming debate over whether to increase the debt ceiling.
Speaking in Washington before a group of corporate leaders, the president suggested some rank-and-file GOP lawmakers might relent in opposing increased income tax rates for the wealthiest earners, meaning Washington is closer to an agreement on the fiscal cliff than principal negotiators' public comments might suggest.
“I think there's a recognition that maybe they can accept some rate increases as long as it's combined with serious entitlement reform and additional spending cuts. And if we can get the leadership on the Republican side to take that framework, to acknowledge that reality, then the numbers actually aren't that far apart,” Obama told members of the Business Roundtable this morning. “Another way of putting this is, we can probably solve this in about a week. It's not that tough. But we need that conceptual breakthrough that says we need to do a balanced plan; that's what's best for the economy; that's what the American people voted for; that's how we're going to get it done.”
Related - First Thoughts: Know when to hold'em, know when to fold'em
Talks toward resolving the fiscal cliff, the combination of automatic tax hikes and spending cuts set to take effect on Jan. 1, seem to have hit an impasse after House Republicans and Obama each offered countervailing proposals to address the looming combination.
In the ongoing fiscal cliff negotiations, some Republicans are starting to think the way forward is to give in to President Obama's demands. NBC's Mark Murray and Domenico Montanaro discuss.
The stalemate involves the question of whether tax rates are allowed to increase for the top earners. Republicans say they are willing to ask the wealthy to shoulder a larger share of the tax burden, but only through ending deductions and loopholes in the tax code.
"Now the revenues that we are putting on the table are going to come from, guess who? The rich," House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio, said Wednesday morning on Capitol Hill. "There are ways to limit deductions, close loopholes and have the same people pay more of their money to the federal government without raising tax rates, which we believe will harm our economy."
Obama, in his appearance shortly following Boehner's press conference, argued that closing those deductions would not raise the type of revenue needed to establish the "balanced" approach on which he campaigned. The president also said that the GOP plan would harm philanthropic and charitable giving.
Time Magazine's Nancy Gibbs, New York One's Errol Louis and MSNBC.com's Richard Wolffe join The Daily Rundown's Chuck Todd to talk about who would get the blame for going over the fiscal cliff and messaging on the cliff.
As the opposing sides race toward the end-of-December deadline, a New York Times report on Wednesday suggested that Republicans might turn, as a fallback position, to authorizing an extension of current tax rates for all but the wealthiest Americans (this was essentially the president's initial request of lawmakers following the election).
But the report also suggested that Republicans might then use an impending need to authorize more borrowing authority, a point at which the GOP might have more leverage, to extract the kinds of spending cuts and tax and entitlement reforms for which Republican leaders have pushed during this fall's fiscal cliff talks.
Recommended: Boehner's fiscal cliff offer under friendly fire from right
Referencing that report, the president sternly warned Republicans against tying another increase in the debt ceiling to a fiscal fight -- a scenario which would risk reigniting the debt talks during the summer of 2011, during which the government was brought to the brink of default due to partisan differences.
"I have to just tell you, that is a bad strategy for America, it's a bad strategy for our businesses, and it's not a game that I will play," Obama said.
Lawmakers on Capitol Hill are currently set to depart for their holiday recess, though Boehner said that he would remain in Washington, ready "at any moment" to sit down with Obama and negotiate.
Charles Dharapak / AP
President Barack Obama pauses as he speaks about the fiscal cliff at the Business Roundtable, an association of chief executive officers, in Washington, Wednesday, Dec. 5, 2012.
But Republicans also clamored for another meeting with the president, expressing their frustration that they had not received any plan in response to theirs from Obama.
"We ask the president, sit down with us, be serious about the specifics and spending so we can stop the wasteful spending in Washington and finally address the problem," said House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, R-Va.
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As an Independent who was a long term registered Republican and never a Democrat I try to objectively evaluate and be willing to vote for whoever I think honestly and conscientiously best represents the majority, without ever being controlled by “conservative” or “liberal” loyalties. I still believe in the Republican philosophies that “the least amount of government is the best government” and “government should only do for the people that which they can’t do for themselves” but I became totally alienated by the Republicans, starting with Bush-Cheney and continuing with the likes of Norquist, Boehner, McConnell, Cantor, Ryan, Bachmann, the Koch brothers, Adelson and several others, as they totally neglect the real responsibilities inherent in those philosophies - with the least not being, their failure to protect the people from exploitation by the advantaged few. While I am not a Democrat it is accurate to say that I’m currently anti-Republican as they continually enable and encourage the very exploitation they are suppose to protect against, as they have become totally owned and controlled by “the money” and just depend on subterfuge and propaganda to con the people and manipulate public opinion. That noted, it would be wrong not to understand that I really want the return of the Grande Ole Party with once again a honest and conscientious concern for the majority.
Recently I traded comments with an individual who professed similar ideals for bipartisanship and for a honest exchange by both parties ... then he reverted to accusing Obama of being at fault, of being inflexible, completely ignoring the Republicans’ stubborn and arrogant belligerence that has caused total gridlock and then he said that having the very wealthy pay more in taxes really wasn’t worth the effort. He even faulted Obama for taking a couple hours now and then to relax with a game of golf - ignoring that GWBush would spend weeks at both Camp David and his Texas ranch waiting to be told what to do by those who controlled him. The point being that this individual isn’t objective and is swayed by the biased propaganda put out by the Republicans as supported by the power, influence and mega-bucks of those who benefit. Just considering letting the Bush Tax Cuts for the very wealthy expire is tell-tale in that it not only represents a responsible and reasonable change reversing what GWBush did to subserviently heavily favor the very wealthy, without it ever benefiting the economy, but it also recognizes that what the Republicans’ constantly and stubbornly offer always benefits only “the money” and seeks to lay all of the costs on the middle-class.
What we really need, what is the only opportunity for political reform, opportunity to solve our problems and to not have “more of the same”, which can only result in “more of the same”, is for the people, the voters to become truly objective and rational with biases, prejudices, emotions and loyalties put aside in order to reject being conned and to refuse to be manipulated. You don’t like Obama, that is reasonable; you don’t agree with Democratic policies, that is understandable; but unless you can also see that the Republicans are causing the gridlock, that they are putting their political ambitions and the serving of “the money, their strong supporters and masters, above all else and at any cost to the people, unless you understand that “big government” and the deficit didn’t cause our problems but rather that the repeated exploitation by the few, allowed by policies rationalized as “conservative”, did cause the problems, then you aren’t being objective and can’t make a truly rational decision. The people have the power, as proven in this last election, and all they have to do is be disciplined to not be deceived, used and abused.
Nice post, RGiles. I try hard to be objective. I'm eligible for SS in two years, and a tax increase will affect me. So, I can't really be very objective on the Social Security. I could do without it, but I have paid into it for myself for over 40 years and my employees for the last 26, and don't consider it any sort of entitlement. I could stand it to be raised from my current time line of 66 to 67. Many, many others cannot. So, I stand with them. The few percentage points over the $250,000 that I will have to pay will not affect me nor my business at all. I owe this country. Just hope my money is well spent by my government.
All other real entitlements, I have an open mind about. Don't want any starving children, but welfare can be reformed, I believe, starting on the local level. We really, really should stop subsidizing big corporations. They are making more profit now than ever before. Then there's DOD including overseas military bases and foreign aid. I understand how foreign aid is supposed to work. We give them money; they are our friends. It doesn't always work that way, and those who have proven not to be our friends shouldn't receive another dime. END the war.
All the deficit hawks who appeared amazingly, immediately after the 2008 election need to understand that revenue must -- must be included along with the cuts or there will be no deficit reduction.
Anyway, your post was thought-provoking and honest. Thanks.
You all beleive in your TV president. Nobody ever heard of this guy before he became president because hes a nobody.
A man built up by the owned and operated Left wing communist party.
Im just repeating what most people know, the ones that don't beleive in there TV set and there own image.
Now you've done it, you've forced me to defend Obama. A man who is as conservative & backward looking as any Republican prior to 1980.
Socialist? Please! Both the Demicans & Republocrats are owned by the same small group of fantastically wealthy white men. Thanks to last year's Supreme Court decision, they can be bought on the open market now. If you really, truly, in-your-heart believe that people that rich would allow a socialist anywhere near the oval office, get professional help.
Obama is just there to put a compassionate face on conservative, capitalist policies. Since socialism is a step up from capitalism, like capitalism is a step up from communism, you naturally think that makes him a socialist. Your ability to think is pathetic.
Capitalism is going down! Act now to replace it with something else. Me, I'm supporting a free market, something socialists mistrust, capitalists hate, & communists won't allow.
Have you ever had a cogent thought???
Fed Up, I'm afraid 666 thought that was.
Your silly 666.
Who are the fantastically wealthy white men.
Capitalism is the free market , and your right it is going down because of Socialism. Taking 10,000 dollars out of my 40,000 I make a year. Making harder for me to stay in the middle class, or any class.
Zbigniev Brezezinski, the Polish Wonder of the Democratic Party said this morning that these are the results of Obama trying to lead from behind....I almost choked on my corn flakes.....it was so funny seeing all of the libs on "Morning Joe" trying to get up from the glass top table at the same time....Sam Stein, Steve Rattner, etc. were looking for the nearest exit....classic TV
The deal was made on the golf course, boehner dumped his conservitives on several committees and obama agreed to go soft and boehner may have been promised a cabinate position.....they are playing a politicians version of good cop/bad cop.
The House should vote to replace boehner as speaker, what a disappointment he has become.
What good are tax increases if the government WONT STOP SPENDING? Just read an article a few days ago that said Obama's 'plan' included tax hikes, PLUS $200 billion in spending on 'public works'...and he wanted sole power to raise the debt ceiling! This is insane! It's time to sweep DC completely clean and start over with ALL NEW PEOPLE who understand that 'just because you have checks doesn't mean that you have money in the account."
The President doesn't want sole power to raise the debt limit.
The proposal is to end Congressional voting on the debt limit, because Congress turned it into a 3-ring circus the last time and caused the US credit rating to be downgraded for the first time in history.
The debt ceiling will have to be dealt with again in 2013 and once again it promises to be a Republican freak show.
Other countries have simple trigger laws that automatically increase the debt limit by a fixed percentage whenever the debt limit is reached.
"The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a Sign that the US Government cannot pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies. ...Increasing America's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that 'the buck stops here'. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and Grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."
SENATOR BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA, MARCH 2006
Re-Elect, this country doesn't need to increase its debt ceiling - it needs to stop spending, stop waste, and work more efficiently. Raising the debt ceiling is nothing more than a method of subsidizing our government's incompetence, its corruption, its lack of accountability, and its contempt for the American people. I have ZERO respect for ANY of our elected officials; as far as I'm concerned, they're all elitist trash who've abused the system for far too long.
Thomas Jefferson in his wisdom advocated 'cleaning house' every 20 years to keep tyranny and corruption in check. I think it's about time We, the People followed his advice.
Not big news because the stupid piece of legislation is set to expire. It doesn't matter what the GOP says.
America’s growing tax burden is a drag on the economy and will reach record levels without policy changes.
thank goodness our president concentrated on job creation and the economy over the last 4 years unemployment is now 5% and a gallon of gas is 2.49 my home is finally regaining equity Thank goodness he did not spend money on unaffordable green energy companies that loose money thank goodness the private sector lost money not tax payers. I'm also glad no one got hurt in Benghazi over that protest those signs the protesters had where shameful and those tomatoes they threw could hurt someone thank goodness our president is so transparent and up front with American people on what is really happening because that is what american needs a leader that is not influenced by washington pressure and the media to spinnnnnnn stufffff
You need to spend less - tighten your belt. You can't just continue to spend the way you had when times were prosperous. The answer is not shaking down more people for more money. It's in cutting your spending. Like any sane person would do.
3D chess vs tiddly winks. The GOP won't hold the debt ceiling hostage again, business won't let that destroy the stock market again. The GOP won't let the military budget get automatically (or any other way) cut, never never, never. And the GOP can't do anything about the tax cuts expiring either. They are in a corner, no bargaining chips this time - only bluster. Check mate, check mate, check mate GOP, a loss of your own making.
In Wisconsin the GOP is really turning into a bunch of IDIOTS. They want to pass bills of Voter ID, end the ability of voters to register at the polls, & take retired judges off Wisconsin's nonpartisan elections and ethics board and replace them with political appointees. And for what? Just to swing votes more in their favor, instead of doing their job an getting elected for their intent to help the pepole of "Wisconsin" rather make it harder for some people and their right to vote.
is'nt that the same state where a bunch democrats fled the state to block some vote talking about doing a job that sounds cowardly just waited didn't they vote in a Republican twice as governor and aren't they close to having a balanced budget while their neighbor Il. is like 8 billion in debt ya the gop in Wisconsin are idiots while the Democrats in IL. are financial geniuses because their state is near broke state troopers have been cut off at gas station because Il. can not pay their bill while obama camp stills owes them 55,000 from 2009
Spending is at record levels and is still growing, threatening economic freedom.
Entitlement spending is the main cause of long-term runaway federal deficits. Medicare is the fastest-growing program due to retiring baby boomers, the effects of an aging population, and rising healthcare costs.
Ever consider that is what is wanted?
Don't cave on tax hikes. Obama can take his war on success and stick it where the sun don't shine.
I really don't know where we got this "poor equal democrats" "rich equals republicans" My daughter and son-in-law are solely republicans." They are far from being rich and have benefits from our government and myself. My wife's two brothers are solely republican. One doesn't want to work and have drawn unemployment for almost two years. The other one had a great job and quit. He haves the skills for high paying jobs, but he works at a department store by his choice with very little income. These are the republicans that I see screaming don't give our money away to the 47%. While actually they don't come close to the top 47%. It makes me wonder how many on this blog are just like them, blaming Obama and not themselves of their own problems.
"Obama, in his appearance shortly following Boehner's press conference, argued that closing those deductions would not raise the type of revenue needed to establish the "balanced" approach on which he campaigned."
Now, ask yourself this: Why would the GOP want to support obozo's campaign promisis?
How balanced can it be? All he and the morons in the Democrat Party want to do is raise taxes on the successful without any net spending cuts.
They talk about $40 billion in cuts in some areas (a drop in the bucket when you're talking trillions) but they "balance" it by spending $50 billion elsewhere.
No. they just want to spread the misery. No one should be allowed to have it better than someone else regardless of how little some try or how hard others do.
To those according to their "need" from those according to their ability to pay.
I am so sick and tired of hearing the term "fair share" from idiots who have no clue and not only pay no net taxes but at the end of the year GET A REFUND of more than they paid in over the year.
My wife and I took over a struggling business a year and a half ago. We take a minimal salary in an effort to keep employees on (there are several who make more than we do) and keep the business open. We hope the business survives so we can have a better life ourselves so we're willing to sacrifice now with long hours and lower pay. But you can bet if things turn around for the business we deserve every single penny we get out of it. And we DAMN SURE deserve to make more than any employees.
Last year our tax liability on the federal level was over $20,000 MORE than what our combined gross salaries were because the income the business takes in (that gets put back into the business to keep it going) goes on our personal taxes. And now Obama and all of you whiners want us to pay MORE? SCREW YOU!
What? We NO credit for doing our best to KEEP people employed instead of firing them with you ingrates?
You all and Obama act like small businesses contribute NOTHING to this country. We're all greedy SOB's who just want to screw over the "worker". Well, here's an effing news flash for you .... before the employees come in or are gone for the day we're still there. Employees get paid first. Even if it means we miss our mortgage payment that payday or don't have the money for groceries for our family that week. And we know plenty of small business people who go through the same thing.
We didn't build this... screw you a$$$holes and the Communist you voted in. (BTW- when 51% of 38% of all eligible voters put a guy in office that's NOT a mandate. That's barely over 19%. And 19% is NOT a majority of the country last I heard)
Maybe what we SHOULD do is exactly what some of the people who are paid to live here do. Close up shop, go on welfare in every form we can get - and in multiple states, and then file our taxes and get a fat refund check to boot. We'll teach our kids to do the same thing so that for generations they won't ever have to lift a finger and they'll get FREE money.
To quote the Democrat Party's best spokesperson in 2008 - They won't have to worry about their mortgage, or their gas or anything anymore.
Fair share my A$$. Bunch of greedy bastards who want to drag down those who are trying to be successful by taking what they earned that's all you are.
Now, call me names all you want but you all know I'm right and you're wrong. The names I called you fit. The names you have been calling people like me are just the lies you tell yourself so you can justify your thievery.
Couldn't agree more; they don't have a clue because they sit on their ass with their hands wide open saying give me give me and want to do nothing for it. Jefferson said it perfectly when he stated: "When we take from those who work and give it to those who don't, Democracy dies".
Jay, I know exactly how you feel. I, too, co-own a small business; and I pay out the wazoo on taxes. We won't be hiring in the foreseeable future, we simply can't. Now, with Obamacare kicking in, the fiscal cliff, and people with less money in their pockets, I can't help but think of how many small businesses will go belly up this coming year...and yet, our wealthy elected officials are living high off the hog while reeking from the stench of corruption.
We were told by our insurance agent that we can expect a 10% health insurance increase this year but 50-60% in 2014. What small business can handle that?
If I sound angry it's because I am. I am tired of being portrayed by the media, most of the posters on here and the guy who's supposed to be the damn leader of the country as the problem. We do more to help than any one of those idiots in Washington or even on our state levels.
We try to make a good living not only for ourselves but for our employees. But every tax, mandate and regulation the government piles on us just drags it down. And that's what it's intended to do.
Actually, if you paid the government $20,000 then your yearly business sales, of which you pay taxes on, is under $250,000, which means the government will not be taking more of your income under new tax policies.
I have a friend that paid in that much also, so I know what his business sales are, and I also know he doesn't pay many other taxes that payrolled employees have to pay, although I do know he pays his employees benefits and insurance. He just feels its his responsiiblity to offer those things to the people helping him run his business.
if you had business sales of $250,000 and were in the 25% tax bracket, you would have paid $62,500 which is three times what you claim you paid in. Sounds like buying a struggling business was your own fault, and you might want to find a better tax accountant also.
Obama is an idiot and a moron. STOP THE DAMN SPENDING AND YOU WON'T HAVE TO RAISE TAXES ON ANYONE. By the way you little minded minions, the so called rich pay a tax rate of 35% already....would you like 35% taken out of your paycheck every week....didn't think so. Obama wants to raises taxes on small businesses like mine because I gross more than $250,000 per year; if your a small business and your not grossing at least that much you might as well close the doors. His tax and spend plan will kill this Country; just ask the workers at Hostess if they like how things turned out for them. If Obama gets his way, Hostess won't be the last to say so long folks. Wait until Obamacare gets into full swing and watch the jobs go South. All you who voted for the Messiah Obama, I hope you enjoy your change because that's all you'll have left in your pocket when he gets done.
Hostess had $700 million of debt, which wasn't the governments fault, or the employees fault.
Healthcare won't affect employers with lower numbers of employees, which most likely isn't those with a gross of $250,000.
If your insurer isn't paying out at least 80% of those premium rate increases in the form of medical services, and you as the employer are paying the insurance for your employees, the insurance company is required to return the unused portion of that 80% to you, then you can decide if your employees deserve some of that refund if they also paid into the insurance.
You know in my humble opinion just to bad we couldn't all just get along without all the finger pointing. We are Americans first and no matter GOP, Democrats or independents lets just get the job done.
That will happen when the party of class envy and warfare stops trying to punish success and realizes you can't spend and tax your way out of economic trouble.
That, and the end of the Federal Reserve would be a great help.
Mr. Anti-Freedom Obama is going to raise our taxes again and again and again, we can just keep borrowing from China until they cut us off.
Obamacare has already killed my health insurance. My Company's insurance plan used to be front loaded $2,000. That means they pay the first 2k no matter what. But now it is a $3,000 deductible and I have to pay the first 3k. Not only that, my rates are going up 92% next month.
THANKS OBAMA!
Giving the government more money is like giving an acoholic a gift card to the liquor store for Christmas. You can say all you want you didn't fuel their addiction because you did not give them a bottle of Vodka, but would be wrong. I would gladly have my effective tax rate go up if I thought anything constructive would be done with the extra money that would be going to DC. But it won't and until somebody reins in spending, your higher taxes will go for more of the same old, same old crap.
There can be no spending cuts, unless you cut defense. While it's true our military can be cut in half & still be the most formidable fighting force in history, the possiblity of defense cuts leads to too many emotional outburts.
Watch the response to this post.
Great just give him more money too spend, he has already racked up more credit card debt, He has out spent any Pres to date.
The man is absolutely insane.
USA is for sale and China buying it THANK YOU OBAMA
My checkbook has a 97 cent balance and my debts are around 5 thousand dollars, where is my bailout and obozo-phone? (I'm already in subsidized housing)(but don't qualify for food stamps, I make 11 dollars a month too much in retiremment) WHERE ARE MY DAMN BENEFITS???? ;>)
It is where the sun doesn't shine.
The Life Line program was created by the Reagan Administration. Cell phones were added by the GW Bush Administration.
No Federal funds are used to finance the program.
Extend the tax cuts for 250k and below, yes. Raise tax rate on the wealthy to 39%, yes. Pass a jobs/infrastructure bill to grow/stimulate the economy, yes. Do all three before Christmas and negotiate everything else in January.
Not fair Maynard. If it's good for the goose, it's good for the gander. Raise everybody's taxes or none at all. Either way were are going to slip back into a nasty recession. That is if you believe we ever came out of the first one.
It is fair, the wealthy have been benefiting from the Bush tax cuts for 10 year, at middle class expense; that wasn't fair. The wealthy tax cuts added to the deficit because tey were not paying their fair share.
Maynard....another stimulus bill you say......buhahahahahahahahah.....you mean like the $767 billion one that didnt make a dent in the unemployment rate? My town did get new sidewalks out of it. They had one person working, four people watching the one guy work, and two people holding construction flags. Did you also note that in order to get stimulus money you had to use union labor. The Democrats have and always will be horrible at job creation because they are against the free market system. Bad days ahead.
Bill Clinton did an excellent job creating jobs and stimulating the economy and stimulus money had nothing to do with union labor. We had a surplus under his leadership and the tax rate for the wealthy was 39%. Mr. Bush is the one responsible for the deficit! By the way, I'm sorry your town mismanaged stimulus funds.
Maynard....Bill Clinton didn't create jobs. Those were the years of the internet and dotcom boom coupled with the cellular start-ups. Although Al Gore would msot likely disagree with me as he said he created the internet. We will never see that again.
You can't have it both ways my friend. When jobs are lost, regardless what kind of jobs they were, the president gets the blame (particularly Obama), so, when jobs are created the president gets the credit for it happening on his watch. Fact, 1993 23mil jobs were created by President Bill Clinton after taxes were raised on the wealthy to 39%. I never claimed that it won't happen again but it could. If we start doing more on renewable energy (i.e., solar, wind, geo-thermal) manufacturing can rebound and excel. Many countries would purchase products built in America. Rebuilding in our infrastructure, investing in education (i.e., math/science) for jobs of the future and retro-fitting homes and buildings by making them more energy efficient. Being and engineer, I know there are jobs available that we don't have qualified folks to fill. Companies are recruiting from other countries for engineers... that makes no sense. Yes we can, create 23 mil jobs, you tell me why we can't. Stop moving jobs to other countries is one way to stop the bleeding!