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Subscribe to RSSAn argument over who is more opposed to the Islamic faith and the construction of a mosque near Nashville has become an unlikely issue in a nasty Tennessee Republican congressional primary to be decided on Thursday.
Freshman Republican Representative Diane Black is challenged by Lou Ann Zelenik, who lost to Black in a primary to represent the rural district two years ago by less than 300 votes.
The heart of the struggle is over the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro, about 30 miles south of Nashville, which has been controversial since construction began two years ago.
Zelenik, who vigorously opposed the mosque and warned of potential terrorist connections, said Black was not forceful enough in her opposition.
"I will work to stop the Islamization of our society, and do everything possible to prevent Sharia law from circumventing our laws and our Constitution," Zelenik said.
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Some states dominated by Republicans have passed laws to prevent Islamic or Sharia law from applying in U.S. court cases. The United States legal system is founded in the U.S. Constitution.
Black did oppose the mosque in statements issued in 2010. She said communities have a right to be vigilant in ensuring that Islamic institutions in this country do not aid the "jihadist viewpoint."
"The mosque was rushed through the local process, and people were mad about it ... This isn't about religion, this is about people staying vigilant," Black said.
A judge ruled last month that the mosque could be occupied by its congregation in time for the fasting month of Ramadan if it passed an inspection. But the inspection showed that some additional work needed to be done before it could be used.
The argument is not even over a mosque in their own congressional district because the redrawing of election maps after the 2010 census put the facility in another district.
But a wealthy conservative donor, Nashville health care investor Andrew Miller, has weighed in on the side of Zelenik, contributing $105,100 to a new group called Citizens 4 Ethics in Government, according to the latest reports the group had submitted to the Federal Election Commission as of July 20.
The group has spent nearly $188,000 on media and automated telephone calls with the goal to unseat Black.
Miller is also chairman and executive director of the Tennessee Freedom Coalition, a conservative non-profit which lists as the top issue on its website: "Educate citizens on the realities of Sharia and stop the growth of Radical Islam."
Repeated attempts made by Reuters to contact Miller for comment were unsuccessful. Zelenik's campaign also did not return numerous phone calls requesting comment.
"No one is more opposed to Sharia law, radical Islam and terrorism than Diane Black, but unlike her opponent, Diane Black respects our Constitution," her campaign spokeswoman Jennifer Coxe-Baker said.
Ibrahim Hooper, spokesman for the Council on American-Islamic Relations, a Washington-based Muslim Civil Rights and advocacy group, says people like Zelenik "live in their own bubble of anti-Islam hate."
"All you can do is rely on the goodwill and the tolerance of the members of the rest of society who don't hold these extremist, bizarre views and trust in the common sense of the American people and the people of Tennessee," he said.
The race is one of several Tennessee congressional primaries on Thursday to determine party nominees for the election in November.
Copyright 2013 Thomson Reuters. Click for restrictions.
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What else would expect from GOP - many conservatives still practice intolerance and xenophobia. Some of them only pay lip service to constitutional principle of freedom and equality. Others don't even pretend to pay that lip service and are outright racist.
Some conservatives have forgotten about the Golden Rule, forgot about the 'common sense'.
It's demagoguery, the kind of demogoguery Hitler once practiced against minorities.
So they don't want Sharia laws to enter the country but don't realize that their Fundamentalist beliefs and practices are approaching Sharia law in every respect but name.
I'm so not surprised. Lovely. Well, it is Tennessee.
I missed the editing window...
Really, the pesky old freedom of religion and First Amendment only applies when it works for the Fundamentalist cause, remember? TN does have a legislative history that makes this fit in, and no, I'm not bashing TN citizens. I'm just saying look at the legislative history and the state's history in general.
This is sad and unbelievably ignorant. I tutor a recent immigrant from Iraq and I believe she is afraid to go out in public. When hate reaches this level, who knows the kind of hostility that will follow?
Someone should inform the state of TN that freedom of religion is constitutionally protected. In addition, there are laws that separate church and state. What kind of leaders are these who can't even educate their constituents but choose to whip them up in a fury of hate over a place of worship?
It's shameful that this kind of Michele Bachmann McCarthyism and hate mongering is upheld by elected officials. What church do these people attend that teaches Christ's views as Hate Your Neighbor?
And the most awful part of this is that people will actually vote for these candidates.
Was opposing Nazis frowned upon by our media? There are great Muslims, but the powerful faction of their religion is hateful and condones killing of others.
The truth hurts, but until the actions of this religion changes, they should be feared and even hated.
"they should be feared and even hated"
sounds like you would have been a great Nazi!
They TN rednecks are doing this the hard way. Fire up their Banjoes around the property and shoot thems tator guns over the Mosque as warnin shots and I reckon all thems fellers will take out lickety split. Yes siree Bob.
I am for all freedoms but would have to ask why the heart of redneck stupidity to set up shop?
With the current issues if birth control and Chic-Fil-A, conservatives have been screaming about religious freedom. I guess religious freedom only counts when it's a perceived threat to Christianity.
@IXLR8,
Muslims have been in Murfreesboro for decades because of MTSU. It is one of the larger undergraduate colleges in the state.
This already taking a huge toll of Middle Tennessee State University (MTSU) as professsors who can flee to other, "more enlightened" universities. There are simply not enough grad students in this country to fill all the slots available to them. This means than academia is always a sort of cultural and religious mixed bag since so many come from other countries. Professors who have already built a reputation always feel directly harmed by this sort of intolerance from the "civilian" community. So they leave and go to other institutions where they feel that the chance they and their work will be respected.
The student population is also taking a hit. This is because the highest-paying students come from other countries. This is how a university keeps in-state tuition down. There will be a massive tuition increase to make up for foreign students (not just Muslims) who are transferring and a huge drop in new applications from foreign students. A lot of in-state students simply cannot afford a huge tuition increase.
The GOP is AMERICA'S TALIBAN. They have NO RESPECT for our constitution or the American ideal of equal opportunity. They are all about rigging the system for their own gain. Mitt Romney is a perfect example. He won the GENE LOTTERY and now thinks he DESERVES IT for all his "hard work".
DISGUSTING. The GOP should pack up and Move to NORTHERN MALI. They would feel RIGHT AT HOME!
Bdune, I am not a hateful person, but I do not like people who want to kill other people in the name of religion.
Unfortunately at this time, the hateful faction of their church is in power and does want to harm my fellow citizens. Until that is reversed by a huge wave of peace loving Muslims kicking out the murderers and their behavior changes, why should I promote or want the expansion of such a hateful organization?
The fact she states "the Mosque was rushed through the approval process" shows she is either a liar, or just repeats what other wing-nuts say. They city rushed NOTHING. They printed it in the paper just as many times as they did for all other projects. The decision to make this group do more than others was nothing more than out right religious racism. TN has GOT to be just about the worst state legislatively I can think of. They just continue to create a culture of racism and discrimination.
But as was very clear from the gay marriage discussion, you want the government to impose your Christian sharia laws on everyone in order to restrict the civil rights of gays.
Your philosophy seems to be : "freedom of religion for me but not for thee".
Livingbaregoot
"I'm not a hateful person"....you keep repeating that to yourself!
"I do not like people who kill people in the name of religion"....guess you havn't read up on Christian History!
I am for equal rights, you can have all the gay marriages you want. My solution is very conservative and consistent. Get my government out of the marriage business and allow it to be or not to be a religious term. Your business relationship with your government would be a civil union.
I do not believe in restricting the religious rights of Muslims as you can't the KKK, does not mean I have to like them. I grew up Catholic and depise the leaders of their religion also.
There is not 1/100th of enough uproar from the peaceful Muslims against the murderers, that is my feeling and the reason for my animosity.
I am not a fan of organized religion, I understand and respect peoples need and beliefs in it, but my God is not as narrow minded as any of them make him out to be.
I figured this out at as a child when they told me indirectly one of my best friends and nicest guys was not going to heaven because he was Jewish.
All these people came out to support Chick Fil A and condemn govt officials and politicians who wanted to block construction of new Chick Fil A's in their cities, but if it is a mosque, fair game....
hypocrisy
So in other words we have to change tens of thousands of laws about marriage and severely disadvantage any married couple who travel overseas, just because your cult also uses the word "marriage" to describe an irrelevant religious rite?
Sounds like you do indeed want to impose Christian sharia law on everybody. Why should our government care what words your cult uses to describe its quaint and bizarre rituals?
@Pigotry,
A good story to remember about the South is the story of the KKK after the Civil War. The KKK became immensely popular in the North because of its hatred of African-Americans who came there to work in the factories. Eventually the factory owners has quiet talks with the KKK involving baseball bats and chains and the KKK decided to leave town.
In the South, it was much different. People tend to forget that the KKK hated Jews and Catholics and lynched both religions right along with Blacks. This was especially true in North and South Carolina where there were a number of Jewish- and Catholic-owned textile mills. The KKK became very active in assaulting Jews and Catholics and burning the textile mills. The problem was that they destroyed the very economies of the small towns they came from alo0ng with the mills. Eventually local sheriffs "explained" to the the error of their ways and the bloodied KKK left those towns as well.
All this hatred plays well to the ill-informed and uneducated, especially in places where education and facts are demonized and hated. But when it starts to interfere with the local economics, it is a different matter. That is why so many mayors came out against Chik-Fil-A. And it is why the GOP is a sinking ship where the idiotic passengers are poking holes in the hull to let the water out.
You ignorant liberals have absolutely no clue about the cult called islam. It is not a religion dumbasses, it is an all emcompassing way of life. There are no "grey areas" with islam, either you're with them, or against them, and if you're against them, you are considered an "infidel" and subject to murder by a variety of "humaine" methods. You can't honestly tell me that the islamists do not want sharia law imposed were they set up shop. Look at Dearborn, Michigan. There are already areas of the city that have been labeled "No Go Areas", where even law enforcement is afraid to go, and sadly, sharia law is the de facto law of the hood. I've seen how these animals act when they are the majority, and it's worse than obscene. So all of you silly liberals keep on patting yourselves on your collective backs for your perceived "tolerance", and keep telling yourselves that the islamists really mean no harm. In the meantime, check and see how many Christian churches there are in the countries that are suffering under the islamic oligarcy. If you think the islamists care about any of the amendments in our Constitution, you are a complete idiot. Apparently many have forgotten the scenes of celebration in the aforementioned countries after the Twin Towers fell. I will never forget.
The language used by both the Tennessee candidates profiled above comes very close to a hate crime in nature.
The "Freedom of Religion" language in our Constitution appears to be completely incomprehensible to some. How can any rational person in the United States opposed the construction of any Church, Mosque, Synagogue or Temple? It defies all logic and is unconstitutional. If the proposed structure meets all zoning requirements and building codes there is nothing to discuss.
These two women need a visit from the FBI to bring them up to date on the Constitution and the laws governing hate crimes in this country. They are teetering on the edge of committing a hate crime and certainly are encouraging clearly unconstitutional actions.
Obama/Biden 2012
shrekk, I personally could care less who gets married, that was just a solution offered that could work.
You make it sound like it would cause as much trouble as the year 2000 did.
Nice to see Progressives lining up here behind Islam, most likely because Islam opposes homosexuality, opposes abortion, opposes all who are not Muslim and oppose free speech. Really no difference between the virulent anti-Americanism of Isman, nor the virulent anti-Americanism of Progressives. Two peas on a pod of hate.
That's because Progressives actually support freedom of religion, unlike you.
Umm, Jeff? "Islam opposes homosexuality, opposes abortion, opposes all who are not [x] and oppose free speech," so that means radical Islam = Progressives? You nicely made the case why right-wing Christian extremists, and radical Islamists are more alike than Progressives with either. Good work!
Actually Living Barefoot I would agree on that aspect, There is not enough outrage from Muslim leaders mainly because their culture often accepts public executions and restrictions of basic human rights. However these politicians are doing to nothing but pandering to the Hate mongers, The Rush Limbaughs and Hannitys of the world if you will. No body votes in primaries except the hardcore base of the Parties so they just pander to whoever gets them elected.
There is a commonsense approach to this but honestly what commonsense approach have our Elected Bodies followed recently. Everything is Party Line nonsense.
Here are some destructive Christian fundamentalist ideas:
1. God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve (anti-gay rights).
2. objection to contraception (misogynic)
3. using Jesus's death to justify anti-semitism
4. using the bible to justify slavery (in the past) and racism (today - a souther christian church refusing to marry minority couples)
5. ritual killing: in the last 2000 years, using Christian 'holy wars' to kill members of other religions and members of their own religion (their own soldiers die in their so-called cause). Remember the two world wars?
The list can go on for another century
We are not lining up behind Islam, we are lining up behind the right of people to do whatever they want on their own private property. Is this what you call anti-Americanism? People minding their own business and living peacefully with their neighbors?
Or is anti-Americanism suppressing religion?
Spare us your self-righteousness. You do not speak for America, and your stated principles are not what America is about.
Hannity bores me, I find Rush interesting, but never detect hate from either.
I think the left's view of classifying people and needing to take care of certain groups very racist. As a conservative, I look at everyone who pulls their weight the same and despise that the left is keeping labor from making a decent wage and has to look to them for assitance. As a conservative , I despise corrupt and greedy rich getting my tax dollars to bail them out but have no animosity towards the honest rich.
As an American, I hate anyone that wants to kill other in the name of religion and unfortunately at this time, that defines Muslims. They have the right to build their church, but I do not have to support them, like them and if they killed a love one, hate them.
When the peace loving Muslims rise up and run out the murderers, I will hold their hands and join them. Until then, they have zero respect from me!
In response....
All those people that support Rahm Emmanuel, Thomas Menino and Edwin Lee and feel that they should be able to prevent a restaurant from obtaining permits because of religious beliefs...yet argue that muslims should be able to build a mosque anywhere they want...
Hypocrisy
Outside of people advertising, I am proud to say I do not collapse anybody's opinions.
Some of you are on here preaching freedom and collapsing opposing views, that makes for good humor.
That explains a lot.
Well, it appears that Islam has a lot in common with fundamentalist Christianity.
Last I looked, the constitution did not provide any exemptions for our rights. And the First Amendment is equal as the Second's right to bear arms.
We are not a Christian govt. We are a democracy and we separate church and state. We need to get over this ridiculous religious nonsense and confine it to one's personal life and not bring it into govt and politics where it does not belong.
Funny, that's exactly how I feel about the Catholic Church and their ongoing coverup of the abuses of children by priests, with higher ranking members of the church actually CONVICTED for enabling the pedophiles.
Sorry, Islam as a whole is NO WORSE than Xtianity as a whole. Indeed, I would rather live next to a whole town full of Muslims, than a town full of Xtians. Muslims at least mind their own business, Xtians are always worried about sticking something in your uterus, or telling you who you can and can't marry.
In truth, this makes Tennessee look even dumber than it usually does. How embarrassing.
To NPCDan: Please accept a well-meant suggestion. True, getting frustrated is common here and I do too. Venting happens. Still, venting, especially by name-calling, can never persuade.
That goes not just for you Dan. In fact there are probably worse examples here... but please think about it. It's a writing challenge, but if you believe in your point of view, respect yourself, let alone respecting the rest of us. Make your point by being logical and courteous. Trust me... You'd be hard to disagree with.
And nics notwithstanding here.... all of us ... if we believe in what we want to see happen, then we should try to be the best we can be and proud of it. We cannot be our own self's best at the expense of someone else. Ain't gonna happen.
"A man's reach must exceed his grasp, or what's a heaven for." (Robert Browning)
Just remember this folks. Tennessee, along with North Carolina, is one of the most moderate states of the old Confederacy. That they eveh have an Islamic community puts them way ahead of the remaining members of the CSA in diversity. FL, of course, never was a confederate state.
@ KeenInsight,
It's not the religion most of us are afraid of; it's the implementation of its ways. The rules and laws that they do inject into daily lives is not what the United States was founded on. We separate church and state for this very reason. No religion should dictate the rule or the punishment for American's and that is exactly what we or maybe just me is afraid of happening. I have seen it happen in Canada just a few months ago when a man killed is daughters and ex wife because they caused him dishonor. If we allow this country to become 60% Islamic how long will it be before our laws are changed to suit this institutions beliefs? It scares the hell out of me!
livingbarefoot @ 1.3
"I find Rush interesting, but never detect hate from either."
Many years ago I used to occasionally listen to him out of curiosity. I can tell you for a fact that I have personally heard him laugh at people with AID's (as it was still commonly referred to back then) and wish that it would spread throughout the gay community and IV drug users and, by inference in those days since treatment was at a much less advanced stage, die.
Pretty hard to call that anything but hate, in my book.
wow. None is so blind as he who will not see....
From the article:
This sentence should read:
An argument over who is more opposed to the First Amendment has become an unlikely issue in a nasty Tennessee Republican congressional primary to be decided on Thursday.
Mary, today's GOP doesn't care about the First Amendment. It's the Second Amendment that they hold dear.
Sorry about the double post.
So, basically the debate goes like this:
Black: "I'm pretty stupid, elect me."
Zelenik: "I'm a whole bag of stupid with a side of crazy."
Black: "Well, I'll see your crazy and raise you cowardice!"
Zelenik: "I'll see your cowardice and raise you a churchifying!"
Black: "What the hell is that word?"
Zelenik: "See? She's a Communist!"
Still much better than the Anti-America contest the Democrats wage against taxpayers.
OneOfTheSane: Yes, many on the Right do love the Second Amendment, while disregarding the First Amendment. Agreed.
Pajama: HUH? What party has obstructed continually any effort to promote conditions for job growth. In spite of "Jobs Jobs Jobs" mantra, Republicans have filibustered any legislations that remotely appears to offer practicle assistance. Infrastructure, small business tax breaks for hirings, major targetted tax cuts, assistance to states for education (teachers.... duh!), police, fire fighters. Instead Republicans have focused on abortion restriction, contraception restriction, vote suppression, and as this article demonstrates, fear-mongering. Which set of policies sounds more anti-American? Dolt. You should zip up: your agenda is showing.....
Are you talking about the 90% of the taxpayers that the Republicans want to increase taxes on?
Or the 1% of the taxpayers that Obama wants to increase taxes on?
Perhaps you need to adjust your hyperbole somewhat. Raising taxes fractionally isn't "waging war." Even if Republicans succeeded in raising taxes on the average family by the $2,000 they want, it is still not a war.
It is cold, yes, it is unfeeling, yes, but it is not a war. A war is where they take you back out and shoot you.
@pjam09,
Do you mean like the Obama tax cuts that have reduced both payroll taxes and federal income taxes to their lowest point in 30 years? That kind of war on taxpayers? Or are you referring to Mitt Romney's unanswered charge that he failed to pay ANY taxes on the tax returns that he is refusing to release? Or Romney's use of loopholes, offshore tax shelters and secret bank accounts to shift taxes from his back to yours? Or do you count the estimated $200 million in "corporate welfare" that Bain got?
That kind of war on taxpayers that has left this country with the lowest half in income paying around 72% of ALL taxes and fees (including federal, state and local.) Now tell me again how Democrats bringing you the lowest tax rates in 30 years is a war on taxpayers.
This is a easy one. Let's pick say---Saudi Arabia as a model to operate from. Now, let's simply adopt their laws, their values, their Immigration Policies and what Guests in their country are allowed to do.
There would be no Muslims, no Mosques, no burkas, non of this polluting crap that undermines Christianity and Woman's Rights in the United States of America. If they wish to impose their religion here and find opposition as we do when trying to teach in a "Kind Manner" Christianity in Saudi Arabia, too bad! Christianity that I know is without all of the hate and venom that spills from the zealot lips of the imams running about wildly in this country. Christians do not preach killing an infidel nor do we consider non believers infidels. I'm thinking there is a reason Afghanistan is living in the Stone Age. You can bet it has nothing to do with the Christian Values. Let's "Do as They Do" in Saudi Arabia.
So the alternatives before us are to impose a Christian dictatorship or an Islamic one? How about just keeping the system we have; the one that says all other laws are subject to the Constitution, and the Constitution says we will not have an official state religion or any religious test to hold public office? Are you a raging capitalist or a complete idiot?
Tennessee? So, everyone is working, everyone owns their home, everyone is getting a great education, and they all have SO MUCH free time that they can worry about these hysterical rw kook issues like Sharia Law and whether or not moslem Americans have the same right to worship as christians Americans? Gosh, how wonderful!
Pedestrian-in-SF, Tell a big lie often enough and it becomes fact. Goebbels knew that. He and Hitler also knew you need a boogieman to frighten people and to blame. Give people a scapegoat and the Judas goat will lead the people straight to the slaughter.
You better do SOMETHING or your town will end up like Dearborn Michigan !!! Don't know about the Muslim take-over of Dearborn?? Better find out NOW before it is too late!
No, I ain't buying this crap. There is no Islamic takeover of Dearborn. God, you rightie haters take the cake. How about we round up Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Hakeem Olijuwan, Ahmad Rashad for being Islamic terrorists? Let's lock up a whole bunch of football and basketball players because they are terrorists. Any American Muslim must be a terrorist, right? Next, Jews. Hey, they are semitic, just like Arabs. In fact, both religions have many similar beliefs. I mean, I know the Jews have been picked on for centuries, but heck, why waste a good hate? Let's just round up anyone who isn't White and Christian. Let's follow the hatred Jesus Christ had for those different than He was. Oh,wait, Christ, unlike today's so-called christians, did not hate anyone,even those who put Him to death. He said love thy neighbor as thyself. Never said only those like us were our neighbors. In fact, He went out of his way to exalt the different: the Samaritans, the poor, the humble. Too bad today's christians do not follow Christ. Like moderate republicans, Christ would be expelled from today's christianity.He ain;t their kind of christian.
Mike - you don't get it. Most of the american muslims are black. The way to minimize the black vote is to make them all evil. Facts never get in the way of a good pogram (it worked in Poland, Austria, France, and other places in Europe). So - these republicans are just following the european recipe of persecuting those who are 'different'. You know - those darkies... This is just another way that the Tennessee KKK is rising again. Next on the list is Catholics - you know -- those controlled by a foreigner (the pope). And athiests will be after this - after all -- athiests are really devil worshipers (at least in the minds of bigots)
Every time I read this kind of rhetoric from candidates (or anyone else), it reminds me of the propaganda that Hitler used against Jews.
Considering that unlike you I've actually been to Dearborn many many times...no I ain't buying your idiocy.
These two idiots are an embarrassment to their state and to the country and clearly neither or them should be purusing a career in politics.
Shades of Nazi Germany is fast rising with-in the U.S. Could this be the result of embracing Neo-Nazis and Neo-Facists starting back in the late 1950's and mid-1960's. How about their embracing Supremest Groups such as the Right-Wing Militias who are heavily armed with Military type weapons (per Gov. Perry of Texas in one of his "Tea-Party" receptions). How about that Republican Candidate who espoused that we change our current Nuclear Policy which would give the President the capability to LAUNCH a FIRST STRIKE on any Foreign Country such as North Korea, Iran, Pakistan, etc. while knowing that China and Russia will retaliate with an ICBM Nuclear Bombs aimed at the U.S. and don't forget that Pakistan has Nuclear Weapons.
Remember when you Vote, always, vote for the lesser evil and not a straight ballot vote regardless of Party.
Yes we are at risk.
BUT the Nazi comments are a reach.
What's needed here is an anti-republican contest.
I thought there was freedom of religion in the country... How mistaken I was!
Only free if you are part of 'their' intolerant, extremist religion.
Talibangelicals...coming to your town soon.
We take the Henry Ford approach to religion in the country - you can practice any religion you like, as long as it's Christian.
I hate this phrase, but I'm going to use it--"it's a slippery slope." On the one hand, I don't like the Muslim belief system; on the other hand, it and all other religions/beliefs systems are protected by Constitutional rights. I must respect the Constitutional guidelines, even if I don't agree with some of the results. The law must come first. My OPINION is just that, an opinion, and everyone has one.
If the boundaries of religion and politics overlap (which, unfortunately they do at different times), then we have some conflicts that need resolved. Sharia law can not/should not be enforced in this country. We already have all the laws we need, and then some. These laws are what govern the entire populace equally (more or less, but you know what I mean.) Sharia enforces a different set of rules that are sometimes in conflict with the laws of the land, among those Sharia laws--that everyone must have the same religion and god. When there is a conflict, the state/federal/constitutional laws must trump any others to ensure domestic harmony across the board. The laws of the United States should not be party to a particular religious idealism (although, unfortunately, some of them are--but we're working on it.)
Not only is it immoral to deny any persons their belief system, it is illegal. These legislators need to get a grip. I understand that they have an opinion about Islam (and it's similar to mine), but I would not dare to deny anyone their right to worship their god as they (within the bounds of US law) see fit. If we want to elect folks to office, I would hope that we would be smart enough to elect people who at least respect and follow US laws. If we don't, we are going to end up being forced to follow someone else's ideals, someone else's god, and someone else's goals--and that's my definition of Sharia Law.
Ahhh, Tennessee - Bigot Utopia! This one reeks of Marsha Blackburn, don't it? Shucks, let's go have us some more chicken sammiches - that'll show 'em!
I have to agree with you on this. 3 religions share the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, Jewish, Christian and Islam. I have watched specials about the Temple Mount on Nat. Geo. They co-exist in the space of the Mount.
Religion was included because of the view of England at the time, Church of England was is the State Church (all over a man wanting a divorce).
I live in the South and have grown up with the religious crazies who get something in their heads and you are not going to change them. I grew up So. Bap., but a moderate church, not into all the stupid crap that the Convention comes up with. I left them when I went off to college because they were not willing to move with the times. Now that is haunting them. The older heads are dying and are not being replaced by younger people.
The hold rollers with their falling out in tongues and running around the church are alive and well. they get mad and leave and start their own church (tax exempt)and do things their way. TN is the same as NC eat up with store front churches that get mad with where their at and pull out.
I don't agree with the teachings of Islam. But the people who are devote are not the ones wearing bombs, they do not believe in this. Just like in Christianity you have extremist who do things in the name of religion.
the GOP has courted these crazies over the years and now is stuck with them.
I just pray that level heads will prevail. But the level heads HAVE to get out and vote.
@Jimbo,
But where does that leave Mormons, who are not Christians (as Christians define themselves.)? Oh, that's right, the Romneys were American Motors people, not Fords.
to UNCZ... Excellent post. It's not just that I agree with you; it's because you write it so well.
That thought is NOT within the tenets of the Right-Wing Republican Party. If you happen to have a Religion NOT Christian, or, even maybe of wrong Sect if you are Christian, like Hitler did with the Jews, Gypsies, and others in captured lands BEWARE because they will come for you.
PS: Many of our Founding Fathers were Deists rather than Christians, per say. The trend to say "founded on Christianity" or "In God We Trust" was NEVER mentioned in any of their documents, etc. of many of our Founders, so how can anyone claim that this Nation was founded upon Christianity? It, simply, is not so.
Separation of State and Religion is being over taken by ZEALOTS who prefer that this Nation MUST adhere to Christianity (Old Testament) only, which takes that passage and makes it Null, something that was forbidden by our Constitution under the Separation clause.
PS: To me, the teaching within the Old Testament, were opposite those in the New Testament in many ways. As a Christian, I try to adhere only to the Teachings of Christ and His Disciples. I,also, believe in many ways with the Native American approach with the 'Great Spirit' view of Mother Earth since I am part Cherokee.
Weird. First amendment thrown out the window as long as you are not infringing on the rights of chck fil a.
Ah, I see that no one can say anything against a Christian's position on a political issue without being called out as a first amendment violator then.
And where has ANYONE said that the Chick-fil-a owner cannot say, do and think what he wants to? NO ONE.
What's happening there mocha 'I don't know what the difference is between protesting a person's positition and taking away thier ability to have that position' beans is that Chick-fil-a owner can say whatever he wants and people have the FREEDOM OF SPEECH to loudly disagree with him.
I wish you right wingers would finally learn what freedom of speech is actually about.
Let me simplify it:
You have the right to your opinion.
I have my right to my own opinion of YOUR opinion. If my opinion of what you say gets me angry enough, I can excersize my freedom of speech by not going to your business to buy anything from you. I can further use my freedom of speech to loudly proclaim how wrong you are - and to enlist anyone who feels like I do to join my cause.
Right wingers do it all the time to folks who they think are attacking Christmas. OR are daring to bring thier dreaded (by ignorant people) Islamic centers into your communities.
But have a liberal dare to loudly and clearly do that against a right winger or a conservative Christian and we get your reaction - that somehow doing what you do against liberals is infringing on the rights of a right wing or religious bigot... Fascinating...
Now, now @mochabeans,
Chik-Fil-A only advocates for "traditional Bibilcal marriage" which includes:
1) A man can have five wives. If a woman takes a second husband or commits adultery, she is to be stoned to death.
2) A woman must be a virgin for a marriage to be legal. This is optional for a man.
3) A man can divorce his wife by saying "You're divorced" three times in front of a witness. A woman may not divorce a man under any circumstances. If she leaves him she may be stoned to death.
4) If a woman's husband dies, his oldest brother has the option of taking her as a wife. She has no say-so. If the oldest brother declines, the next brother can do so, etc.
This list of idiocy goes on and on. But it is certainly not what most people think of as marriage these days. I'll grant these idiots some credibility when I see groups of them outside Red Lobster stoning shrimp-eaters to death as their "literal and revealed" Bible requires.
FormerMarineSgt:
Well stated. It's amazing how some on the Right have no understanding of the First Amendment.
or much of anything else that is socially redeeming, for that matter.
As they say... Republicans - they know the cost of everything, and the value of absolutely nothing.
FormerMarineSgt You misunderstood my comment or perhaps I was not clear. I should have said "It is ok to throw the first amendment out the window as long as you are not referring to a Chic fil a." This is pretty horrible stuff yet somehow we are evil for daring to suggest that chic fil a is somehow in the wrong. That by suggesting a boycott we evil libruls are trampling on the franchises right to oppose equal rights??
I find it ironic that there isa government led campaign to violate religious freedom while at the same time the same people are upset that someone would boycott a chicken franchise due to their stance on what is an equal rights issue.
FYI ...I am pretty left in the whole scheme of things. :)
It is well put Former Marine Sgt, but what's with the name? You're a Marine for life, aren't you?
if you are a business and trying to attract the public, you must keep in mind who your public is. if you offend only 10% of your customers, you might take the risk with your opinion. your customers can vote with their wallets and if you really offend that 10% you know you risk an organized boycott
Well stated and all true FormerMarineSgt. Now, can you tell me why the Tea Party is constantly demonized by liberals and the mainstream media as racist, homophobic and un-American for daring to voice criticism of the current administration's policies?
More specifically, how is that one man's belief in "traditional Bibilcal marriage" is construed by liberals and the mainstream media to be an attack on gays and results in the mayors of places like Boston, Chicago and San Francisco issuing statements saying the restaurants were not welcome in their towns?
Take a look at the rebuttals liberals have posted on this comment board and tell me again how you left-wingers are "tolerant" of positions other than your own.
11B2EB4 - Maybe he is a former sergeant.
Can't expect too much from these redneck inbreds. The trailer parks are alive and well.
Can not expect much from those who are ok with Sharia Law under the cover of "Mosque Building". Get a clue, live in under Sharia Law in parts of Mali or Somalia. You will come back with different thinking in stopping Despotic Sharia Laws.
Geez Kurt - this isn't Mali or Somalia!
b dune, EXACTLY, AND let us KEEP that way by not tolerating Sharia Law here. Only an insane person would tolerate the vast injustice and evilness of Sharia Law here. Let us NOT make the USA anywhere remotely like Sharia Law imposed parts of Mali or Somalia!
shhhh...don'tconfuse people like Kurt with facts or common sense...he still thinks the earth is 7000 years old and some dude named dog created it all in 6 days with a siesta thrown in on the 7th...
@Kurt,
Ignorance can be cured. Bone stupid cannot.
Rick, thanks for your false assumptions, so exactly why are you defending Sharia Law again? What exactly again is so "confusing" in opposing Sharia Law again?
Kurt already knows that because Conservative Christians can get away with violating the Constitition to force thier ways upon all Americans (whether many of the rest of Americans are conservative Christians or not) means that using the same methods that Conservative Christians use, that muslims -could- pull of the same forcing of thier relgion upon everyone else. Sharia law is possible in thier nightmares because they know if the radical conservative extremist muslims were successful in using the same methods that the Conservative Christians use - they could gain power.
Now the good thing is that reality is nothing like that. There is no chance that the proponents of radical Islam could over-run the Constitution like the Conservative Christians try to do. But because the conservative Christians have gotten away with it for sooo long, they appear to be afraid that thier own un-Constitutional methods could be used against them.
I'm not afraid of Joe Average Muslim. Only uninformed and bigoted idiots could possibly be. Radical religious extremists and radical religious conservatives, regardless of the religion - be they radical American conservative Christian or radical conservative Muslim - those I worry about. And yes, there is a substantial difference between the Joe Average from these religions and the radical extremists and radical conservatives who will stop at nothing to get thier way.
I'm with @FormerMarine on this one. Most recently I have been to Turkey and Egypt. I can walk around either country and talk to people, Muslims, and shop in the stores and supermarkets and buy souvineirs in the souks and see the tourist and archeological sites and the Muslims are all friendly and welcoming. In both countries you really have to be careful what you say or you end up drinking tea for two hours while you hear people tell you that they do not believe these things they read in American media.
Yeah, they have their nut cases, but I don't see any denouncing the all-American nut cases who demonstrate at the funerals of fallen service members and claim that their deaths are the result of offending their god. (Small letter intentional.)
I only have one piece of advice for people and their religion: Make sure that your god is one you would want to spend an eternity with. I would be tired of the silly southern baptist god in about 10 minutes.
Do any of you know that the first Muslin into this country was probably 1510.
The TP/conservatives talk about the dreaded Sharia Law (and it is) but they have no problem the same against the women of this country. The white "Christian" males of the south are still clinging to the idea that the woman must bow down to them, etc.
But, the way I read the first book of the Bible. Is that God was so displeased with his first creation, and ripped him apart to create the creature he loved the most. The woman. So Christians get with the facts of the Bible and start with Genesis. Keep going to Genesis 2-7 and you can read when God decided that his creation becomes a living soul. And, if God was so concerned about fetuses why is a female born with hundred thousand eggs and the sperm goes on forever. (off topic I know but bring up the southern conservatives and I see red with their narrow mindedness.) Sorry
Sharia law is so irrelevant here that it makes you TeaLosers look like a gaggle of hand-wringing old women.
This summer I got to go to Gobekli Tepe, the oldest religious structure in the world. It dates to before 9000 BC (over 11,000 years old.) It was thousands of years old when Stonehenge and the Giza Pyramids were built. Seeing religious structures in such a wonderful state of preservation really makes you think that long before Christianity there was Judsism and thousands of years before that there was still religion. It really resonates that the oldest known buildings in the world were not homes, but were religious structures. It's one of those places that makes you stop and think how short the reign of Christianity as a major religion really is --- less than 2,000 out of as much as 15,000 years. It is very humbling.
But for people like @Kurt, it was just something designed by the Disney folks because "everyone" knows that the earth is less than 6,000 years old and man coexisted happily with dinosaurs and such nonsense.
It is stunning and if anyone has a chance to visit it, do so. The site is far more important as a world heritage site than the pyramids or the Ming empoeror's tomb or Stonehenge. It is so much advanced, so very long ago that scientists are still stunned by how far back it turns man's religious clock.
I know this seems off-topic, but religion has been around fopr a very long time and timewise, modern religions Jews, Muslims, Christians, Hindus, etc all are but recent flashes in the pan compared to this wonderful site. Pictures are hard to come by, but here is a good starting place:
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/gobekli-tepe.html
Sharia law is pretty much whatever you want it to be. The Imam of the mosque in new york, near 9/11, is on record as saying that the US Constitution is valid according to Sharia law.
Like most aspects of religion, Sharia seems to be pretty much whatever you want it to be. If you are an intolerant nutcase, your Sharia is just as intolerant. If you are a moderate, your Sharia is just as moderate. The term really doesn't mean anything.
Certainly, in places in divorce court and stuff, Sharia law has a place, because when a judge examines agreements, he or she needs to understand the intent of the participants. If the participants are both practicing Muslims, then Sharia law needs to be examined to see what they meant in their agreements with each other.
But the US isn't about to adjust its laws for anyone, Federal, local or state. As far as I know, here Muslims aren't demanding that either. The only people yelling "Sharia! Sharia!" are the non-Muslim nutcases.
Kudos to you for understanding that. In the family law arbitration arena, Islamic Sharia law has the same effect that Jewish Halacha law has - as long as whatever agreement the participants come up with is consensual, fair to all parties and doesn't violate civil law, the court is just fine with it.
And yet the right wing religious nuts here will cite that as an example of "Sharia law being enforced by a judge", unaware that the same judge will do the same thing with Catholic and Jewish couples who want to use their faith to come to an agreement.
@Byron,
I would add that Louisians uses Napolenonic Code instead of English Common Law as its basis. And I don't hear the GOP nut cases screaming about how "French" law is destroying the country. Napoleonic Code, as enshrined in Louisiana laws, as just one example of difference, established absolute and unquestionable supremacy of a husband over his wife and children --- just like Sharia Law. The code also prohibits judges from refusing justice on grounds of insufficiency of the law, encouraging them to interpret the law. On the other hand, it prohibits judges from passing general judgments of a legislative value, prohibiting them from ruling on the intents of laws.
But that we have "French Law" in Bobby Jindal's state doesn't bother the Tea Party folks. They are very selective in what bothers them. They are okay that Romney had six grandmothers (because Mormon grandfather had five wives.) They just think of that as a lot of too-small sweaters at Christmas.
Clearly it's not your neighborhood that's being affected, or rather infected.
My neighborhood suffers from an infection...of too many churches. Because of the 1st amendment, I lack the power to boot out churches. So why do you have the power to try and stop mosques?
pjam09: Infected with what? Infected with what makes our country great? Freedom of religion?
Yeah, my neighborhood was infected by Talibangelicals, so I moved. Nastiest critters I ever met.
and judgmental as all get out!
Yep.
As Sinclair Lewis wrote:
"When fascism comes to America It'll be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross."
I would only add that it will also be sporting an elephant on its T-shirt.
These 2 idiots will fight to see who can beat Hilter at his game from the past. Wow, has our country sunk so low as to picking on religion and use that as a ladder to climb up? Whats next, gay rights? maybe our right to eat certain foods? oh yea, been there done that... Hope both of these loosers go back to Hell.
Our constitution means @!$%# to the Replublicans. They will use it, abuse it and crap on it as long as it gives them what they want. Yes, very hypicritical. This Diane Black and Zelenik are just plan stupid. They make the south the "Dirty South".
All I can do is laugh. The South lost the Civil War and continues to look for a rematch or some other ethnic group to exploit. Nashville reminds me of the "Dueling Banjos Scene in Deliverance" with the majority of the town using dental floss to clean their ears.
Its pretty funny, I don't remember seeing all this negative hate bashing from the Liberal left, when the Muslims were trying to build a Mosque in New York city,at ground zero. Typical Yankee arrogance ,whats good for the north is not necessarily good for the South. When you want to stop a Mosque being built in your home town, its alright, but if the South protest against it ,then we are a bunch of raciest who don't know the constitution. Can you spell Hypocrite?
@joe,
Is it too late to get in on the "negative hate bashing?" There was no mosque being biuilt at "ground zero." It was several blocks away. The mosque had been there for decades. They only wanted to expand it to include a community center. There were lots of protests, but the courts quashed them all on First Amendment grounds.
Can you spell "raciest" (sic)? And you people crap on the Constitution through your hatred and ignorance. If it people like you who convinced the Founding Fathers that democracy was a bankrupt form of government and should never be used in this country under any circumstances. It is people like you who convinced them to make the House of Representatives the only directly elected office in government and even gave the House the shortest possible term of office. People like you are why that made President, Vice-President. Cabinet, Senate, Military, Judges, and all high federal offices appointed, not directly elected. The Founding Fathers had your number and thought your type was pretty stupid.
I think you are confused. We liberal yankee types were the ones protesting the knuckle draggers that were referring to a community center as the 'ground zero mosque'.
@joe is in a fog of hatred and venom in a world where nothing makes sense to him any more. It's easy to become confused and disoriented in there.
then he'll go out and vote his vast insight...
Frightening, isn't it?
All of you people who responded to my post with such hatred really must be pretty bored with your life. For one thing Chris, sounds like you don't like anything about America,or our founding fathers,therefore, I assume you don't agree with our constitution either,so as far as I'm concerned your opinion means nothing to me. As far as "Toredown", and "severed head in a jar" with names like that ,your opinion doesn't mean much either,seems you are the confused ones. It also seems all of you sure think you know allot about me ,from just one post,WOW are you always so quick to judge people? As far as my post about the Mosque, I never said i agreed with them , as a matter of fact I disagree ,I believe the Muslim's in that community have a right to build a place to worship,I know they do ,its was given to them by our founding fathers, you know Chris,the ones you despise so much.The point i was trying to make is ,people in the North sure seem quick to judge others and are very hypocritical.From all of your responses to my simple post,you verified that for me ,once again.
Yes "Severed head in a jar" you can bet your last dollar, I will go vote,hope you do also,even though that is a scary thought,please don't bring your JAR !!!!!
So, not only do they not realize they are trashing the Constitution, their constituents are kept busy on this debate and not paying attention to real matters.
I weep for America. The demise of our country is well underway, it won't be long now...I doubt we make a tri-centenial.
I am sorry to say it but I am in agreement with you Sadie. The Supreme Court in their Corporations (sic) vs. FEC ruling have put us on the path to a fascist country with the military-industrial complex in control of our government. Now we have the evangelistic agenda taking over our civil rights, i.e. women's rights, marital rights, and our right to practice the religion of our choice. Sad, indeed.
This is not the demise of America. It is just the complete and permanent destruction of the Republican brand. If you want to see how far the GOP has sunk, I suggest you check out the 1956 GOP Platform. This was written when the Eisenhower was about to be re-elected. The GOP had over 70% of the African-American vote and nearly 100% of the gay vote at the time.
http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=25838
The GOP used to call it the "Big Tent" where everyone was welcome. But with the Civil Rights Act, the GOP made a "smoky room" decision to drive women and Blacks and Gays and people with Latino names from the Big Tent and welcome in old white southern males. It was a huge mistake that will cost them more dearly with every future election.
The best proof is that McCain --- a turncoat and traitor who brtrayed his fellow airmen and POWs --- and Mitt Romney --- a non-Christian, non-taxpayer are they absolute best that can do these days. Losers.
All of the moderate and liberal Republicans are quitting the GOP in disgust. One of the last moderate Republicans in the House just called it quits. But in doing so, he waited until after his primary showed that he was an absolute shoo-in for re-election. This handed the election to his Democrat opponent. He would rather see his political rival elected that try to deal with the jerks that the Tea Party are dragging into the House.
The current odds of Obama winning on Nov 6th are 70.8% with Romney as a weak and shrinking 29.2%. If the election were held today, Obama would win with 77% odds. It looks like Obama will pull somewhere between 298 and 330 electoral votes (270 required to win.) So don't get weepy just yet.
Dude, I'm weepy because I don't see the Democrats as better than the Republicans. In reality, it's really just one big party for them that they show as two to the voting public. They both have their little catch ideologies to get the people of 'their' party in an uproar so they can go on doing what they do without people paying attention.
Obama/Romney - in the big picture, it'll just be more of the same. The corporate backers are the ones in control.
Both candidates should be thrown out. What they're doing, for the reasons they're doing it are just downright illegal.
Gosh, which is what, exactly???
It's not illegal, it's their opinion. Unless, since it's not PC, they can't have it and talk about it?
They're entitled to an opinion, but it still makes me ashamed to live in Tennessee. Most of my neighbors here are nice people, but our leadership is sometimes shameful. We don't see politicians here wanting to ban churches, and rightly, just because a few priests are perverts. But it doesn't hold for Muslims, a few of which in a far corner of the world condone violence.
Damned politicians, not only exploiting, but promoting hatred and bigotry.
>>Muslims, a few of which<<
Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Qur'an
should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."
-Omar Ahmad , Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR) co-founder/ Board Chairman, 1998.
We are worried about islam taking unapropriate hold in America, due to us being too nice and to PC to say "no". I believe: There is no plausible defense for a belief system that promotes polygamy, pedophilia (Mohammed married a six year old), incest (Mohammed married first cousins), misogyny, murder (honor killings, religous "hit-contracts" AKA: Fatwahs), genocide (jihad) and lying, cheating, and stealing in the name of God: Islam is not a religion at all, but a cult. While other major religions of the world may have on occasion committed horrible crimes in violation of their central tenets, Islam commits horrible crimes precisely because they are central tenets!
The part that is illegal is nothing to do with their opinion. It's the fact that they are using prejudice to directly link a religion with terrorism and extremist to keep them out of their community.
Do you really think Christianity is any better off? "Good" Christians are some of the most hateful, hypocritical people I've ever met in my life. It hasn't stopped Churches from being built on every corner, or even Christian beliefs from making their way into the government (against the constitution) for the purpose of forcing them on everyone else.
I'm surprised they haven't banned pork yet. Oh wait, Christians choose to ignore that bit of their Bible.
In the words of Tim Pawlenty, "this is chilling". Both of these people are running on a position of limiting religious freedom in the United States. This is truely chilling.
Not theirs though...the talibangelicals want to impose their own brand of sharia on the rest of us disguised as some patriotic tripe
Normally I'd say this is politicians behaving badly, but after learning about more political history of America, this is just a continuation of our fine traditions. There was a time that Catholics in power would be the demise of America (looking at YOU, Santorum). A communist was in every shadowy corner, not being able to legally kill and beat up homosexuals would cause everyone to turn gay, single mothers were the greatest threat to the American family and institution of marriage, and now, it's the muslims turn to be the political scapegoats.
What's the greatest threat to America going to be next guys?
Redheads. Because the satanic hellfires that consume their souls are the reason their hair isn't the proper blonde.
Maybe that's why I'm so attracted to them.
Typical Rightwing racists from the South hate all minorities,foreigners,gays and anyone who's not a Rightwing Bible thumping redneck. Still fighting the Civil war no doubt. So glad I had relatives who were in the Union Army and killed many CONfederate traitors who enslaved innocent people to make a buck.
Tonywarvet, What is about Sharia Law you want in the USA again? If you had any clue about Sharia Law, you would "hate" Sharia Law in the USA. Try living in Sharia Law imposed areas of Somalia or Mali, you be wishing you be back in the USA & would "hate" Sharia Law into our society.
Kurt, We are becoming a nation where evangelicals want to take over our rights. They are more rabid in their fanaticism than Muslims are with Sharia law.
Kurt, this isn't Somalia or Mali, and we aren't talking about those places. No one said anyone is welcoming Sharia Law, but just that imposing their brand of Sharia isn't okay either in this country.
Still much better than the Anti-America contest the Democrats wage against taxpayers.
pjam09: I cannot think of a more anti-American action than infringing upon U.S. citizens' freedom of religion.
@Kurt,
Hate is an acid that harms the vessel that holds it more than those on which it is thrown.
Diidja know that there is one state in this country that already has a system of laws that is different from the other 49 states? I'll toss you a bone if you can identify the state ..... come on boy, you can do it, come on .... just wag your tail.
Get a grip, Kurt.
@Chris... Louisiana? They follow the Napoleonic code instead of the Anglo precedents-based laws, a holdover from the French.
"Louisiana is unique among the 50 U.S. states in having a legal system primarily based on French and Spanish codes and ultimately Roman law, as opposed to English common law. Louisiana thus follows the system of most non-Anglophone countries in the world." - Wikipedia (Louisiana Law)
That's affirmative ----- its French Law! And in a quote from Wikipedia, "In the Persian Gulf Arab states of the Middle East, the influence of the Napoleonic code mixed with hints of Islamic law is clear, even in Saudi Arabia (which abides more towards Islamic law). In Kuwait, for example, property rights, women's rights, and the education system can be seen as Islamic reenactments of the French civil code. Some of these aspects can be seen in other Persian Gulf Arab states (although less pronounced than in Kuwait), this primarily being due to the relatively democratic nature of Kuwait, rather than the absolutist nature of many other Persian Gulf nations." French Law is right next to Sharia Law. And Bobby Jindal is the leader of the French/Sharia Law advocates --- a Republican!
So you could make a good case that it is the Republican Party that is, using Louisiana as its headquarters, and Bobby Jindal as its "CEO" that are bringing French/Sharia Law into this country. Louisiana is alreasy in the hands of French surrenderists and Sharia lawyers and your state might be next! (Looking at Texas!)
So who here is going to defend Sharia Law in "Honor Killings", Stoning to death, death to other religious thinking, and no driving for women? Go ahead & have this Sharia Law Supporting Mosque, just first try living under Taliban Rule or Sharia Law sections of Mali or Somalia. I bet you come back opposing this Sharia Law Mosque also. Inshalla, we have no Sharia Law introduced into our Judicial System.
Kurt, you are off topic. No one is going to go live anywhere. We are talking about TN. Focus.
Exactly Ram, we all do NOT want TN to become even remotely like Sharia Law parts of Somalia nor Mali. Sharia Law does not belong in the USA unless you want injustice in our society, then yes, bring on Sharia Law to TN.
We already have and have had injustice in our Society!
Read the article, Kurt, this is not about bringing Sharia Law to TN.
Kurt, were you talking about the Old Testament or the New Testament when you talked about stonings? And, what of Saint Paul's view of the role of women?
I am a Christian. However, I do not believe that women should be subject to a man. I also disagree with the Biblical teachings that it is right to own slaves if you treat them in some certain way.
Our system of laws should be different than Christian or Sharia or any other theistic law. It should reflect our ever evolving sense of equality and freedom. In short, our laws should define our pursuit of life, liberty and happiness.
Uhm, Lost, for claiming to be a "Christian", I guess you missed out about Jesus comments regarding Stoning in the Book of ACTs. HINT, it is EXACTLY the opposite of Sharia Law. Jesus' Gift of Salvation and Grace is exactly the opposite of Sharia Law which I am sure "Christians" like you would realize.
So tell us, Kurt, how does building a mosque equate to imposing Shariah law? Does building a synagogue impose the Laws of Moses? Does building a Mormon temple impose Mormon laws on anyone?
As a proud member of the American Taliban, Kurt is opposed to uppercase Islamic Sharia law but not lowercase Christian sharia law.
So, @Kurt, are you boycotting Chik-Fil-A where they are advocating for "Biblical marriage" that includes five wives and stoning women to death for any infraction including not being a virgin when they married? Before advocating for these things, it would be good to go back and ready yuour Bible. I will believe that you oppose Sharia Law when I see you outside Red Lobster stoning shrimp-eaters to death as your Bible requires. You cannot bad-mouth Sharia Law when "Christian Law" is virtually the same. But, wait, you may be right === Sharia Law only permits four wives while Christian Law permits five wives. But not to worry, Christian Law allows you to stone the extra wife to death is there is a question.
Uhm, Chris, I guess you never read the book of ACTs in the Bible regarding Jesus comments of Stoning. Sure there are reports of mulitple wives and stoning in the Bible to show life before Jesus teachings. NBC reporting the atrocities of the Assad Regime does not mean NBC supports the Assad Regime. Chris, I have live in a place where 4 wives are legal and Stoning is legal, guess what, to your shock, it is an Islamic country. By the Way, where is your link of Jesus "allowing to stone the extra wife", I would not like that as Obama's own mother would be stoned as Obama Sr already had a wife back in Kenya.
@Kurt,
Then you should buddy up with Romney. You will enjoy all the stories about Christ ministering to the American Indians as a "lost tribe of Israel" and then turning them brown and making them forget Hebrew because they refused to follow him. You will enjoy all that stuff as the new President Romney is sworn in on the Book of Mormon.
My guess would be that NBC reporting the atrocities of Assad would show a LACK of support of Assad. I guess I see the same thing exactly 180 degrees from you. You see showing the atrocities as siding with Assad. I see them as showing what a horrible your buddy, Assad, is. And because the Christians in Syria threw in their lot by choice with the Assads decades ago, those Christians are probably walking dead men. No because of their religion, but because they sided with torturers ands murderers. Paybacks are hell!
You have to remember that your buddy, Romney had SIX grandmothers since his father had five mothers. So you live in a country where a non-Christian guy with six grandmothers can run for President and you're bitching about Obama??????? Idiot.
>>Read the article, Kurt, this is not about bringing Sharia Law to TN.<<
That's right. The lawmakers want to be sure it doesn't become something our judges can legally base laws on. It is not about limiting religion, it's about limiting the influence of islamic religious law, which is becoming more and more the norm here in the land of the PC.
Frankly, it scares us. I do not want to have to shoot "religous police" on my doorstep, which would happen if sharia is imposed. Look at the MB in Egypt for a great example of what could happen here. While it is not likely, I admit, even a small chance is too much of a chance.
And yes, I am islamophobic, and plan on staying that way. No, I am not a "christian", nor am I an atheist. Just someone who pays attention to history. Rome was destroyed from within. . . .
Are you saying that Rome was destroyed by Islam?
No, islam did not exist back then. There were other internal reasons, such as outsourcing and the populace believing no one could hurt them because no one ever had. The Romans outsourced their military. Romans believed they were above it all, and other cultures shouldn't be a threat because their system was too ingrained and "right" to be changed by the "other".
They did not see the threat because they believed they were immune, just like those here in the US with their heads in the sand. Well, if you don't open your eyes. . . . we will be disemboweled from within. By islam.
Everytime I read something about the lunatic fringe in this country, I fully understand how the US has reached such a low point on the international education scale. Educated(formal or self) people actually think before they speak, whereas these idiots just spew word sh!t over everything.
PJ, what exactly is so "Lunatic Fringe" to oppose Sharia Law? Actually, those who think it is ok to have Sharia Law in the USA under the cover of "Mosque Building" are the REAL Lunatic Fringe.
As I said, Kurt. TN. US.
Ram, you did NOT answer my question, what exactly is wrong with opposing Sharia Law in the USA (or anywhere in the world for that matter)? Only the Lunatic Fringe of Political Correctness in the USA would "tolerate" Sharia Law so long as it applied to other people
We don't enforce Sharia law in the U.S. If someone were to perform an "honor killing" they would be tried and convicted of manslaughter, and sent to prison. Please show me an instance in the U.S. where Sharia law is being practiced in the courts.
Well said Eclecticist.
Yes, @Kurt, you ARE a part of the lunatic fringe. Period. You can't make a religion out of hate (yours or somneone else's) any more than you can make a silk purse from a sow's ear. I cannot conceive how any church that would have you as a member would ever welcome a "libtard" like Christ into their midst. To you, Christ was just a hippy, most likely gay, bleeding heart liberal sissy democrap.
@Eclectist,
Well stated. But if Christ were to ask fundamentalist Christians, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." he would be be immediately stoned to death.
But think for a moment about George Zimmerman and "honor killing." Isn't that exactly his defense? Maybe the right wing has already given us Sharia Law disguised as fascism.
>>Please show me an instance in the U.S. where Sharia law is being practiced in the courts.<<
See: New Jersey case of “S.D. v. M.J.R. (N.J. Super. Ct. App. Div.)” In this recent case, a judge declared Rape acceptable because of Muslim cultural traditions.
The Quran gives husbands supreme authority over a woman.
Muhammad said: "If a husband calls his wife to his bed [i.e. to have sexual relations] and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning" He also said: "By Him in Whose Hand lies my life, a woman can not carry out the right of her Lord, till she carries out the right of her husband. And if he asks her to surrender herself [to him for sexual intercourse] she should not refuse him even if she is on a camel's saddle" further "
How do you feel about Sharia Law being implemented in America? ITS ALREADY HAPPENING?
by unss94 » Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:57 am
NJ Judge Rules Muslim Man's Right to Rape As Religious Freedom.
Liberals running interference for Islam while bashing Christianity and Judiasm, can see the results of their Sharia friendly liberal judge activism in the New Jersey case of “S.D. v. M.J.R. (N.J. Super. Ct. App. Div.)” In this recent case, a judge declared Rape acceptable because of Muslim cultural traditions.
The Quran gives husbands supreme authority over a woman.
Muhammad said: "If a husband calls his wife to his bed [i.e. to have sexual relations] and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning" He also said: "By Him in Whose Hand lies my life, a woman can not carry out the right of her Lord, till she carries out the right of her husband. And if he asks her to surrender herself [to him for sexual intercourse] she should not refuse him even if she is on a camel's saddle"
But this is America and you would think that American criminal and Constitutional law would prohibit rape. Well, as Sharia slowly attempts to make inroads, pillars of justice are beginning to crumble.
In New Jersey, a judge saw no evidence that a Muslim committed sexual assault of his wife, NOT because he didn’t do it, but because he was acting on his Islamic beliefs. In denying the woman an Order of Protection, the judge stated:
"This court does not feel that, under the circumstances, that this defendant had a criminal desire to or intent to sexually assault or to sexually contact the plaintiff when he did. The court believes that he was operating under his belief that it is, as the husband, his desire to have sex when and whether he wanted to, was something that was consistent with his practices and it was something that was not prohibited."
and:
and:
Janet Levy, a prolific writer on Islam and national security, asks why Islam “is sacred, supreme and beyond reproach” in the United States, while other religions are “freely criticized, lampooned in cartoons and denigrated in artwork?” She concludes America is already embracing de facto Shariah law.
“Our uniquely American virtues of tolerance and freedom have worked against us to produce intolerance and oppression,” Levy says. “This has led to the stealthy introduction of Shariah law and a climate in which criticisms of Mohammed and Islam are no longer possible without serious repercussions.”
What a major load of paranoid crock. I don't see the Muslims calling for restrictions on women's or gay's rights, just conservative Christians, who are not only acting outside of the tenets of their religion, but are acting as un-American as anyone possibly could.
>>I don't see the Muslims calling for restrictions on women's or gay's rights<<
OMG, you aren't paying attention. Attend a mosque sometime. Everywhere in the world they rule, gays are not just looked down on, they are murdered. Infidels are murdered. Women are chattel. Child females are raped and forced t marry and have their clits removed. Read the freaking news, the MB in Egypt is proudly stating these same things, and the democratic process has given them this power!!!
Good lord man, open your eyes!! But I guess I'm just paranoid, these things aren't really happening, and they couldn't happen here. . . .
Let me guess these people running for office in Tenesee ar "good" Christians no doubt. I know they would hate Jesus being he was a dark skinned Middle Eastern man who hung out with the poor,the sick and the outcasts of society that Rightwingers HATE!
Tony, if you had to live under Sharia Law, you also would "hate" Sharia Law. Only a lunatic would "tolerate" the gross injustice of Sharia Law.
Kurt... You still don't get the comparicism between the Evangelical agenda and Sharia law do you?
Louie, I get it 100%, One is about the gift of Salvation and Grace while the other is about "earning" your way to "goodness". Too bad, one of them does not realize one always falls short of "goodness" no matter how "good" they are. The difference between the groups is more than night and day.
Kurt, are you saying that because you believe your religion's message is about "Salvation and Grace", it is OK to push your views onto others?
What about the rights of us non-Christians who are also Americans?
Hey @Kurt ---- gonna vote for Romney? He's not a Christian and his religion wants to make everyone in this country give up their coffee? How about his underwear? Gonna vote for a man who will not discuss his underwear or what is embroidered on them? Gonna vote for a man whose church leadership has "visions" every time the IRS audits them and threatens to take their tax exemption away? Didja know that Romney has SIX grandmothers --- that's a crapload of too-small sweaters at Christmas?
Or is your "raciest" (sic) hatred of Obama such that you would even vote for a Muslin?
Kurt, if you were to live with a jagged boulder up your rectum, you would "hate" jagged boulders. Get the analogy? Probably not.
This is your own brand of fanaticism, if you want nothing to be good enough, then yes, nothing is going to be good enough.
Your salvation and grace isn't free either - one has to make certain commitments in order to be get it.
In reality, there's very little difference between your religions.
These two are engaged in a "dumb off" - either one has an extremely good chance of winning. Either way, it's Tennessee that loses.
How do you know if your a racist? You mention Sharia law. I bet all you racists would look stunning in a cape and hood! And guess what: you can't be a "good" Christian and a racist at the same time! Who would jesus hate? If you watch Faux News and listen to Rush and all pure racist haters,I know where you got this attitude from.
Tony, as someone who has ACTUALLY lived under Sharia Law in the Middle East for 4 years. I can assure you, opposing Sharia Laws in the US has nothing to do with race. No need to play the race card for you know Sharia Law would be awful in the USA but use can not admit the truth so you resort to the race card. Inshalla, people like TONYWARVET, will see Sharia Law for what it really is rather than resort to the racecard when race is not the issue.
Kurt, isn't it so cool you know all about this. This is TN, not all the places you supposedly lived, so your arguments don't work here.
Ram, I accept your naviety about Sharia Law, if you actually lived in an area I have (not supposedly), you would realize the dangers of Sharia Laws.
Kurt, where in the article is anyone supporting bringing Sharia law to TN?
Hey @Kurt, didja know that your man Rush and Fox News are banned from Canada? "Canada’s Radio Act requires that “a licenser may not broadcast … any false or misleading news.” The provision has kept Fox News and right-wing talk radio out of Canada and helped make Canada a model for freedom. As a result of that law, Canadians enjoy high quality news coverage, including the kind of foreign affairs and investigative journalism that flourished in this country before Ronald Reagan abolished the “Fairness Doctrine” in 1987."
And Canada has the dreaded national health care and just stiffened their immigration laws to ban "medical tourism and immigration to take advantage of Canada's superior health care system. In fact, both these are cited as among the reasons why Canada has passed the United States not only in health care, but average net worth, per capita savings, education, and overall standard of living. The Canadians are becoming concerned about Americans slipping across the border into Canada as illegal immigrants. As a result they are tightening their border controls, especially along the swath of Montana/North Dakota and the "Windsor crossing" and Vancouver.
Or is Canada another one of those areas where the facts confuse you because they don't match your ill-informed opinions.
The major problem in this country is that about 25% of the people engage constantly in religion-inspired hate speech. It is like trying to sail with your anchors out.
Chris, you are so full of CRAP, your eyes have to be brown.
If Canada allows CNN to broadcast there, then they allow you to report lies. If what you say is true ,which it is not, then Canada does not have the Freedom of speech we enjoy in the good ole USA. Glad i don't live there , I can hear two sides of the story, not just the one the Government want me to hear.
There're meds for all you Sharia law lunatics!
I'd rather hang out with peaceful Muslims then Rightwing Biblethumpers. the Muslims are much nicer and kinder! And less racist too!
Your comment sounded exactly like a typical Taliban statement. The Taliban are proud & appreciate your comments.
Kurt, open your eyes, sweetheart, people here are trying to tell you that this article is about two women running for office in Tennessee. As far as Sharia Law, the Christians of the south, Indiana, Kansas, Missouri, Texas (I guess Texas would be south?) etc are bringing the Sharia Law to the United States. They are not about Christian values, they are about restraining women to their belief, you know, like the Taliban.
So, Kurt, lets go back to the topic of the article. Politics make good reading. P.S. The Constitution makes for good reading also. Try it.
there will be no Sharia law(s) injected into our current laws until the Muslims become a majority in our country which, if it ever happens, will be a long ,long time from now. We'll all be dust in our graves by then. And, by then the laws that are written excluding Sharia law will just be overturned. This is a ridiculous waste of time and these 2 women make a mockery out of our election process. I'm more against them than you are. No you're not. Yes, I am. Nuh uh. Uh huh....
Well said, Paul. Well said.
No sharia injected - tell that to the Somali cab drivers up in Minnesota, who have tried to refuse to carry people who have alcohol or ham sandwiches. And tell it to the women who have been murdered in this country by their muslime husbands or brothers, as an "honor killilng". Or to prison wardens who have to provide special meals to muslime prisoners.
@WychDoctor: read your own comments carefully. Where in there was anything from Shariah law applied as law or as a legal precedent? Honor killings are considered murder here, always. The reason for the killing is called "motive", and does not and never will *justify* the act. The cab drivers *tried* to follow their *own* rules. No state law requires anyone to follow their rules, and even *they* were not able to follow them in this case. As for special meals, that's hardly imposing Sharia law on anyone. It's not forcing Muslims (or Jews!) to eat food that is strictly forbidden to them. It's not saying that anyone else has to eat that way.
I have heard of those cab drivers. More often than not, they get disciplinary action and lose business when they refuse certain customers. Honor killings are tried as murder in this country, compared to actual muslim countries where they are likely to be excused. Prison wardens also serve special meals to Jews, prisoners with food allergies, required special diets, and vegetarians.
Point?
Amazing, how all the liberals here are foaming at the mouth because people oppose Islamic laws and the intolerance it has for women and their rights, but will still babble about how tolerant they are. Where are all the women's rights groups - you happy with women being reduced to animal status? Do we have a report from the National Organization for Women chapter in Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan?
This isn't about Sharia Law and it isn't about Islamic law. It's about TN and the fact that they have just as much right to have that place as you do to have your First Baptist church building. As long as they don't break US laws they can be here just as the snake-handlers, the Methodists, the COC, and anyone else.
Again, Ram, does not get it. This is about a Sharia Law supporting Mosque. Only the Politcally Correct Lunatic Fringe in the US would tolerate Sharia Law such as Honor Killings and Stoning to Death (so long as applied to someone else). Any reasonable person would not tolerate Sharia Law anywhere near the US (nor anywhere in the world)
The Christians are already suppressing women's rights. I think they're just afraid that Islam does it better.
Anyone is free to practice ANY religion, no matter what you or anyone else thinks of it. That's in the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States. Do you reject that document?
Hi, Wytch, the women of the United States and the men who love them, do not have to go to Saudi or Afghanistan to know about Sharia Law, we have it first hand with all the "laws" being passed against us by the wonderful Christian Taliban. You know them, they go by the name of Tea Party/Republicans.
To say the Tea Party of Limited Government and Taxation is the same as Sharia Law, is naive at best (no matter what you think of either). Of course, "Christian Taliban" is an oxymoron as best because the actual real Taliban loves killing Christians.
@Kurt,
Actually the Taliban are far, far more anti-India than anti-American. Their world is so limited that there is only one enemy ---- India and one issue ---- Kashmir. You have them mixed up with others, maybe al-Quaeda. Or you of the "a raghead is a raghead" ilk?
And claiming to have "lived" in a country is you were on a US base in the military is somewhat specious since the bases are all still US soil just like an embassy. Somehow, I would not believe that you ever "lived" anywhere outside of your small town trailer park. You show such a limited view of life that it is a dead giveaway.
Kurt, you seem to think I don't get it. I think you wear your supposed immersion and amazing knowledge of living there as some kind of badge. You have repeated it over and over and over throughout this thread. So? You repeat the same old rhetoric as those who haven't been anywhere, so no, I don't take you seriously.
Perhaps you didn't read the article carefully or you are on a mission to prevent something that isn't even what this is about, but we all saw your posts that are all the same one recycled. No one here said we are voting Sharia law in or allowing it, so you are on the wrong thread. No, having a mosque doesn't mean Sharia law is here any more than having a synagogue makes a town suddenly Israel or a Catholic church the Vatican. I am personally much more afraid of religious fervor from those who are from this country taking over the government and trying to make everyone live as they do than I am of Sharia law being enforced in the US any time soon.
But we got your point that you feel this way and it really isn't necessary to repeat your dire warnings every other post, k?
All the muslims I have met are much nicer then Rightwing Rednecks,especially the Southern Rednecks.
TONYWARVET, those Al-Queda people you met are just like everyone else except those "Rednecks". Al-Queda appreciate your comments of you hating Americans.
So all Muslims are automatically members of Al-Queda?
Does that mean that all Baptists are automatically members of the KKK?
It seems funny to me that most of the people afraid of Sharia law are men - you know, the ones who would hold all the power.
They're the same folks who think the government should prohibit gay marriage because of their bible-bible.
Apparently they lack a sense of irony.
Muslims participate in anti-American "contests" every day. I guess this is OK with liberals.
Nice spin Tony...
It's called turn the other cheek, Jesus taught that (for all the Christians out there). Liberals seem to act more in accordance to Christ's teaching than Conservatives...lol
Harl60. Wait a minute. I a very Liberal and I am a Christian. You should have said. Liberals are more conservative in accordance to Christ's teaching than conservatives.
Can't understand why a woman would vote against themselves, their daughters, their nieces and their friends.
GREAT POST!
Kurt
Good grief....how many times do you need to remind us you lived in a country with Sharia Laws?
I can only assume you "chose" to live there!
b dune, thanks for your concern regarding my comments. I accept you being naive regarding how evil Sharia Law is as you have have not actually lived under Sharia Law. Inshalla, I hope you NEVER will
Since I live in the US of A Kurt - I'm sure I won't!
btw - there are alot of "laws" across the World that are "evil"....do you see them in our Country?
* So, did you "choose" to live in a Country with Sharia Laws?
dune:
We have sharia laws too
(1) We hate gays
(2) We are taught not to tolerate other religions
(3) We descriminate against women and molet them all the time
What do you not like about sharia that christians do not practice in one or other form?
Christians don't hate gays we don't agree! We tolerate other religions unless they want to put us down! I like women and I don't molest them! What christians are you talking about! Must be people that are too lazy to go the church and claim to be christians. Wrong dead wrong not taught at my church or school!
billof,
until the late 18th Century Christianity treated women as property not as people. Women were supposed to be subservient to their husbands, to fulfill their marital obligations, and not talk back to their husbands. The religion also persecuted free thinking women. Read up on the Witch Trials or take a peek at the Malleus Maleficarum.
>>until the late 18th Century Christianity treated women as property<<
Exactly, UNTIL the late 18 century. Islam is still doing it to this day, and they have been since 700AD.