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Subscribe to RSSOpponents of the health care law said Congress' power to regulate commerce didn't extend to people who choose not to buy something; the court's conservatives disagreed. Chief Justice John Roberts did decide, however, that the law was a legitimate use of the congressional power to tax. NBC's Pete Williams reports.
Updated at 11:55 a.m. ET: In a dramatic victory for President Barack Obama, the Supreme Court upheld the 2010 health care law Thursday, preserving Obama’s landmark legislative achievement.
The majority opinion was written by Chief Justice John Roberts, who held that the law was a valid exercise of Congress’s power to tax.
Roberts re-framed the debate over health care as a debate over increasing taxes. Congress, he said, is “increasing taxes” on those who choose to go uninsured.
Poll: Do you agree with Supreme Court ruling on health care law?
Tom Goldstein of the SCOTUS blog breaks down the Supreme Court's ruling on health care. Also, when asked why Chief Justice John Roberts upheld the law, Goldstein said, "I think he believed it."
Click here for the text of the ruling
The 2010 law, the Affordable Care Act, requires non-exempted individuals to maintain a minimum level of health insurance or pay a tax penalty.
The essence of Roberts’s ruling was:
• “The Affordable Care Act is constitutional in part and unconstitutional in part,” Roberts wrote.
• “The individual mandate cannot be upheld as an exercise of Congress’s power under the Commerce Clause. That Clause authorizes Congress to regulate interstate commerce, not to order individuals to engage in it.”
• But “it is reasonable to construe what Congress has done as increasing taxes on those who have a certain amount of income, but (who) choose to go without health insurance. Such legislation is within Congress’s power to tax.”
Roberts made a point of noting that he and the other justices “possess neither the expertise nor the prerogative to make policy judgments. Those decisions are entrusted to our Nation’s elected leaders, who can be thrown out of office if the people disagree with them. It is not our job to protect the people from the consequences of their political choices.”
Click here for Twitter reactions to the ruling
In a landmark ruling, the Supreme Court upholds President Obama's national health-care insurance act. NBC's Pete Williams reports. TODAY's Matt Lauer discusses the ruling with NBC's Savannah Guthrie and David Gregory, host of "Meet the Press."
The law, Roberts wrote, “makes going without insurance just another thing the Government taxes, like buying gasoline or earning income. And if the mandate is in effect just a tax hike on certain taxpayers who do not have health insurance, it may be within Congress’s constitutional power to tax.”
Jason Reed / Reuters
A sharply divided Supreme Court on Thursday upheld the centerpiece of Obama's signature healthcare overhaul law that requires that most Americans get insurance by 2014 or pay a financial penalty.
He said “The question is not whether that is the most natural interpretation of the mandate, but only whether it is a ‘fairly possible’ one.”
He said the Supreme Court precedent is that “every reasonable construction” of a law passed by Congress “must be resorted to, in order to save a statute from unconstitutionality.”
Dems cheer high court as galvanized GOP vows 'full repeal'
Veteran Supreme Court lawyer Tom Goldstein told NBC’s Pete Williams that “the Affordable Care Act was saved by Chief Justice John Roberts.”
Claire McAndrew of Washington, left, and Donny Kirsch of Washington celebrate outside the Supreme Court in Washington, D.C., Thursday, after a the court's ruling on health care.
Goldstein said the Obama administration “got the one vote they really needed in Chief Justice John Roberts.”
When he served in the Senate in 2005, Obama voted against confirming Roberts as chief justice, arguing that he lacked empathy for underdogs and “he has far more often used his formidable skills on behalf of the strong in opposition to the weak.”
(Twenty-one other Democratic senators, including Joe Biden, also voted against confirming Roberts. Twenty-two Democratic senators voted to confirm him.)
Obama hailed his victory: “The highest court in the land has now spoken. We will continue to implement this law and we'll work together to improve on it where we can.”
But he urged Americans to refrain from re-fighting "the political battles of two years ago" or trying to "go back to the way things were.”
The four justices joining Roberts in upholding the law were Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Stephen Breyer, Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan.
The dissenting justices were Justices Antonin Scalia, Anthony Kennedy, Clarence Thomas and Samuel Alito.
For individuals who choose to not comply with the individual insurance mandate, Congress deliberately chose to make the penalty fairly weak: only $95 for 2014; $325 for 2015; and $695 in 2016.
After 2016, that $695 amount is indexed to the consumer price index.
Congress specifically did not allow the use of liens and seizures of property as methods of enforcing the penalty.
Non-compliance with the mandate is also not subject to criminal or civil penalties under the Tax Code and interest does not accrue for failure to pay the penalty in a timely manner, according to the congressional Joint Committee on Taxation.
Chief Justice Roberts announces the Supreme Court's opinion in health care law
NBC's Pete Williams reported that Roberts reasoned that “there’s no real compulsion here” since those who do not pay the penalty for not having insurance can’t be sent to jail. “This is one of the scenarios that administration officials had considered that if the court did this they would consider it a big victory,” Williams said.
In his reaction to the court’s decision, Republican presidential contender Mitt Romney said, “What the court did today was say that Obamacare does not violate the Constitution. What they did not do was say that Obamacare is good law or that it's good policy.”
He said the ruling had made it clear “If we want to get rid of Obamacare, we're going to have replace President Obama.”
But in a major victory for the states who challenged the law, the court said that the Obama administration cannot coerce states to go along with the Medicaid insurance program for low-income people.
The financial pressure which the federal government puts on the states in the expansion of Medicaid “is a gun to the head,” Roberts wrote.
“A State that opts out of the Affordable Care Act’s expansion in health care coverage thus stands to lose not merely ‘a relatively small percentage’ of its existing Medicaid funding, but all of it,” Roberts said.
Congress cannot “penalize States that choose not to participate in that new program by taking away their existing Medicaid funding,” Roberts said.
The Medicaid provision is projected to add nearly 30 million more people to the insurance program for low-income Americans -- but the court’s decision left states free to opt out of the expansion if they choose.
Yeah!!!!
That was a surprise from a right leaning court.
Decision Day was in March 2010... everything else is just whining.
Many of the critics (Republicans) are in an uproar about a black man that has made so much history in his first four years, thus giving other black people hope... Republicans can't allow that to happen since we are supposed to be subservient followers.
Oh well, better get used to it. This November, President Obama will hand the Republican Party their Platform on a platter.
Roberts realized it was a good law and the other Republicans on the SC were acting out of party loyalty. Those guys will go down in Judicial History in infamy.
GOOD NEWS ROMNEY . . . Both your health Care Law and the similar ObamaCare are both legal. Yeah.
Now you can go away Mitt.
And this is the same court that ruled on Citizens United. Strange times...
Obama 2012! Yeah buddy! One major feather in the cap!
In a week this won't be news anymore.
Yes we can, and yes we did!
I take back some of the mean things I've said about Roberts. SOME of them, not all. There's still that Citizens United ruling.
Was watching MSNBC, CNN and FOX.....MSNBC was the only station to wait and not put out bogus information. Both CNN and FOX said the Individual Mandate had been struck down and had to eat a little crow.
Obama/Biden 2012!!!!!
I would like to point out, they argued this as a TAX!!
so as senior bush said no new taxes, so did obama.
and now his tax is mandatory for all!!!
The government can now make you buy a consumer good. This is going to get ugly!
Romney cannot win election now. Mandate will bring down prices. Look and study and Japanese healthcare law. Healthcare cost is outrageous right now and this might bring it down by saying everyone needs to buy insurance just like car insurance if people are driving.
we have just moved to a socialist entity
SUCK IT TEA PARTY
Sorry, but you've been whining all along that Obamacare was "unconstitutional"
Well GUESS WHAT?
...
O B A M A C A R E
I S
C O N S T I T U T I O N A L
Supreme court rules that we all must pay for the murder of babies!
So, for the record, here we have a so called “Constitutional” lawyer and his ilk who spent 18 months shoving this overreaching bill down everyone’s throat. Nice job folks with the thinking a community organizing lawyer from Chicago had what it takes to be a real leader.
Now imagine where we’d be if that time were spent on JOBS, IMMIGRATION, MEDICARE, MEDICAID, SOCIAL SECURITY FIX, REAL HEALTHCARE (you know where tort reform and cross state competition among ins. providers, and no deals with big pharma are involved), BALANCING A BUDGET, ETC.
Obama has been an absolute, unmitigated disaster, a total failed experiment. Socialism doesn’t work folks, never has never will. You dolts on the government take had best get ready to turn off Oprah / Jerry Springer, get off the couch and get ready to get your lazy asses back to work.
The gravy “O” train is coming to an end!!
The ignoring of the Constitution is coming to an end!!
The ignoring of laws that some have been sworn to uphold is coming to an end!!
I’ll take a successful businessman with integrity all day long over a failed ACORN training community organizer please.
ROMNEY – 2012 (The Re-Igniting of American Pride)
Wow! Shocked.
Ever notice that the "right leaning" justices give opinions going both ways depending on the case but the "left leaning" justices never go against their ideology. Who are the real ideologues on this Court?
TOTALLY expected SCOTUS to hand a gift to Mitt, Boner, and Yertle the Turtle over in the Senate. Color me surprised -- pleasantly.
Fiesty, Quick.. Sell me an umbrella...conservative exploding peabrains are raining down all over the place...
Yay!!!
I can stop paying for health insurance now!!!
Wake up now!
Don't worry. The government will never be able to make right wingers buy a clue.
STEPHANOPOULOS: I wanted to check for myself. But your critics say it is a tax increase.
OBAMA: My critics say everything is a tax increase. My critics say that I'm taking over every sector of the economy. You know that. Look, we can have a legitimate debate about whether or not we're going to have an individual mandate or not, but…
STEPHANOPOULOS: But you reject that it’s a tax increase?
OBAMA: I absolutely reject that notion.
Not all of it was upheld, which is what everyone was concernced about in the first place. The main complaint was that the government had overstepped it's authority, and the supreme court agreed! Also, the mandate DOES equate to a tax, another lie told by President Obama! It is a TAX and it should be treated as a tax, not another smoke screen.
IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Welcome to the age of 15% increases to medical insurance, next year 7%, the year after 10% then in the following years 15% and higher. We won't get the reductions in premiums we were promised when the bill was passed but people don't seem to remember that promise.
LMAO
I wonder how many of those old fart Tea Baggers are in the ER right now, having heart attacks at this news, and billing their treatments to Medicare while decrying socialized medicine?
Personal freedom in America died today. Welcome to the Totalitarian Federal Government of America. What state will have the balls to tell the Federal Government to go f*ck themselves and secede? I will join that state and defend it to the death.
@OMG....Obama didn't say it was a tax, but Roberts found justification by calling it a tax!
So what happens to Obama since the majority of Americans don't want the law?
Here comes the HUGE tax increase that Obama said would not happen.!!
Every household just had their taxes raised by approx. $4000.00 per year, make sure you celebrate that too.
LouisJ - your comment is unjustifiable. Just because some people disagree with Obama's agenda doesn't mean they are trying to hold down Black people. I'm sick of these ridiculous conclusions. People have the right disagree with a President's policies. Just who is you are trying to enslave when you disagree with a Republican President?
Normally I don't like to say this, but... I told you so! I'm sure the right will still find a way to whine about 'activist judges', regardless of the fact that the court is the most conservative it's been in a long time.
Oh well. Whine away, GOP/TP.
Thats how you shut up a Republican ,wait till November. The Republicans will really be slinging the crap today
Wrong Tom111. CBO estimates it will increase individual spending on healtcare. What it does is save money fo rthe government ONLY. Check the facts.
Of course they're going to uphold it. It benefits corporations. This nation will NEVER have the kind of health care system its people need until it has a single payer system.
There's a growing movement nationwide to introduce a constitutional amendment overturning this corrupt and criminal supreme courts decision to give corporations unlimited power to buy elections claiming a piece of paper is the same as a human being.
68% of Republican and 83% of Democratic voters support this amendment. Join the movement and lets ensure democracy belongs to the people, not the highest bidder. Vote third party. Vote Green Party.
YES!!!!! All those who want to leave......LEAVE. Less to insure.
We better get more conservatives on that Court or we are done. The Liberal justices NEVER go against their ideology.
Congress passed a law requiring hospitals not to deny anyone care. However they did not say who was paying for it. So what is the hospital do to but pass cost on to those who do pay. I'm glad those who didn't have insurance will now be required to buy it.
Sweet!!!
Now let's put Issa in jail for lying to the American people and causing a witch hunt.
Millerz: Try reading the opinion rather than asserting what you wish were true.
All this proves is the Obama is a liar. Obama claimed over and over this was not a tax, and yet it has only been upheld as a tax. This will go down as one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and one of the biggest lies to ever be uttered by our president. People are opposed to this law on almost a 2-1 margin, and now more then ever Obama needs to go. This is a terrible bill rammed down the throats of all Americans, and now we learn what Obama tried to hide, it is a major tax increase.
How many times did Obama say this was not a tax. It failed as commerce which means congress has been shut down as to extending their power. This will eventually hurt the President as small business will probably not hire and unemployment will go up. So Obama wins and loses. Maybe he can get those 800,000 illegals to now pay for health care, oh wait we regular taxpayers pay for them.
Constitutionality doesn't equal good legislation.
So TRUE!
How disgraceful how all the libs back this because they are such party hacks they would support anything obama did.
Hope you like your win today, because you just weakened our freedoms.
JamesInSeattle "moved to a socialist entity". Like what? A socialist spirit? Please use English if you expect us to think you even have a clue as to what socialism is.
This is like a kid that bought a car he can't afford. Where does the money come from to pay for all of this?
momus,
so when youi dont buy it, you go to jail.
sounds like a tax to me.
For all of the people that will rejoice because this is upheld - think twice. The Supreme Court just passed yet another tax on the American people. That's really not something to be happy about.
Not that strange, if you think about it. The individual mandate is a requirement that everyone buy health insurance from a private corporation. In essence, a pro-corporation stance. This is still in line with their previous rulings under that mindset.
Too bad it seems like there are so few non-profit health insurance plans available.
This decision really doesn't decide anything...the court says that the mandate can stand as a tax but yet is says that individuals can refuse to pay the tax and not comply.
How is this a victory for anyone...its typical of the recent SCOTUS shades of gray type decision which gives each side a little of something with a NOTHING definitive. That's not the way its being spun at the moment but if you start reading the decision its typical of the doublespeak we've seen in other decisions lately.
Besides....didn't the President promise all of us during the debate over passage of the Healthcare bill that it was absolutely NOT a TAX? So if it survives but only on condition of it existing as a tax, does he renounce that and present a new version of the Healthcare law as a bill for Congressional debate???
I'm still rather confused...when the SCOTUS states that the individual mandate is unconstitutional and then upholds it, what the f'ck is that?
Great job SCOUTUS!! you would have been hated for generations if you had gone the other way!
Just proves that the Supreme court as well as the White house don't give a damn what the voters want.
We at least can do something about who is in the White House.
Personally, I think we should have say in the Supreme court too. It should not be a life long position.
NObama 2012
Louis, Stop with the racial Rant. A person can dislike Obozo and what he stands for without being a racist.
Take that Republicans.
Just goes to show you that Republicans are always talking about the constitution but don't know what's in it.
Suck it up sore losers! The ball has just bgan to roll. Obama 2012 in a rout!
Finally! Score one for the good guys!!
So forcing 30 millions people living in America (not necessarily Americans) to pay for health care, or pax a tax will drive down costs making it more affordable. If they can't afford it in the first place, why do you think they will pay 10% less (let's face it health care costs will not be cut in half) for the same coverage. So not being able to afford $1800 a year as opposed to $2000 a year will help the needed? If they can't afford it, they will be forced to spend $400 dollars, they don't already have, as a tax. Interesting rationale. Young adults piggy backing off their parents for another 2 years. Not bad.
I have always supported the idea, and there may be no good way to go about doing it, however, to force those who can't pay for it to pay for it, makes little sense.
The court has realists... this bill was all or nothing without the individual mandate.
I'm sure the corporate world will find a way to pass the savings on to themselves. Yes, I am sure this will generate savings, because people won't be using the emergency room for non-emergency services. The consumer will probably never see them is all.
Not so fast. We still have a Republican House, possibly a Republican Senate and a Republican President in 131 days. Enjoy it while it last. All polls show a majority of people want the mandate to go away.
I love the tears.....How I love the tears.......Let the crying of the right begin.....How sad that people don't get to die over money.....How these people call themselves the "christian right" I will never understand.
Now I get to pay for the health care of all the freeloaders of this country not to mention the illegals Obama is letting in by the millions.
Headline in finance is that Hospital Stock surges, but I'm watching the Nasdaq and Wall street dropping.
My guess more tightning of business.
Just when I was ready to give up on this court...as too partial and too political, they come through. Good for you Supremos! Justice Roberts, you will go down in history as a hero...
JamesinSeattle,
You think the mandate is socialism??? Ha! It's actually a free market solution to socialized medicine, thought up at a conservative think tank. Jeebus, get it straight. The mandate was used to keep you all from whining about a single payer system.
chevy volts for evrybody!!!!
OR YOU GO TO JAIL!!!!!!
Roberts knew that AHA was constitutional and voted that way. He knew this is one of the most politicized Supreme Courts in history and knew his legacy was at stake. Glad he had the anotomy to rule in favor of the Constitution. My guess, Scalia is having a meltdown at the moment.
Love the whining from the right. Start the crying: activist judges, leftist media, blah, blah, blah.
Victory despite all attempts by the Reicht.
Obama 2012!!!
I'm just saying...
"Finally! Score one for the good guys!!"
No, score one for the freeloaders.
sarah - technically, that's not true. You "told everyone so" by arguing that it was constitutional under the commerce clause. Apparently you and Obama DIDN'T know so, and only justice Roberts did... haha!
everybody must weight 110 pounds no mater what height you are!
or you go to jail!!!
This is an incredibly sad, sad day for our country. All three branches of our govt. have forsaken the Constitution. Time to get rid of all of them come November. To Congress, it is time to make an appointment to SCOTUS have term limits, no more "for life." It is time for spinning the truth to stop and see a pig for what it is, a pig. No amount of clever language will make a pig, no longer a pig.
And to you fools who also are good with forsaking the Constitution because you think you are getting something for nothing. Don't say I told you so when you get your "tax" bill. Let alone lower, or stagnant wages at work, as they will have to pay a "tax" bill as well. Overall, we would have a lot more, if we didn't waste it letting the govt. have it.
Justice Roberts turns out to be a pandering whore to Obama! But in doing so he proves that once again Obama was lying through his teeth about it being another tax on the working class.
Once again we will be called on to support health care for illegals and other home grown welfare riders.
Now when we get old a panel of people not even related to us will decide what care we will receive.
What a Hugh step forward for Socialism in this country!
WOW, quite frankly I'm shocked. I guess it's true, that the Federal Government can basically tell us to do anything they want.
I am glad that Obama won this fight...but...the law is a bad law. It's a sop to the insurance industry and the big secret is that some in the for-profit health-care industry are secretly applauding this, although they would NEVER admit it in public.
Obama's main problem with his base is that he signed on to a republican idea (individual mandate) that progressives didn't want, then the conservatives pulled the old switcharoo and opposed the mandate...brilliant strategy...they actually get what they originally wanted in the end, and the idea of single payer is now officially dead. It just that the progressive base knew that this is what would happen and consider Obama a "sellout" for falling for the trap. The conservatives play a VERY deep game and the dems really don't have a clue. And the American people are so confused that they don't know which way is up, down or sideways...the ignorant call it "socialism" when in fact it is a WINDFALL for the insurance industry.
So, while the law does have some benefits, it has many flaws. The only good thing as far I am concerned is that on the surface, it looks like a win for Obama and maybe helps keep Bush III, I mean Romney, out of the White House.
everybody must eat nothing but the cauliflower we send to you.
OR YOU GO TO JAIL!!
so how does one who is unemployed afford health insurance?
Eric, Sounds like Pelosi when she stated she didn't know what was in the healthcare law because it would have to be passed first. I will NEVER pay for this. Obama can go @!$%# himself.
If there is one thing Conservatives hate most, that is people who live off the system and go to the ER to get treated on taxpayer dollars because they don't have insurance. But what they hate even more, is the government forcing those very same people to be responsible and require them by law to carry insurance.
You need to do some research on your own, armurray... Many aspects of this law were grossly misrepresented by the health care lobby. Same goes with the polling.
Anthem-Blue Cross dropped me (after two years of high payments) because I had to go back to the doctor on a "stated" illness (Stage 2 Melanoma). If I had the means, we would have litigated the matter as we had a signed agreement. But instead, I spent money out of pocket - in addition to the 24 months of $950 to Anthem-Blue Cross - to address my health care.
Sweet results though... This law passed the SCOTUS litmus test and my board certified doctor to the stars dropped Anthem-Blue Cross.
Happy Days!
Tissue?
cool, now the government has free reign to push any agenda on the people, wanted or not, and call it a "tax"... welcome to the new U.S.S.A .. Next thing they will tell us what we can or can't eat.. oh wait, done already.. um.. nevermind..
So, it is just another TAX.... More BIG government...Congrats to the liberals..you are succeeding in turning the US into a socialist country...wait till Nov
WOW! Thank you President Bush for choosing John Roberts! I cant believe it! My faith in that man (John Roberts) and the court is renewed. Now if we can just leagalize Marijuana we are on the road to true freedom!
"The natural liberty of man is to be free from any superior power on Earth, and not to be under the will or legislative authority of man, but only to have the law of nature for his rule." Samuel Adams
I guess it's within reason to claim that "no one wanted this law"...I wanted single-payer health care and so did almost everyone I know. So us liberals weren't pleased because the legislation didn't go far enough, and the conservatives didn't want anything that had ever been touched by Obama. So, it's true, almost one one wanted this law, in a sense.
That's how compromise works, people.
So American Citizens have to prove they have Health Insurance but they don't have to prove that they are American Citizens? Are illegal aliens now required to get health insurance or is it same as car insurance where only people who are American Citizens are required to follow the law?
I am surprised, but I am happy.
Good news for people who work 40, 50, 60-plus hours per week, but because they're at different jobs, they aren't covered. Good news for all of the folks who eat at restaurants or shop at supermarkets (the person who handles your food may be able to go to the doctor when sick instead of coming to work), and for all of the folks who take their kids to daycare (workers may be able to go to the doctor instead of coming to work and contaminating your highly susceptible children).
The big loser is Karl Rove and his Mega-PACS that have spent hundreds of millions of dollars convincing the American public that this is a bad law and unconstitutional.
Firstly, the law stands as constitutional as interpreted bt the Supreme Court of the United States.
Secondly, we need the ACA in the worse possible way and if there are provisions that need modified or changed, Congress should work in a bi-partisan way to ammend the Constitutional Law that is in effect.
Thirdly, anyone who contributed to or bought into the Karl Rove disinformation should be very, very upset this morning.
Fourthly, Fox News - get real.
Thank you for bankrupting our nation. You will all go down in history.
Double post...sorry.
Who will write the dissenting opinion, Kennedy or Scalia?
Hahahahahahahah, Willowbrooks says "All three branches of our govt. have forsaken the Constitution."
Too funny, all three branches are wrong, but you, a poster on a website, are correct. Hahahahaha
Steve:
right...just beginning to roll...that's why he's begging for wedding gifts to be donations to his campaign. That's why he started with near double digit lead in just about every national poll which now is a dead heat or has his opponent with a slight lead.
This is pretty much what I've said all along, That the mandate is a tax increase coupled with a tax credit for doing what the government wants you to do. It was the shady language that would have given them the out to declare it unconstitutional.
That being said, just because it's constitutional doesn't mean that it is a good law. I think people were hoping that the court would strike it down for reasons other than the bizarre mandate. I know I for one have serious doubts that this law will do what the administration has hoped it would.
MarkTaft,
How on earth does making everyone pay for their own healthcare add up to free loading??? Right now, we have a free loader system, wherein all of us with insurance pay for those you don't. Unless you're willing to deny care to sick children who's parents don't have insurance???
Bone Head Mark Taft, you big baby. EVERYBODY PAYS!
YOU NON AMERICAN !
omg really people Boy are you wrong!
Thank God there won't be anyone bankrupted again because they made the mistake of getting sick.
A "victory" against the majority of Americans as poll after poll has shown.... and Democrats actually think this translates into good news for them at election time?
Hillarious.
Ever hear of cutting off your nose in spite of your face?
I'm laughing my ass off at OMG really people?!! and the rest of you righters. You sound like a 3rd grader that just had his juice box taken away.
Rush Limbaugh just soiled himself. Haha, pop another pill, fatty.
This cements our decline into Socialism. A failed experiment wherever it has been tried despite the millions killed by its imposers elsewhere. America, it is time to wake up to the reality of this situation. The Government has told us to STFU and sit down and take your medicine! To hell with 236 years of fighting to remain a Constitutional Republic! To hell with the majority who are opposed to 0bamacare. Congrats Dems, you won today, revenge comes Nov. 6,2012, We are now a serfdom.
This is quite weird, yes.
As many psychic events in previous ages, this is a "twist" in the collective psyche.
Imma have to read justice Roberts legal reasoning, because this is quite a strange type 911 indeed.
Conservatives....this is quite strange, but you have to read carefully, I think many states are being allowed to exist with this ruling. More reading and challenges are needed. I will do so now (puts on glasses) .
in other words, this could actually end up benefitting conservatives, like absolving the public option as the default....if states have the option of following and can only do it through taxes, then does the fed government have the ability to force states?
So yea, not at all sure how this plays out and who it favors. So don't judge until the legal reviews come in.
The Supreme Court just said that citizens must buy products/services from private companies as congress sees fit. Disappointing.
Chief Justice Roberts sided with the "spirit" in which the law was written. The democrats avoided calling it a "tax", but, it essence, it is not a penalty it is a tax. Congress has the power to "tax".
But, striking down the medicaid aspect of this still will impact the majority of uninsured in the various states. There are still many things that need to be worked out.
OMG grow up & go back to your FOX website, and come up with a conspiracy.
On the same day, being forced to buy a consumer product is called a "tax" and committing fraud is called "free speech".
I think our Founding Fathers are rolling in their graves....
The liberal justices never go against their ideology? If that's true, then it's only because liberal ideology represents truth, and truth doesn't change. Conservative ideology swings whichever way the funds blow.
I guess that this will become the biggest tax increase in history. Democrats get the credit.
Bravo SCOTUS! Healthcare is a right, not a privilege! And this law gets the 4 milliion free-riders to pay into the system, which will extend care for us call and ultimately lower costs. Allowing college students to stay on their parents insurance until age 26 and they can successfully find their own, allowing people who are 60 to get care at costs similar to those at 30, making certain that health insurance cannot be declined due to pre-existing conditions, allowing us access to free preventative care, extending care to children with pre-existing conditions and battling horrible diseases, and allowing us to get care at reasonable costs wo that we aren't bankrupted when we become sick -- it's the RIGHT THING TO DO! And when Mitt Romney first adopted this law in Massachusetts, the most conservative groups and Republicans cheered it as ground-breaking legislation and for its cost-savings measures! This debate should have been about helping peple get access to care in affordable measures and preventing ways where the federal government has to pay for so much of it. It's sad that the "let's beat Obama matra" forgot that this was about the PEOPLE in their time of need. Not power. Bravo SCOTUS! Bravo!
Now can someone tell me how I am going to be able to PAY for my mandated health insurance?
My husband is a school teacher. The insurance offered by Arkansas State to teachers cost $500 per month for the employee and children, but it jumps to $900 a month if you add the spouse.
I am a stay at home mother, with a small self-employed income so we live on my husbands pitiful salary. Currently his take home pay is about $2700 a month after they take out health insurance for my husmand and the kids. If I have to be added that brings down his take home pay to $2300 a month. This fall I will have 3 of my 5 children in college. Can someone tell me where I am going to squeeze out $200-400 per month for my health insurance premium? (we currently just pay my health care expenses of about $400 per year in cash)
Told you so!
Told you so!
I've been hearing on NPR for two days that the decision would be 6-3 in favor of the Healthcare act.
I shared this with you yesterday and drew much vitriol.
HAHA, told you so!
Let the exploding heads begin.
I'll be the weeper of the house's lips are trembling.
I'm doing my end-zone dance. YES! (pumping my fist)
Happy days are here again!
Let the dancing in the street begin. ES&D RWNJ's, ES&D!
Ok, now it's down to business! We've got to send the President a LOT of reinforcements so he can withstand the GOP congressional attempts to gut the law.
BUTTS IN THE BOOTH AMERICA. GET YOUR BUTTS IN THE BOOTH in November!
Happy Days!
Obama/Biden 2012
Markets are now off over 1.5% and growing, despite a surge in Health care related stock. The ACA is the cause of the sucking sound of more jobs going away.
Is car insurance socialism? It's required that you have it in every state.
The only good thing about this ruling is the fact that over 60% of Americans don't want Obamacare. So how do you think they will vote in November?
You always have to look at the bright side of any news, good or bad.
Is car insurance socialism? It's required that you have it in every state.
Democrats don't even understand what just happened. Hey that's how they like their voters though.
Wow- I guess nobody saw that coming from the right. Taxation at its best. Talk about a rally killer. This nation we call "Land of the Free" just got their lunch handed to them;and there ain't no free lunch boys and girls.
Sarah...
Whine about activist judges?? Not hardly, interesting that roberts gave the individual mandate a FAIL when it came to the "commerce clause" justification.
That has to have a lot of democrats whining on what they thought was a right conclusion.
It was a surprise that roberts instead based it on congresses right to "lay taxes". Not really sure how the mandate is the same as laying taxes unless roberts is looking at section 1502 of the healthcare law where all employer healthcare contributions are now considered to be taxable income for the employee.
BloombergTV had an interesting bit of info on all those not finding "affordable coverage" to receive a subsidy from the government to get the insurance. Seems that this is expected to add about $1.1 trillion to our debt.
Just makes november more interesting and doesn't really change that "one and done" is a goal worth pursuing.
Joe F - that is not a valid argument because you can choose not to have a car.
You are RIDICULOUS !!
@bobjones
You lost. Deal with it
.
Unbelievable...... So now the government can tell you that you MUST buy something. I am very interested in reading the opinion to determine why the Supreme Court upheld but looks like the country is now in a spiral away from the Constitution and heading for failure.
Thomas Jefferson knew this country could not survive indefinitely stating "The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground.".
Time for resistance. This government has taken over our liberties significantly over the last 50 years and time for the people to rise up and resist. Thomas Jefferson also said "And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
This country is internally being pushed towards another Civil War. When the government AND the Supreme Court disregard the Constitution requirement of limited government and liberty then the "trees of liberty must be refreshed". I do not look forward to the conflict that will be obviously starting in the next few years but is a requirement for us to keep the freedoms promised to us in the Constitution.
So yea, if the states are allowed to opt out, then this actually takes away power from congress. But we will have to see.
This was a response from a post I posted above, but It got erased for some reason.
Basically we don't know if states are being given the power to opt out, mainly I can't judge until the legal reviews come in.
Requiring people to purchse a product from a private corporation is not socialism.
You may not agree with it, but it has nothing to do with socialism.
Actually, it is almost the opposite of socialism.
Socialism is not a universal term for "bad."
Obama can now be addressed as what was proven by the Supreme Court, a liar. Obama claimed repeatedly this mandate was not a tax, and he was lying. The Democrats said this was not a tax and that congress had the power to pass a mandate under the commerce clause, they were lying. Obama has successfully lied his way to one of the largest tax increases in modern history. With the Obama stated line that he will have more flexibility if re-elected, taxes are going to skyrocket. Obama has to go now more then ever, once a liar always a liar.
Now we know why Scalia went on his mad man's rant the other day. He knew that he , Thomas, Alito, and Kennedy had lost the battle. No matter how you look at it this is a major victory for the American people. Just watch out for falling repugs as they take flight off of tall bldgs or their heads start to explode. Next thing is to get rid of the teabaggers and the blue dogs. Boehner's probably already at the bottom of the bourbon bottle and McConnell has had to put his hood and robe away.
American - I agree. I honestly thought it was going to be struck down, but it is annoying that people who claimed it WOULDN'T be struck down because of the commerce clause are now saying "I told you so." they were as wrong as I was!
Maybe now people will stop with the "Supreme Court is political" BS. The justices have different ideologies, but they do not seem tied to a particular party (now or in the past).
Maybe now people will stop with the "Supreme Court is political" BS. The justices have different ideologies, but they do not seem tied to a particular party (now or in the past).
It WAS a surprise from THIS Supreme Court, but from a Constitutional perspective it was the correct decision. No other decision really makes sense from a legal perspective. As an act of legislative discretion, the law was within Constitutional boundaries despite all the rhetorical "spin" that conservatives [an oxymoronic term - striking down the law would have required historic judicial activism] tried to use regarding mandates. After all, we already pay FICA and other taxes. Precedent from the Court all but demanded this result.
However, this will not be the end of the ALEC funded drumbeat against the law and legislative efforts will be underway to try to repeal it. That is what Rmoney has pledged to his capitalist fat cat cronies. So-called conservatives running for office or campaigning to stay will offer up measures to repeal the law that will fail, but which pander to anti-intellectual right wing base constituents. It may be clever politics, but it is stupid policy.
Businesses will now just factor in the law as part of the complex factors in running an enterprise. The issue of "job creation" based upon "uncertainty" was always just conservative claptrap and soundbites. Companies are not hiring because they do not have customers for their products, not because of the Affordable Care Act. After all, most of the law has not taken effect, so if the soundbites were true, the companies would be hiring now, and most are not. From a rational and economic perspective the law should have provided a single payer provision or a government provider option to mitigate insurance company greed and premium increases. However, smart insurance companies will act quickly and get on board by offering moderately priced coverage as widely as possible, knowing the the larger the pool of insured, the higher their profits will be WITHOUT price gouging. Companies like United Healthcare and Humana would rather have large pools of insureds AND excessive premiums so that they can continue giving multi-million dollar annual bonuses to execs. In this environment, it is not necessary to pay such excessive compensation to intelligent insurance company executives who can develop and implement programs that are both profitable and which focus on customer service. It may require the entry of some new providers if the entrenched fail to move into the future. Hopefully, the prohibition on discrimination based upon pre-existing conditions and portability of coverage will encourage people to shop for the best coverage at the best rates and exit companies who do not have customers as their main focus.
Overall, the country will be better off by having millions of people currently uninsured protected by at least minimal health insurance protection. Social Security is by no means perfect, but could anyone really imagine the magnitude of destitution in this country among the elderly [which is still a problem] if there were no Social Security subsistence and Medicare? The result is that the US will rise in stature among developed nations because of this commitment to universal health care for its citizens. A healthier populace will also means a stronger and more productive workforce. E pluribus unum.
Does anyone know what happens to seniors on SS Disability? How does this affect them?
Yes, let's stay with a system that pays twice what other countries spend and gives us the most obese, unhealthy, 27th in life expectancy, and 10% of the sick (the poor) accounting for 80% of the cost.....because THAT works so well.
@OMG.....Nope! I'm not worried about going to jail, because I've never been uninsured! Not only that; I'm a veteran! I earned the health-care I receive through the VA.
"Many of the critics (Republicans) are in an uproar about a black man that has made so much history in his first four years, thus giving other black people hope... Republicans can't allow that to happen since we are supposed to be subservient followers."
You racist bigot! You can't get over the color of Obama's skin nor acknowledge the fact that the Democrat party ghettoizes blacks and blacks are too caught up in loving their own race to notice they're nothing but pawns to the Left. Simple fact:
Obama = Half-black, Half-white
Yeah, you forgot that your Great Black Hope isn't exactly black at all, but claims to be so racists like you have some feces to throw in other people's faces. His mother was WHITE, unless you wanna say his birth certificate was FAKE. You wouldn't dare do that, now would you?
Third, history itself makes you a liar if you truly believe Republicans hate and oppress black people. Blacks were freed from slavery by REPUBLICANS and then almost immediately after being freed were segregated by DEMOCRATS. Jim Crow was a PROGRESSIVE who believed society could never become great if blacks were equal to whites; he carried a (D) next to his name. The founder of the KKK was a DEMOCRAT SENATOR, for crying out loud. All of this is in the history books, freaking go to the local library and read one. That's the whole reason Democrats don't want blacks to become educated, because then they'll realize who exactly IS oppressing them.
HERE we go AGAIN one MORE straw to add to the back of the working man!!! IF i were PREZ i would SAY FREE RIDE IS OVER!!! if you work you eat if you dont work you dont eat, when you start getting hungry you will find a JOB!!!
Supreme Court was correct again, so much for all you libs who think the balance of power doesn't work. Any one that read this Healthcare bill knew full well it was a Tax, as much as Obama tried hard to not admit, although the arguement his side used before the court, "its a tax, not a mandate". Congress is allowed to impose taxes. But don't get too excited about this new TAX on the American people. For one, evidently the State's don't have to comply with the Medicaid "mandate" provisions for a pool of the States. So many poor people will be losing their coverage.
Other provisions in this opinion will affect the implementation of the Health care act, all will have to see how much after the entire opinion is released and legal analysis review it.
Stock market is crashing right now, there goes more of the middle class savings.
Most importantly this changes the election completely, with over 60% against this, guess 2010 elections will be repeating....Democrats just lost their seats, including Obama.
We all lost. You just don't realize it yet.
kemetstry
I didn't loose anything, I have insurance.
Seems you still don't understand what happened. That's something the entire nation will have to deal with for a long time.
Get ready to be "taxed" for any reason now. All they did was create a loophole to make you do what the government wants.
WOW!!!! Obama just imposed taxes of $4000 a year on the middle and lower classes. And you idiot koolaide drinkers applaud him. So much for the 'I will not raise taxes one dime on the middle class' lie from Obama. Can you say "Read My Lips..no new taxes"? Sure you can.
Yay! Except it still isn't a single-payer program like Canada, so it'll probably be all eff-ed up like the corporations wanted it.
...and the market is tanking.
Big shock there. Apparently the free-market isn't fond of this decision.
I don't see how this is a good thing for anybody except the insurance companies. Rates will skyrocket exponentially now that the law says you HAVE to do business with them because they can charge whatever they want and you will HAVE to pay it! I for one am not going to pay for services that will never be rendered because the moment I have to file a claim, the insurance company will just find some excuse to not pay it! And, if you think I'm paying the gov'mint fine (EXTORTION), think again! So tell me... why are you all so happy about this?
The republicans get the health plan they created and wanted since 1993. YEAH!!!!!
Obama / Biden Twentyyyyyyyyyyyyyy 12!
Oh no...insurance will get cheaper...Corporations will get less money to spend on elections......what to do........aaahahahahahahaha
YIPPEE!!!! I am positively SHOCKED that Roberts court decided to actually follow the Constitution!!
Can you HEAR IT? It's the sound of millions of teabagging, greedy old white republicant's heads IMPLODING (to explode would imply that there is grey matter between their ears, thus, their heads are collapsing) ... no more freeloaders! EVERYONE has to have insurance ... no more free rides for the white trash teabaggers!! Now the teabaggers HAVE to take the personal responsibility that they demand of everyone else!
I suggest you teabaggers educate yourselves about this law instead of relying on the lies fed to you by your teabagging leaders and FAUXSnooze .... ROTFLMAO ... SUCK IT, FOOLS!
"Obama might have his law, but the GOP has a cause," said veteran campaign adviser Terry Holt. "This promises to galvanize Republican support around a repeal of what could well be called the largest tax increase in American history
Underground - what about the fact that FICA, etc. go to a pool, that (supposedly) is returned to everyone under a government run program, as opposed to this, which is just a penalty for not buying something? (not trying to fight, just looking for your thoughts...)
@ Bob-1622113
"Here comes the HUGE tax increase that Obama said would not happen.!!
Every household just had their taxes raised by approx. $4000.00 per year, make sure you celebrate that too."
I'll have to look into this further, but my wife and I currently pay about $7K a year plus co-pays to insure a family of 3 through an employer sponsored plan. I'd gladly drop our current plan and take the $4k tax and public health care provided the coverage matches, or is close to what we currently have. Plus a personal bonus for our family since my wife can switch to PRN and work less for more pay because her employer isn't sponsoring health benefits!!!
WOW.....THE USA has become a more compassionate nation !!
I think that a LOT of voters fear the idea of a BISHOP as President of the USA....Willard Mitt Romney is the BISHOP in the Mormon Church...his particular "seat" is at the LDS church on Brattle Street in Cambridge,Mass., close to his Alma Mater at Harvard University.......
Obama just put us a huge step closer to being Europe and look where they are at right now. Just wait 40 years, or less, and we'll be in the exact same situation, and Americans will be screaming for more entitlements. The well eventually runs dry people. Ask anyone living in Spain, Greece or France right now.
...
Krissy,
Actually, Europe is where they are right now, because of austerity measures, taken during an already slow economy. You know, like the Ryan Budget.
What I really love, are all the conservatives crying about "big, invasive government". Where's all that bitching and moaning about government intrusion on the social issues???
So a government that can tax and regulate healthcare is too big, but a government that can shove probes up women, tell two consenting adults they can't contract because of who they sleep with, and spy on citizen's in their houses of worship, is just fine?
Anyone else wondering what is going on recently? SC voted down valor act in essence saying it is ok to commit fraud and misrepresent yourself for financial gain, struck down Arizona law instead saying it is ok to be here illegally, and now upheld a government provision stating that we must buy into government run healthcare?
The shining city on the hill, the hope of what America meant, the land of opportunity is gone. Maybe it moved to China.
Another tax on the middle-class, woot.
Keep cheering libs, let's relinquish full control of our lives to the gov.
So I guess if the government wants its citizens to buy something now, all they have to do is call it a tax. Does this mean we have to buy American made cars or face a TAX penalty? Stupid Dems call this a victory but it's just big government in the pocket of the people.
I don't think Romney is the best alternative, but Obama is a nutbag.
This is a great day for Barack Obama but an even better day for the non-1%ers. It's kinda a shame that so many people who are foaming at the mouth against President Obama will actually benefit from this. Rather ironic. So today the US finally joined the rest of the civilized world in recognizing that healthcare is a RIGHT! NOT A PRIVILEGE FOR JUST THE ROMNEY'S. Kudos, Barack Obama. I know I'm rather critical of him on many things but he got this one right and it is a biggie.:) It still seems pretty odd that Castro and Cube recognized this before the repugnicans. I think that says something about our reichwing troglodytes. But today is a happy day!!!!
Now we wait a few years and see how Pelosi/ReidCare (Obama was only the marketer) is buried in unfunded liabilities like Medicare is now.
It's already underfunded, so I guess I won't be able to say "told you so" down the road.
Everyone's taxes will have to be increased to pay for this. It's coming. Just wait.
Zathrose - is that what the estimated costs are going to be?
So from what I see, the Constitution is now nothing but toilet paper. This is nothing more than saying the government can now tell you what you have to buy no questions asked, and to hell with Constitutional protection. Nothing like cheering for the downfall of your country and the rights we were given in the beginning. What happened to the safeguard in the Constitution that says the government can not force the people to buy things? And here I thought the courts would stand up for the Constitution. Was I ever wrong.
@Road Warrior-252445
And which biased site is this from?
AL-1735815, the court does not lean right genius, perhaps you should check your facts. In fact, it's quite the opposite.
a death blow to Romney's campaign
Yes, you are correct. This is a free loader system, but now, the middle class will be hurt so much! We can't just ignore a tax! It was NEVER stated that it would be a tax. Obama has pandered to illegals for their votes, and this "tax" will take the some of the burden off the government to pay for his "illegals" medical care..............I supposed the illegals will not be paying this tax? The joke is on U.S. Citizens!
Let's hope the 14% of people who are underemployed, not employed, or have given up finding a job reverse that status before they have to pay for the health insurance or face a fine.
Well, since we are now supposed to move forward with this 1 TRILLION + increase to our deficit, I wonder how soon our next downgrade from Standard and Poors will occur............
Our whole Country lost today. The President and Supreme court has just passed the largest tax on the citizens in the history of the US. So liberals rejoice that you are all responsible for this tax and enjoy the money being taken out of your pocket, as well as mine.
I'm not at all surprised. And I'm simultaneously happy and sad about the ruling.
There are many good things in the health care reform bill, but like most I am not very happy with the mandate to buy private insurance, and very much wanted a single-payer universal health care system.
I fully expected some right-leading justices to uphold it, because if Obamacare was struck down, then that would leave no other alternative for fully covering all Americans than to implement a government-option, which would ultimately take out the for-profit middle men. This would suck for a lot of uninsured Americans until it could happen, but it would happen.
I don't know which is more disheartening - that the SCOTUS just said the government has the right to force people to purchase a product from a private company without recourse or be fined, or that democrats are celebrating the fact that Obama just got away with passing a substantial new tax after repeatedly stating that was not something he would ever do. People have gotten so caught up in party lines and whose side "wins" that they've lost all sense and perspective.
Forget the issue of "healthcare" for a moment. Change it instead to solar power. The President passes a legislation that states ALL people regardless of financial or living situation, must purchase solar power from one of a limited number of companies. It's not a tax, mind you, but an individual requirement for the betterment of the country. The Constitution prohibits that type of legislation. So instead, the government comes back and announces this is actually not a mandate but a new "tax". But the president has adamantly denied this is a tax of any kind. So either the government is overstepping by forcing you to spend money on solar power, or the president lied and passed a new tax without admitting it. HOW is this something to celebrate?? Insert ANY issue and see if it passes the litmus test of being "ok". What if the legislation stated you MUST spend money on corn products? Really, use any random item. People should be offended, either at the blatent lies or the lack of Constitutional honor, take your pick. This is NOT a win.
We already have been for years. It's called WAR!
No none of it is "alright" including this new tax.
That's the problem people choose sides and vote for who's on their team. Instead of protecting the rights we were all given over 200 years ago.
Watch Romney take credit for it now....flip, flopping flip flop!
Thank you SCOTUS for handing the 2012 election for the President and Senate to the republicans. The conservative outrage over this will mobilize the base of conservatives and swing independents away from the left. The signature legislation of the Obama administration that he swore (lied) was not a tax was just ruled to be a tax by the SCOTUS. This is a wake up call for America! You can't trust Obamas words. His actions have exposed him for the liar he is! A new congress and president are needed to undo the damage being inflicted on the USA by the deceit of the socialist bastards in Washington.
Sarah - did you mean to write tax and regulate health INSURANCE?
This is a major victory for President Obama and the whining of the right wing lunatic fringe over the Supreme Court's ruling is nothing like the wailing and sniveling we will hear coming from the teabaggers when the president is reelected in another landslide!
President Obama in November! He is our only rational choice!
Last night, I predicted a 6 to 3 decision to uphold. It is though, a 5 to 4 vote to uphold. Understand Nancy Pelosi predicted as I did. Could be, both She and I are slipping some. Could also be, Justice Kennedy is a purely activist Justice, who bases all His decisions on, and within His conservative pea brain. Thank you "Chief Justice Roberts". Damn!, I came close to being wrong! I gotta watch that!
All who are celebrating, remember how happy you are today when your company drops your insurance coverage and you have to go and pay for it yourself! Currently, a company absorbs a large portion of the insurance cost and the employee pays a portion. Those times are gone. Your cost will be higher because now you get the added benefit of covering the cost (hmm TAX) for those who can't afford it or are in the U.S. illegally.
Of course medical care is expensive. Would you rather go back 40 years and be treated with the same diagnostic tools and medicine we had then?? I doubt it.
To all the LYING LIBS - when you say that everyone pays YOU ARE LIARS! Olbummer exempted all kinds of unions and others who supported his first election bid, and you know it! YOU ARE LIARS. PERIOD.
All hail the demise of the American Republic. Welcome in the Socialist State of America. When does the revolution start? I'm ready.
All who are celebrating, remember how happy you are today when your company drops your insurance coverage and you have to go and pay for it yourself! Currently, a company absorbs a large portion of the insurance cost and the employee pays a portion. Those times are gone. Your cost will be higher because now you get the added benefit of covering the cost (hmm TAX) for those who can't afford it or are in the U.S. illegally.
Of course medical care is expensive. Would you rather go back 40 years and be treated with the same diagnostic tools and medicine we had then?? I doubt it.
Mark Taft,
If you have been paying for health insurance, you have been paying for the free loaders you dolt. For crying out loud turn off fox and get some facts.
As ALL of my readers know there has NEVER been a doubt. I predicted this from the START because well,.. I know the law better then know nothings. Its a good thing folks and one day soon you will understand if you do not already. Enjoi. Truly.
And for tea bagging republican extrmesit in government well... You to Mr. Romney.. The first years were NOT a waste and your wrong AGAIN.. ; ] When are you ever right on the right in fact? Probably should change that title there hun. .
Cheers
If the mandate is a tax, then the SCOTUS should not have been able to rule on it under the provisions of the Anti-injunction Act; yet the Court upholds the law under the power of Congress to tax.
Well, this isn't the first time the Court has come to the right result, even with rather convoluted reasoning.
M Barnes and Grimey Grimes, I didn't say all, but the likelihood of someone having an issue with the statement I made are likely the same that should take a hard look at themselves in the mirror as one of the reasons why they disagree with the President. You are likely in denial of your stances on cultural impacts.
Heard a commentator say that upholding the law rolls the politics back to 2010.
FINALLY...albeit a PAINFUL start, but PRESIDENT OBAMA did what every other president tried to do!
We are on the way to doing what is rright for American citizens.
OH IS IT AN ACTIVIST COURT WHEN A CONSERVATIVE JUDGE AGREES WITH A LAW PUT FORWARD BY A LIBERAL?
LOL! Oh the crying. If for nothing else, this was worth it just for the pur laughter. FAKE conservatives are crying, and bawling, and throwing fits, you know, like the radical pretend left do when something goes against them. But it is the fake conservatives today who really don't think they are just like their sworn enemies.
They are EXACTLY like them. Unthinking people have more in common with each other than their opposing viewpoints.
Honestly, I was thinking the court would strike down mandatory health care, because my faith in the Supreme Court is about as much as the
DouscheTea Party, and the Ecoterrorists who pretend they represent Republicans and Democrats, respectively. But even a broken clock is right twice a day, right?Hilarity at its finest.
Lisa,
If my company does away with health insurance then I will find another job that covers me. Thats the beauty of it, I have free will and a choice.
Dirp,
Here, here.
BobbyJones,
If you're consistant in your stance, good for you. But let's face it. The majority of TP/GOP folks, who scream about "smaller government" are the same people who want government in our bedrooms, Mosques, and bodies.
@Michelle from the woods
"Now can someone tell me how I am going to be able to PAY for my mandated health insurance?
My husband is a school teacher. The insurance offered by Arkansas State to teachers cost $500 per month for the employee and children, but it jumps to $900 a month if you add the spouse.
I am a stay at home mother, with a small self-employed income so we live on my husbands pitiful salary. Currently his take home pay is about $2700 a month after they take out health insurance for my husmand and the kids. If I have to be added that brings down his take home pay to $2300 a month. This fall I will have 3 of my 5 children in college. Can someone tell me where I am going to squeeze out $200-400 per month for my health insurance premium? (we currently just pay my health care expenses of about $400 per year in cash)"
Michelle -
Can you tell me where the rest of us are supposed to get the money to pay for you and your kids when you get sick and have no health insurance?
Take responsibility for your family. I'm sure your husband appreciates you calling his salary "pitiful" as well.
Sincerely,
A family that barely affords our own health care, and can't pay for yours
I love how the liberals all are basically saying "we won" and "you lost". Sorry, the country lost. Taxes are going up for everyone. Businesses were waiting to consider hiring pending this decision and since the mandate, and required taxes on businesses are also upheld, you will see unemployment spike upwards in the upcoming weeks. More people on Food Stamps. More on Welfare. Companies relocating overseas to get away from the government intrusion and taxes. Add to that a government AND a Supreme Court that thumbs its nose at the Constitution.
When tyranny exists it is time for the people to rise. Thomas Jefferson said "The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first.".
Thomas Jefferson also said "And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.". I worry for what will now occur that the people have been clearly told that the Constitution has no more value than a roll of toilet tissue.
We have one more election to save this republic. If Romney is elected then we can change the laws of this tyrannical administration. If Obama is elected then it would appear the only way to save this nation is through an uprising.
The decade republican stain of urine on our flag just got smaller. Truly, truly rightous that I, as an american, can shove this health care even farther down the most unhonorble republican throats in our history. People that have and are carrying republicans OBVIOUSLY tainted water are the biggest fools that have EVER walked this earth. Let alone american soil. Open wide you phony ignorant idiots. lol. Going to be hard finding room along side the Koch bros appendages already in your throats. lol. Obama and congress 2012 to save this country for the middle class! I'm going to celebrate a rightous SC decision!
Michelle from the woods
and according to the Republicans, your husband is an overpaid state (or town)-employee freeloader so get over it or have him change his job to a private sector job.
To all of you who are certain that Obamacare is a bad idea......how about having an open mind and considering a wait-and-see approach? Now that the law has been upheld by the SCOTUS, wait until the law is fully implemented and see if it works. If it doesn't work to reduce healthcare costs, THEN push for repeal.
Oh Boy. I hope the next thing the Bamster says we have to purchase is a 70" HD TV. I want one of those but can't afford it either.
if my son acted like this, he would be punished, but this is typical childish, immature demo stereotype
could this guy be any more of a child;
skip Nicholson, Oklahoma City
Told you so!
Told you so!
I've been hearing on NPR for two days that the decision would be 6-3 in favor of the Healthcare act.
I shared this with you yesterday and drew much vitriol.
HAHA, told you so!
Let the exploding heads begin.
I'll be the weeper of the house's lips are trembling.
I'm doing my end-zone dance. YES! (pumping my fist)
Happy days are here again!
Let the dancing in the street begin. ES&D RWNJ's, ES&D!
Ok, now it's down to business! We've got to send the President a LOT of reinforcements so he can withstand the GOP congressional attempts to gut the law.
BUTTS IN THE BOOTH AMERICA. GET YOUR BUTTS IN THE BOOTH in November!
Happy Days!
when you are all grown up, you will regret this and your actions
American, that's just a flat out LIE.
That section requires employers to list the value of health insurance given to the employee ONLY. It will be used for those "cadillac plans" (the ones the rich business owners, and CEO's (in both industry and Unions) buy just for themselves). The value or premiums OVER the $27,500 allowed in 2018 (yes 2018) will be taxable.
Normal people (the 99%) won't get taxed a dime, and you're going around spreading lies and will come back to you one day.
People like you will be telling lies for months trying to cast this law as bad. Some things will likely need fixing, but I think overall, people will come around to liking the idea of slowly fixing the HUGE health issues in America and the fact that people go bankrupt every day because of health care costs they can't afford but aren't poor enough to qualify for Medicaid. Realize that 20% of all personal bankruptcies are a result of unpaid healthcare bills and this law will eliminate that.
Skip Nicholson from OKC, "Let the exploding heads begin"
Way too funny.
This is a big F-ing deal!
I admit I am shocked that the court ruled as it did, even though two experts told NPR they thought the decision would go this way.
Wow!
You can always tell when the news is bad for the RWNJ's of the GOP. They begin collapsing every comment they can. What was wrong with the first comment on this thread? It didn't violate the code in any way or shape. It must be re-instated!
Now it's time for a reality check.
The RWNJ's will rally behind their misguided leaders, FOX News and Rush Limbaugh to try and repeal the law. We must send the President some help.
He needs to be re-elected and he needs to have some new members of Congress to help him stave off the assault the GOP has planned.
This may give Romney a rallying cry, which may have been Justice Robert's plan all along. Clever, perhaps, but too clever if they can't get it repealed.
This is a happy day, but the fight has just begun.
There is an old Samurai saying that goes something like "Following a victory you should tighten your helmet cords." In other words, we need to be ready for the NEXT fight.
It ain't over, till it's over and the fat lady ain't sung her swansong yet.
Remember, get them butts in the booth in November.
Obama/Biden 2012
This is a big F-ing deal!
I admit I am shocked that the court ruled as it did, even though two experts told NPR they thought the decision would go this way.
Wow!
You can always tell when the news is bad for the RWNJ's of the GOP. They begin collapsing every comment they can. What was wrong with the first comment on this thread? It didn't violate the code in any way or shape. It must be re-instated!
Now it's time for a reality check.
The RWNJ's will rally behind their misguided leaders, FOX News and Rush Limbaugh to try and repeal the law. We must send the President some help.
He needs to be re-elected and he needs to have some new members of Congress to help him stave off the assault the GOP has planned.
This may give Romney a rallying cry, which may have been Justice Robert's plan all along. Clever, perhaps, but too clever if they can't get it repealed.
This is a happy day, but the fight has just begun.
There is an old Samurai saying that goes something like "Following a victory you should tighten your helmet cords." In other words, we need to be ready for the NEXT fight.
It ain't over, till it's over and the fat lady ain't sung her swansong yet.
Remember, get them butts in the booth in November.
Obama/Biden 2012
Did I mention that the GOP whine is tasting mighty fine and that the Teabag hysteria is just delicious this morning. Pass the salt?
(burp) excuse me
But let's face it. The majority of TP/GOP folks, who scream about "smaller government" are the same people who want government in our bedrooms, Mosques, and bodies.
YUP!
Fake conservatives at their FINEST.
I know the idea of mandatory health care is incongruous with small government conservatism...i.e. NOT the kind represented by Tea Bags. But it is Tea Baggers who have followed the lie of their big government fake conservatives who only oppose bills because of their source and not because they make sense.
Real conservatives had a chance to put forward a working proposal. But Dousche Bag party members didn't want a solution and now they get to pay the price.
If fake conservatives would care to wake up at any point, this is why you stop throwing hissy fits and start solving problems like adults. I have no expectation, however, that fake conservatives will do anything other than continue to pee all over what thinking conservatives try to do.
********************************PATHETIC*******************************
Lack of cognitive reasoning skills.
Score Board:
American Citizens = 0, cannot figure out that Medical Care (Profession) is NOT the Insurance Corporations.
The big bill of $1.7 Trillion to $2.1 Trillion (adjusted for inflation) for President Obama's ACA, meaning since not previously budgeted for by US Congress, more cuts to other previously budgeted for Programs and Projects for US Citizens (what is happening now). "My Health Care Reform will not cost the Taxpayers anything" - President Obama.
Democracy = 0, Majority of 68% against, loss of Democracy by definition.
Insurance Corporations = $67 Billion (US Taxpayer money given to them per President Obama's ACA (section Source of New Revenues) + over 53 Million American Citizens REQUIRED to buy their "High Risk" Category Insurance Premiums).
Pharmaceuticals Corporations = $20 Billion (US Taxpayer money given to them per President Obama's ACA (section Source of New Revenues).
Medical Device Corporations = $23 Billion (US Taxpayer money given to them per President Obama's ACA (section Source of New Revenues)
President Obama = $1 Billion Unlimited Corporate Campaign Contributions from the Insurance Corporations, Medical Device Corporations, PharmaceuticalsCorporations.
Occupy Wall Street, 99%ers = 0. LOL, got their arses beaten by the US Supreme Court, yeah Insurance Corporation CEOs get their bonuses.
Poor Americans = 0, the intent of the ACA was to provide coverage for those that could not afford Medical Care. US Supreme Court struck down the Medicaid provisions to cover more of the poor.
Medical Professionals = 0, now the Insurance Corporations have the Medical Professionals by the genitals in a vise like grip, as Medical Malpractice Insurance Premiums, as do as the Insurance Adjusters say or we jack up your Medical Malpractice Insurance or stop your Medical Malpractice Insurance (no Medial Malpractice Insurance means no job for Medical Professionals).
Senator Edward Kennedy, President FDR, etc. = 0, must be doing back flips in their graves. As the long time proponent for Health Care Reform Senator Kennedy wanted the Universal Health Care For All US Citizens like President FDR's, in that todays cost would be $50 for Unlimited Medical Treatments by getting the Insurance Corporations completely out of the Medical Profession resulting in a decreased cost by 80% for Unlimited Medical Treatments. Getting the Insurance Corporations out of Medicare would save the US Taxpayers being overcharged by the Insurance Corporations by $17 Billion to $18 Billion each year per President Obama.
Welcome to China, you must Buy ______________fill in the blank_____________.
Everyone that is age 27 and up, poor, etc. MUST Vote for unfortunately Romney just to get this abomination US Law eliminated.
Go ahead dispute what I posted; just wait and see in 2014. Copy, paste, and save my post to your computer, so that when the above happens, don't blame me, that is the projected symbolic logic (Applied Advanced Mathematics, zero emotions, zero politics) result (outcome).
Wait till they put you on "High Risk" insurance because your 20 pounds over weight, or you have MS, or your blood pressure in high. It's coming. I lost faith in the SC today. If Obama's re-elected, I don't have to loose faith in my country, I'll just loose my country. I can't believe America won't stand together and vote him out in November, only chance America has. No Bama 2012. He's not even running his campaign from the Pride of ObamaCare. Take one good guess why.
You dont get it do you ? I understand that the intentions of Obama is try to take care of the american people to the best of his abilities.
However can you not see what is also being taken away from the american people ? We didnt want this to begin with years ago when it was introduced, but yet be decided to ignore the american voice and do it anyway. The government is stepping way over their boundaries with oppression of the people, and not going by what we want. As each generation goes by, and newer younger americas grow up in this new society they are oblivious to the way america used to be, should be. This is the norm now a days , that the government has their nose in everything and control everything.
In case you dont know you should look up the intent of our government its role, and what it should and should not be doing. Our freedoms are being taken from us, and you all act like you dont care what so ever. I wish america would just split in half, one side goes back to where our leaders listen to people and a government that is small and not so controlling. Thats where I would be. Now this ruling will take my tax paying dollars and use them towards things I am opposed to.
I understand that Obama feels this is the best thing to do, but you cant sacrifice our american freedoms for what he wants to do.
For everyone whining and moaning about everyone being taxed now, I have 2 things to say:
1) Aren't you the same people that have been complaining about how raising taxes on the rich isn't fair and everyone should be "taxed" the same? Seems like that's what's happening here.
2) "Taxes" is NOT a dirty word; it's the price you pay for your freedom and prosperity. The more you prosper, the more you pay, and that's the way it should be. Do you like living in this wonderful country? Then pay your share. I love this country with all my being and I pay mine, and I don't mind that I pay more taxes than people poorer than me because I enjoy greater prosperity than they. So what if I "subsidize" them a little as a result? Call it "charity" if you want; I sleep better at night knowing that I am a good and decent human being and not some selfish miser. If you think taxes are making you poor then you need to reassess your spending habits.
PS: For the benefit of my fellow Christians, may I remind you that Jesus was a socialist, and you should reread the New Testament tale of the rich young man who asked Him what he should do to obtain righteousness and think about how that passage may apply to you.
So I guess Libs are calling this a win for Odumbo...another of his 'accomplishments'....well let's take a look at Odumbo's other 'accomplishments' shall we....
Whoever said that Obama hasn’t acomplished anything in his first term?
WHAT AN IMPRESSIVE LIST OF ACCOMPLISHMENTS!…
First President to apply for college aid as a foreign student, then deny he was a foreigner.
First President to have a social security number from a state he has never lived in.
First President to preside over a cut to the credit-rating of the United States.
First President to violate the War Powers Act.
First President to be held in contempt of court for illegally obstructing oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico.
First President to defy a Federal Judge’s court order to cease implementing the Health Care Reform Law.
First President to require all Americans to purchase a product from a third party, a violation of the U.S. Constitution.
First President to spend a trillion dollars on ‘shovel-ready’ jobs when there was no such thing as ‘shovel-ready’ jobs.
First President to recommend changing our National Anthem as it portrays and promotes violence and is warlike in its theme.
First President to cancel the National Day of Prayer Breakfast and activities.
First President to initiate a Cash for Clunkers Program to clean up exhaust that adds to global warming, then extended it because it was so popular — wasting hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars.
First President to abrogate bankruptcy law to turn over control of companies to his union supporters.
First President to bypass Congress and implement the Dream Act through executive fiat.
First President to order a secret amnesty program that stopped the deportation of illegal immigrants across the U.S., including those with criminal convictions.
First President to demand a company hand over $20 billion to one of his political appointees.
First President to terminate America’s ability to put a man in space.
First President to have a law signed by an auto-pen without being present.
First President to arbitrarily declare an existing law unconstitutional and refuse to enforce it.
First President to threaten insurance companies if they publicly spoke out on the reasons for their rate increases.
First President to tell a major manufacturing company which state they are allowed to locate a factory in.
First President to file lawsuits against the states he swore an oath to protect (AZ, WI, OH, IN).
First President to withdraw an existing coal permit that had been properly issued years ago.
First President to fire an inspector general of Americorps for catching one of his friends in a corruption case.
First President to appoint 45 czars to replace elected officials in his office.
First President to golf 73 separate times in his first two and a half years in office, 90 to date.
First President to pledge complete transparency while campaigning, then hide his medical, educational,and travel records.
First President to win a Nobel Peace Prize for doing NOTHING to earn it.
First President to go on multiple global ‘apology tours’.
First President to go on 17 lavish vacations, including date nights and Wednesday evening White House parties for his friends; paid for by the taxpayer.
First President to have 22 personal servants (taxpayer funded) for his wife.
First President to keep a dog trainer on retainer for $102,000 a year at taxpayer expense.
First President to repeat the Holy Qur’an and tells us that the early morning Islamic call to worship is the most beautiful sound on earth.
Now it is up to us Freedom-loving Americans to see to it that he is voted out after his FIRST term. May God bless America again. Stay safe, and be aware of your surroundings.
This is great news to hear. We have finally become a country that will provide health care to all. I for one am tired of paying for others, such as young people, who do not carry health insurance, use emergency rooms for their health care and then we who do carry insurance pay for theirs through higher taxes and higher health insurance costs. It will also mean my elderly parents will have better health care too and I will not have to provide funding to make up the difference for the donut hole they both fall into for Parkinson's medication and paying for their supplemental insurance. This is a great day for those of us who do pay.
Old Bonehead Boehner, the weeper really has something to weep and whine and cry about now. This country is sick and tired of the Repubs T.P's trying to shove their bigoted views down our throats.
Obama is a make it happen kind of president. Mittens is a big fat joke and the country sees it. The GREAT OUTSOURCER OF AMERICAN JOBS.
Anyone who has experienced serious illness knows that we need heathcare and we need it quickly unlike the Republicans who want the Medicare people to just go away and quietly die.
Regardless of the rule of SCOTUS , Obamacare is a bad law.
(1) It increases uncertainty and decreases confidence when recovery from the Great Recession requires more confidence and less uncertainty. The ACA isn’t highly popular; the Kaiser Family Foundation finds that 44 percent of Americans now view it unfavorably and 37 percent favorably. Given the ACA’s complexities, people can’t know where they’ll get insurance and what it will cost. In 2014, the ACA requires all employers with 50 or more full-time workers to provide insurance or pay fines (“the employer mandate”). On the one hand, formal economic studies conclude that most employers now offering insurance will continue to do so; on the other, in direct surveys of firms, 30 percent or more say they might drop insurance and pay fines. Uncovered people must buy insurance (“the individual mandate”) or face penalties, though government will subsidize households with incomes up to four times the poverty level ($92,200 for a family of four in 2012).
(2) The ACA discourages job creation by raising the price of hiring. This is basic economics. If you increase the price of labor, companies will buy less of it. Requiring employers to buy health insurance for some workers makes them more expensive, at least in the short run. Particularly vulnerable are low-skilled workers, notes economist Diana Furchtgott-Roth of the Manhattan Institute. Because the employer mandate exempts firms with fewer than 50 workers, there’s a huge incentive for firms to stop at 49, she says.
(3) Uncontrolled health spending is the U.S. system’s main problem — and the ACA makes it worse. Spiraling health costs crowd out other government programs and squeeze wage increases by diverting compensation dollars into employer-paid insurance. Because insured people use more health services than the uninsured, the ACA (covering an estimated 30 million more) raises spending. As for the ACA’s cost-control provisions, even the government’s own actuaries don’t believe they will do much. By their latest projection, total health spending — government and private — rises from 17.9 percent of the economy (gross domestic product) in 2010 to 19.6 percent in 2021. In 1980, health care was 9 percent of GDP.
(4) Obama’s program also worsens the federal budget problem. Driven by Medicare and Medicaid, health care already exceeds one-fourth of the budget and is headed toward a third. It’s the crux of the problem. So Obama creates another huge health program. The administration’s retort: the program lowers the budget deficit. This is rhetorical hocus-pocus. Here’s what happens. From 2012 to 2022, the ACA raises federal spending by $1.762 trillion, estimates the Congressional Budget Office. However, all of this and a bit more is offset by tax increases and assumed cuts in Medicare. But these tax increases and cuts could have been used to shrink the huge budget deficits that pre-existed Obamacare. Now they can’t; moreover, the Medicare cuts might be repealed or reduced.
(5) The ACA discriminates against the young in favor of the old. Government policy already does this through payroll taxes that have young workers subsidizing Social Security and Medicare benefits. The ACA compounds the effect by forcing some young Americans to buy insurance at artificially high premiums that would pay for the care of a sicker, older population
David 475776,
Slam dunk!
It is amazing that the betas are cheering their own oppression.
Well we just took it up the A$$. Next bozo will be wanting a BJ. You libs can "handle" that one. It sounds like he wont have a problem with liberal "takers" on that one either. OPEN WIDE NOW!
So the individual mandate has been struck down. But they can still tax those who do not have health insurance, which means it wasn't entirely struck down. Weird.
• “The Affordable Care Act is constitutional in part and unconstitutional in part,” Roberts wrote.
• “The individual mandate cannot be upheld as an exercise of Congress’s power under the Commerce Clause. That Clause authorizes Congress to regulate interstate commerce, not to order individuals to engage in it.”
• But “it is reasonable to construe what Congress has done as increasing taxes on those who have a certain amount of income, but (who) choose to go without health insurance. Such legislation is within Congress’s power to tax.”
Dear Newsvine,
Please eliminate the option to collapse comments once and for all!
What purpose does it serve other than to keep Tyler and Sally very busy?
Intellect: And how do you propose paying for it? Republicans understand the ONLY way to grow an economy (and for that reason tax revenue) is by growing the private sector. And penalizing businesses is NOT going to increase hiring and will do the opposite.
I am so frustrated with this decision and trying to save this country where so many don't realize the damage that has been done. Part of me wants to throw my hands up and say "#$@% it"!! Let Democrats do EVERYTHING they want to do. Raise taxes on the rich (and middle class and poor and elderly and .....). Increase redistribution. Lower retirement age. Require employers pay for health care. Mandatory 6 week paid vacation. And so on and so on and so on. Perfect for everybody and EVERYBODY gets FREE STUFF!!
Only one problem. When there is no reward and incentive to work and start your own business then people don't. When there is no reward and incentive to work hard then people don't. Socialism has NEVER worked and is clear when you study history. Margaret Thatcher once said "The problem with Socialism is at some point you run out of other people's money".
What do you do then? When you don't have the "rich" to take money from? When you don't have businesses to take money from? But I am so frustrated with today's decision and is the start of the total collapse of this country. So maybe we should let Obama do everything he wants. Unemployment would reach 15%. GDP would be negative. Businesses will close. The "wealthy" won't invest (why bother - the gvmt will simply take anything you make) and our economy will collapse. How will you blame Republicans then? If we let Obama do everything he wants and the economy collapses (he has done a FINE job so far collapsing this economy) then how can you blame Republicans?
Right now I am seriously considering that idea. I will continue to stockpile my ammunition and continue stockpiling emergency food because when the economy collapses I will need to protect my family and my food. You will have nothing left. A gvmt that cannot find any money to buy your food or health care. A gvmt that continues to talk about raising taxes but there is nobody left to tax. And so on. The revolution will have started and a new country with freedom and liberty as ORIGINALLY promised in the Constitution can be created and you leeches and parasites that are not willing to work but rather suck the blood from our economy are on your own. I can take care of and protect my family - the question is: Can You??
First President to oust the very people who put him in office with a tax for not having insureance
Romney lost to McCain....who lost to President Obama/Biden.
Obama/Biden 2012
When can i make my elderly Moms appointment to see the end of life panel?
Just sold my shares of Kindred Healthcare Inc. , Skilled Healthcare Group
Inc.'s and Sun Healthcare Group Inc. stocks.
To early to be celebrating, time will tell whether this is good or bad. Now we can concentrate on the White House leaks and getting some answers for the Terry Family
Romney and repubs have no plan...except to take the economy down as they pledged.
The first economic plan from the republicans ...was to blow up the economy so president Obama would not have a second term. Newt said it was the first seed sown for the 2012 election. 14-15 republicans secretly met the dat after Obama took office to pledge to vote against every bill that would help the economy recover. They pledged this saying they wanted him to be a one term president. They pledged to take the economy down just to destroy the presidents plans for recovery. Bin Laden wrote down the same plan and executed 911 to take the economy down to destroy the nation. These repubs, Ryan, Cantor, DeMint, and Gingrich pledged to act like the Taliban, to act like the insurgents do,(their own actual words) to prevent President Obama from a second term. Acting like the supreme terrorist of all time Bin Laden. Traitors. Deliberately sabotaging the recovery. Ref Richard draper new book.
Ryan repub Plan...Kills socoial security and medicare. Repubs want to destroy the Post Office and privatize that also.......Take down America and give more tax breaks to the rich 1%. Romney for a worse tomorrow today!.
Vote President Obama/Biden 2012
Too bad most won’t get a tax bill for it. My taxes will still pay for all the freeloader and illegal emigrant. YEAH more debt for America when it all comes crashing and it will Obama played a bigger role that Bush did by spending a $1.4 trillion in four years then Bush spent in 8 years. I guess the saying it BUSH'S FAULT has officially goes out the door today. I do believe Bush was wrong for spending as much as he did and for the wars we were in, I disagreed a lot with President Bush's policies BUT at least he was a LEADER and that is one thing Obama is not. Obama would rather enforce Federal Marijuana Laws then the Federal Emigration Laws. I wonder why that is could be is it because Obama's own Uncle was here illegally? Probably not! Is it because that who the illegals will vote Democrat?
It is because of all of the above America has lost its way. People now only look out for what they can take for themselves. Nobody thinks of others and I am not talking about race issues in America I could spend probably three weeks speaking about that issue. I am talking about common courtesy and case in point our current United States Secretary of the Treasury is a tax cheat and funneled money to AIG from the bail out now that may be ok to some of you but it just does not sit well with me if he had said I did it was not a crime for the AIG incident or pay the Taxes that he owed than maybe it wouldn't be such a big deal to me. It seems the current president like to surround himself with cheats and frauds. That is his right but when the lie to me about it under oath I have a very serious problem with it. I have don't a lot of horrible things in my day but I know if I was running for a government office that I wouldn't try and lie. The fact is people make mistakes. When you are under oath you have a responsibility to tell the truth and the same stands for Obama. He is a bigger liar then Romney is and surrounds himself with black radicals if a White president did that today all hell would break loose. Remember nobody alive today has been a salve so cut the BS about race.
This is more for those that don't work and it takes from those that do work. Drug test the people on Welfare and put their a*s to work somewhere. If they don't like the job do it any way most Americans don't like their jobs. It is a sad day. I think this will be the point that is looked to as the straw that broke the camel’s back, when they look back in history.
Apparently nobody read the part about "premiums"--excuse me--the "tax" for not having insurance. First year: $95; second year: $320; third year: $695; then indexed for inflation. My MONTHLY premium falls in the middle between the 2nd and 3rd year penalties for REMAINING UNINSURED. It will be cheaper to pay the penalty and not carry insurance. Just exactly how did this help anyone?????
HAHA!!! The worst part of the bill was struck down!!! Well, time to get the rest of it, see you in november... :)
Lots and lots of comments restored - don't report based on disagreement, folks!
These comments stay collapsed:
Just_D_Facts, NinjaCodeMan, Moopie Barns, Zathrose, vfeinstein, first rule:
You're each suspended for a day for violating #1 of the Code of Honor.
Most of y'all have done a very good job of not making it personal.
So many people are celebrating and making offensive remarks to others, and really, you have no idea what just happened. Like other posters on here have said, I have insurance, but there are plenty of people who don't that will go to jail. Everyone should be outraged at that thought.
@Zathrose and others who have stated that they will revolt or go to states that secede. I applaud your courage and agree with you, but Americans are too weak, selfish, and dependant on government to fight and die for a cause. They, like everyone else, will whine and take it. They are slaves, but only because they allow themselves to be.
To all those that think this will mean free healthcare...what it means is that companies that can opt out of providing insurance for their employees will. Most probably won't increase their workers pay. Then the workers will have to pay their insurance with AFTER tax income. So in the end you will be paying more.
I'm curious as to how insurance companies with formulate pricing coverage, since there won't be pre-existing conditions ones current health condition probably won't factor in to the price, maybe age only. So if you are healthy your rates will increase and if not very healthy they will decrease.
So who wins, employers because they will be paying less in insurance premiums. Who loses, all of us because eventually the gov't will be telling insurance carriers what they can pay for services, which will reduce the quality of health services.
What should they have done. Actually tackled the real issues and not make everyone think they are now getting free insurance, which they aren't unless they are low income.
What's that horrible stench in the air? Oh yeah, Sociofascism. All hail King Obama and God save us all.
Did anyone really think this would not pass? He had hand-picked justices that were bought and paid for by him. My insurance has already almost doubled and is supposed to go up again, thanks to Obamacare. And to think I served 20 years in the military to come to this.
Probusiness, how is requiring everyone to buy insurance taking money from you and from the economy? I don't understand your line of reasoning here. How is requiring people to have health insurance a disincentive for them to work? How is setting up insurance exchanges so that even people without employer-provided insurance can benefit from having a group rate on their insurance -- how is that going to keep people from starting businesses?
How many people with great ideas are stuck in deadend jobs right now, instead of starting their own businesses, just because of health insurance? How many people who are on disability would not have been disabled if they'd been able to have their chronic illnesses treated in a timely fashion?
You seem to think that what just passed is universal healthcare, funded by the government. Far from it. It's a way for Americans to pick and pay for their own healthcare coverage. The money that taxpayers will spend to partially subsidize premiums for those who can't afford them will be way cheaper than the money we all spend right now to cover the costs of treating uninsured people in ERs instead of in a doctor's office.
And I don't really get how requiring people to buy health insurance from a commercial company is socialism, but Social Security and Medicare are not.
You do realize the propaganda machine will be in full swing now. Watch out for falling leaflets.
Time for yelling!
Many roads lead to the hospital not exactly the road I would of taken. But i am bias against health insurance companies.
If I was Obama I would now focus on the economy 7 days a week 24 hours a day. Stay away from social issues.
Eventually they will join you but join them as well.
Liberals drove a stake through the heart of America today. They've wanted to destroy America for a century and now their on their way.
Obamacare will usher in the largest tax increase in the history of the country. Now, if that is a good thing, then rejoice away. Where will the money come from if say, most people decide it is to their advantage to live at the poverty line which is essentially what this encourages. Keep your income at or below a certain level and you'll be just fine, all your needs will be met.
I am far better off by not working too hard, letting the government subsidise me and pay for me. I am far better off not working, which, all things considered, just means more time for fishing and waiting for Uncle Sugar to mail me the checks. Think I will take what's left of my savings and go buy a new rod and reel.
to Caligula-176: You Are Totally CORRECT; Though there are some benefits, there are Many, MONEY, Flaws which equate to LOOPHOLES Which the insurance companies will Exploit with Huge Elan. That America, The Free World Leader, Does NOT have a Universal National HealthCare System LIKE THE OTHER COUNTRIES AROUND THE GLOBE, IS A NATIONAL DISGRACE. Sure, there are some clauses that look nice for US in this new "healthcare plan" But assuredly, just as Prez O made A DEAL WITH THE DEVIL, there will be "changes to the policies" and HUGE Cost Increases. Before long Americans will be handed Monthly "healthcare" policy charges of $1000 to $4000 PER MONTH. All the while the legislators on crapital hill, who depend on insurance company PERKS, continue waging thought up and Very Profitable Wars around the Globe WHICH IS WHERE OUR HEALTHCARE FUNDING HAS GONE TO AND WILL CONTINUE TO GO TO: Into the Pockets of the 1-8%er and corporate Evil Rich. Just wait as it won't take long for this nightmare to happen. Rommel's pals at the health insurance companies are quietly applauding as they see what will occur, A HUGE WINDFALL of Money for them And NO healthcare for America. OK! the New American Revolution will just happen sooner then later.
You think unemployment is high? Bachman Turner Overdrive "you ain't see nothing yet" Why would any corporation/company hire now? In fact they will either be down sizing more than ever or shipping jobs over seas. Corporations will not be able to afford this. Especially middle/small businesses.
China, India are licking their chops with open arms. Certain bankruptcy starts now without end. The American nightmare has begun! The sad thing is, there are people that are happy about this not even considering the consequences. I really hope I'm wrong.
Wonder how much richer Chief Justice Roberts is now? It took bribes to get us this far, why would they stop now?
congratulations on winning a new tax and a progressive one at that
Alright people, let's not just read the headlines and then stop reading. You will not go to jail if you don't have health insurance, nor if you don't pay the fine. In fact, as the law reads, you don't even have to fully pay the fine but rather make an attempt to pay it. Those of you who are against this, I assume you are on medicare, medicaid or have some other government form of healthcare and believe it is a choice. Well guess what, it's NOT! It's no different than the states being able to fine you for not having car insurance. I am not ok with continuing to pay the rising costs of uninsured people using medical facilities they therefore don't deserve! If you think that having health insurance should be a choice, then I should be able to stand outside the hospital and when you show up without it, I can turn you away unless you pay up front you worthless dead beats. I can't stand Obama, but one thing I hate even more is people who think everything is a RIGHT and a CHOICE. Well it's not! The founder's of this country laid out our actual rights and nothing said you got a free ride for being an idiot! Man up, get a job, pay your share, and the government wouldn't have to step in with laws like this to make sure you are!
By the way, to the moron that said be ready for taxes to go up $4,000 per household, what are you worried about? I'm sure your refund last year was more than you paid in. The truth is, it's a very small "tax" if you will if you don't buy the insurance, but your premiums are even more so deductible nimrod!
Yes Michael Gibson,
I, as a liberal, have been subversively trying to destroy this country for 100 years, and I'm only 29!
You got your grammar mixed up too. I know riting engrish is herd, butt, u cn doe it!
"They've wanted to destroy America for a century and now THEY'RE on their way."
Contractions versus possessive pronouns, not that hard!
Anyway, if you don't like it, leave. We won't miss you. And how about this, stop bitching about the liberals and f'in vote for your side. We'll see how it shakes out on election day. I'm hoping it'll be another loss for you and that you'll just end up sobbing quietly in a corner, clutching your gun and your bible. Cause I know that's what's really important in 'Merica.
Can you sense the sarcasm yet?
Health care is GOOD for people. The bill isn't perfect, but since you yahoos think that socialized medicine is OMFG TERRIBLE COMMUNIST UNAMERICAN POLICY created by TERRORISTS TO DESTORY THE COUNTRY OMFG, it's all we can reasonably expect. Do your homework, make your own decisions and think freely. I know that may hurt your tiny little mind, it may be confusing and it may be frustrating, but it's so worth it in the end to have a broad, enlightened world view, rather than the jingoistic ignorant crap you people tend to spout like a busted sewer pipe.
Badger wrote...China, India are licking their chops with open arms."
Sure they are Badger......Only because repubs are blocking removing the tax breaks for outsourcing/(offshoring) jobs. Repubs blocking giving tax breaks for companies to return jobs to America! Vote Romney for a worser tomorrow today.
President Obama/Biden 2012 for a better today forever!
this decision will motivate voters to turn out and send obama back to chicago....the law is constitutional?.....fine.......it is still a bad law and bad policy even though the supremes ruled it to be constitutional....this doesn't change anything...obama is still a liar, a distorter, and a divider....this decision will come back to bite obama in november..
So ,...... now not only will we be taxed on everything we do, but if you don't do, you will be taxed! Good luck folks! I have already seen what is going to happen from this "health care" with my own mother who at 88 years old was denied dialysis because she was too old! She is now DEAD from her kindey failure. The only thing they did for her was pump her full of pain medication. This is what's in line for you all next. The old and useless, cast aside and no longer worth anyones time.
They failed to realize something else:
US Citizens Rights= 0. As granted in writing in the US Constitution, Bill of Rights, Founding Fathers "No Taxation without Representation" as a Primary Cause of the US Revolutionary War to break away from British Taxes (US Supreme Court stating that the mandate is "Taxation", that "Majority" 68% do not want), "Majority Rules" = Democracy, etc.. As President Obama's January 21, 2009 Patriot Acts (plural) Monitoring and Censorship of All US Communications (especially the Internet), "Anyone stating a radical change to (US) Government is a Homegrown Domestic Terrorist" (subject to Preemptive Detention), Indefinite Detentions (President Obama's December 2011 NDAA), lots of etc..
If you are wondering, how I know, it is part (the Intelligence Mission) of my job to know as much as possible about anything internal and external to the US. The information is then used to create Predictive Modelling (Symbolic Logic, Advanced Mathematics, Decision Matrices, Timelines, Historical Precedents, etc.). The other part of my job (US Military Officer with a US Civilian Agency) is to direct implemention of the provisions of President Obama's January 21, 2009 Patriot Acts, the US Insurrection Act, US NORTHCOM Contingency Plans, etc..
Employers = win. US Employers drop paying their Employees Insurance = win. People don't listen to the "There is no such thing as a Free Lunch" (someone somewhere paid for the "Free"). Or layoff some Employees to make up the cost differentials (including providing for the "Part Time" Employees.
Employees = 0. US Employers drop paying their Employees Insurance, so now those low paid employees that make too much money for Medicaid must buy Insurance. More Employees laid off to pay for the Employees not laid off, if these laid off Employees have any "assets" then they are not eligable for Medicaid.
I'm glad Ohio voted against the personal mandate. I may not have health care soon, but at least I will have the freedom to choose what to do/not do about it.
IMMATURE? IMMATURE? For what? Doing what the RWNJ's do every day on this board. Gimme a break!
Whoohoooooo! happy days are here again!
Congratulations Governor Romney, Romneycare has been upheld!!!!!!!!
Whoohoooooo!
Obama/Biden 2012 There is hope!
Starsailing which is it? First you(libs) piss and moan because Corporations/businesses are under taxed. Corporations have too many tax breaks/loopholes. Now you're saying repubs are blocking tax breaks for corps/businesses. Am I reading this wrong?
Stop the cannibals....
ROTFLMAO... Best keep an eye on your W-2 come next january. You will see a bump up in box 12. It will reflect what your employer contributes to your health insurance and IT WILL be considered as taxable income by the IRS.
You didn't really expect obama and company to give you somethring free did you? Obama even grabbed $500 billion from medicare to pay for obamacare. He justified it by saying that this medicare cut wouldn't be missed as waste, fraud and medicaid advantage elimination would provide the savings that medicare wouldn't even see.
-------------------------------------------
Sarah.....
How droll, the EU is in the straits they are because of austerity? Not even close! The Greeks want the bailout but not the strings attached, why they even had new elections to decide if they want to accept the bailout terms. IE it hasn't happened yet to the extent you say.
Ireland's banks have their own terms for their bailout and spain has already submitted a plan for their own bailout, if the EU approves.
As for germany and some of the other northern euro countries who are balking at a no strings attached type bailout, why should their own middle class be expected to provide bailouts with no strings attached? Do you really think that the german worker who retires at 65 wants to subsidize the greek workers pension who retires at 55?
Of course the deeply in debt euro countries want to see euro bonds to pay for the bailouts. It is just like asking someone to co-sign for your loan and then sticking it to your co-signer because you don't want to answer for your obligations.
BTW - How can you keep on spending and expecting your debt to not keep on increasing? Interesting that you think ryans plan would call for an immediate major cut in spending.
Before those who think this is a good thing, consider this;
'Recent estimates suggest that the law would cause 11 million people to lose their employer-provided insurance and be forced onto a government-backed insurance plan. That's a problem because 77 percent of those who now have insurance rate their current coverage as good or excellent. Only 3 percent rate their coverage as poor. For most of the 11 million forced to change their insurance coverage then, it will be received as bad news and create a pool of vocally unhappy voters.'
What's worse, these people will have to buy their own insurance with 'after tax' dollars, and lose the tax free insurance benefits that they currently enjoy through their employers. This law makes it far more cost effective for companies to cancel insurance coverage for their employees and pay a small penalty instead.
What's that I hear? Why, it's the world's smallest violin whining away for all the sore losers on the right.
Breaking News, the Alcoholic in charge Boehner sit his drink down long enough to speak on TV a few minutes. Ok, bottoms up for that time lost.
@Robert
Sorry to hear about your mother.
How did the ACA have an effect on the decision to not treat your mother? Did she have insurance? Did the insurance company deny her claim? On what basis? If it was denial based on a pre-existing condition, then "Obamacare" could have actually saved your mother's life had it been passed sooner. If the insurance company denied coverage based on her "being to old" you should sue the sh%$ out of the insurer and start pushing for a single payer health care system rather than letting cold, corporate insurance company's use profit as a motive to make decisions about people's lives.
First; For all of you less gifted that keep spouting that the gov'nment gonna put us in jail for for not having health insurance, read the bill, or at least read the article. Nonpayment of the fine(tax) cannot be pursued criminally or civilly, they cannot impose liens, There is virttually nopenalty for ignoring the whole thing.
The Court had little option other than to find that the act was constitutional, or else every other social act; Social Security, Medicare etc.. would be on the table as possibly unconstitutional. But remember, the court is not saying this is a good idea, only that it does not violate the constitution.
I personally believe it is a poorly constructed plan, and in the long run will result in higher rates for all.
It is definitely a boon for businesses which will no longer be responsible for providing, paying for, and managing employee health plans. Insurance companies and healthcare corporations will have Carte Blanche to charge what they want, and poor enforcement will continue to shift the burden to those who carry insurance.
Even more interesting is that the court decided that the Fed cannot force the States to comply. with the State run Medicaid programs. All I can say is be careful what you wish for.
What's being lost in this discussion is the Supreme Court decision that the Federal Government cannot use the threat of withholding Medicaid funds from states that 'opt out' of ACA, as Obama planned.
What's likely to happen is that the vast majority of states will now 'opt out' of ACA (which several states are already doing) and get block Medicaid grants from the Federal Government and design their own health insurance plans.
SteveJ, even though i agree with everything you are saying. That Pete guy on MSNBC just said they changed the part about not being able to collect the fine. I believe he said they can now collect the fine which i believe is a $100. So you might want to check that.
It's all too clear that this ruling is the proverbial "straw-that-broke-the-camel's-back" but naturally people are blind to this.
Maybe it's just me, but I don't see the sensibility in allowing a bill to pass under the edict of "We must pass it before we know what's in it." The framers of this law, including the person who said that line, knew very well what was in it and how to work around it. Why do you think so many people, including these framers, have opted out of it? They know what it will cost and they don't want a part of that. So basically, all the rich and powerful that they supposedly work against still get a pass and since the law states the poor and impoverished don't need to pay, guess who picks up the slack?
Then again, the court isn't ruling on sensibility here, just constitutionality. If they have found it as such, then we have to suck it up, but remember this...
When this comes back to bite us all, as all legislation eventually does, we who saw it coming will just shrug and continue our lives. Hopefully you all will be able to live with yourselves, maybe use the excuse that this particular piece had good intentions.
Too bad you forgot what the road to hell is paved with.
Ji(G) he pronounces his name: Biden
@Michelle from the woods ""Now can someone tell me how I am going to be able to PAY for my mandated health insurance?"
According to Obama - 'That's YOUR problem'.
Of course, it might be cheaper to NOT buy insurance and pay the Obama's fine, but it still costs you and you get nothing for it.
You will be in the same boat as a huge number of people in the 'middle class'. The rich already have insurance so they are not affected, and the poor get free medical insurance from Medicaid - courtesy of taxpayers like you.
Did you vote for that 'Change we can believe in'?
Someone please defend this for me in a rational sense. Here is what Obama said (and sources are given at the end of my statements):
Here is how this law was upheld in court:
So how is this a win for America, Obama, or the Democrats if Obama just went 180 degrees on his promise not to raise our taxes? He lied to everyone. He lied to you Democrats to the Republicans to the middle class. I have no respect for that from ANY president. I certainly would not call that a win for any of us.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/promise/515/no-family-making-less-250000-will-see-any-form-tax/
http://nbcpolitics.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/28/12457822-supreme-court-upholds-health-care-law?lite
Something the Justices need to clarify, which Constitution they were going by when they made this decision. The one written by the founders of this nation, or the new one written by the corporate run government in this country? The one written by the corporate run government allows for them to force people to buy products and also spend unending amounts of money as they see fit without the ok of the people. The same government that will decide if the elderly is worth saving.
Welcome to the USSA!
So it will be enforced through the IRS when people file tax returns, so the illegal immigrants that get paid under the table and don't file tax returns will still get free medical care at hospital emergency rooms, courtesy of the taxpayers.
Great 'Change" Obama.
So now I can get health insurance? Under this law not unless I pay for it and if I do not I have to pay a fine. How is this not a tax? And where do the Democrates get of saying that now millions will have health insurance? This is the biggest tax increase on the middle class I have ever seen. It is still just a free ride for the illegals and poor.
Now lets get to the point of HOW to pay for it. No new taxes....remember thats what the President said....thats what his Press Secretary said....but thats what it turned in to, a new tax
Next, the SCOTUS said it is Constitutional, there are a lot of things that are Constitutional that don't make good laws. Once people REALLY start to figure out the downfalls to the Health Care law, how popular do you think the POTUS will be then? All in time for the debates and the election. I for one cant wait to hear the President debate the merits of this. Actually it will be nice to hear him in a debate where he doesnt say 'George W. Bush' 15 times.
I will say I'm glad that states cannot be punished for not following this. My argument all along against this was States Rights. The Fed is basically mandating commerce.
J R in 1.54,
Going by your comment you seem to need to hear what is really the case. The Individual Mandate by itself was never unconstitutional. What was unconstitutional about it was that it levied a fine on those that did not have health insurance. This is because by labeling it a "fine" Congress was dictating commerce which is not within its purview.
By calling it a tax instead the IM becomes constitutional because Congress possess the right to create new taxes.
Obama - "No tax increases on those making less than $250,000 per year - I promise".
Supreme Court - "We agree with the Obama Administration argument that ACA is constitutional because it is a tax increase" - on the middle class, since the rich already have insurance, and the poor already get free care through medicaid (paid for by the taxpayers).
I can't wait for Obama's 'spin' on this now as he explains how this is 'not really a tax increase'.
When people find that this is really just a huge new tax increase on the middle class, I doubt that they will be very happy.
Millerz, go back and actually read the story. What everybody needs to understand, is that when uninsured people are treated without Obamacare, taxes, and those who have insurance foot the bill. I've known a few people who didn't have insurance, and suffered serious injuries. A few of these people were making six figures. Since they had no insurance, we supported them. Worse yet, those making big bucks, lost their income altogether. They actually lived life to the fullest, spending their money like there was no future. Now their on disabilty, and the people they owed money, got the shaft. All that being said, I must salute Justice Roberts. He did what the Constitution mandates. There is nothing to stop the Republicans from scrapping Obamacare, if they gain sufficient control of the government.
Texas, dear Texas! from tyrant grip now free,
Shines forth in splendor, your star of destiny!
Mother of heroes, we come your children true,
Proclaiming our allegiance, our faith, our love for you.
Badger...my factual post too hard for you to comprehend? "Can't you read the words coming out of my mouth?"
1.Only because repubs are blocking removing the tax breaks for outsourcing/(offshoring) jobs..... Dems had a bill taking away the tax breaks that companies use to outsource jobs to other countries.........
2. Repubs blocking giving tax breaks for companies to RETURN jobs to America! Vote Romney for a worser tomorrow today....... Dems had a bill to give tax breaks to companies to bring....JOBS...Back!..............
Badger...seems you are the one pissing and moaning......repubs blocked both while lying saying they want to create jobs in America! ooops...pants on the ground...
Oh, the misinformation in this thread!
--First, the individual mandate was UPHELD, but of course, to know that you would have to read the WHOLE RULING.
--Second, abortion is NOT covered by PPACA.
--Third, illegal immigrants do not get free healthcare in PPACA; in fact, they are specifically prohibited.
--Fourth, unions were not 'exempted' from PPACA; they were given a one-year waiver to allow them to get up to speed with moving away from the mini-med plans they offered to their part-time, low-wage members. The only true exemptions were for religious reasons, like the Amish, and for states that wanted to create their own version that was as good or better than PPACA.
--Health insurance companies must demonstrate that 80-85% of the premiums collected go back in the form of direct services to premium holders or refund the monies. Companies will have to justify their rate increases each year.
--There are subsidies available for families based on their earnings if they are not eligible for employer-based or already-government subsidized insurance.
--The health insurance pools available in 2014 will allow large groups of people to be insured and get better rates than they could otherwise on current private plans.
--Health insurance premiums rose 131% between 1999 and 2009, with the average rise since PPACA was passed has been about 5%.
--The stock market did dip today, as it dipped yesterday AND Tuesday BEFORE the ruling, but even at its lowest this week has remained above 12,000 when it was as low as 8,000 in January 2009. It amazes me that those of you who are virulently anti-Obama use the stock market dip today as 'evidence' that PPACA will crash the economy when you refuse to use the consistent rise of the stock market since Obama took office as a sign of the economy's recovery.
P.S. sonofanubis, dude, you gotta stop taking those viral emails you get from your friends as gospel. The vast majority of what you posted is completely false and has been debunked repeatedly. Please, do some research!
And this is a problem how...? If this is what it takes for the states to get off their butts and do something significant for the common good, I'm all for it.
So you're saying the rich should pay for it? Fine by me... can't get blood from a stone and all that... Oh wait, you're against the wealthy subsidizing anyone underneath their station, too... Remind me again why the Republican plan somehow DOESN'T amount to "Don't get sick and if you do, tough cookies?" Oh, that's right... because there IS no Republican plan -- not anymore anyway, since that's basically what just passed the Constitutional litmus test the conservatives are complaining about now.
Today's civics lesson: The word "Constitutional" does NOT mean "whatever I want and to hell with anything else" -- i.e., the mantra of the right. If states' rights were so unimpeachable there'd still be a brown-skinned portion of our population working farms in chains in the southeast of the nation.
With Democrats like these, even a moderate Supreme Court is considered conservative.
So according to the court the individual mandate penalty is a special tax and not a penalty or fine per se. The problem is that this tax will effect some of the 95% of Americans that the President promised that he would not raise taxes for. So the courts are confirming that the President is not keeping another of his promises. I am sure that the President will explain all of this when he goes over the health care bill "line by line" with my congressman on CSPAN as the President promised that he would. All hail the Chief!
I'm surprised byt his, but you knew the three idiot women on the SCOTUS would vote for it, they vote with their heads, which ain't much.
Well I guess the people that Elected Obama on his health care platform got what they voted for I know there were a lot of FREE loaders that thought it was going too be a free ride and got buyers remorse when they heard it was not FREE but face it he did what he campaigned on, see there are smart and there are act smart but not smart, I guess Obama was the first ....... LOL
@Ji,
The amount of the fine is immaterial if they cannot really do anything to you if you don't pay. I don't know what Pete said, but that is written into the bill and was not subject to tests for constitutionality.
This is horrible for the working poor.
Contrary to popular belief, the working poor will bear the financial brunt of this as companies who don't currently provide insurance will lower wages to make up for the added insurance cost and to remain competitive/still in business. This takes food out of the working poor's already bare pantries. The poor are also much more likely to be negatively influenced by inflated prices cause by this. They are more likely to buy at stores who keep costs down by hiring minimum wage workers and not providing insurance. The prices of goods at those stores will necessarily have to increase to account for the new insurance costs again meaning the poor will have a harder time filling their already bare pantries.
Cheer all you want progressives, but the well off will likely bear very little of the cost, unlike how it is being painted by progressives. Add to that the fact that the poor are generally young and as a whole have very little need for the health insurance they will be forced to buy. No, this is not good.
So when the inevitable backlash happens and Republicans take control of the Legislative and Executive branches they will be able to pass a law forcing people to give money to the RNC, Crossroads, etc. as long as the law has the same financing structure as the forced health insurance law. So says Chief "Justice" Roberts.
That should be easy enough to do and apparently completely consitutional.
Wow Skiddy, bet you get a lot of dates with that line.
Ixion00x, I know, as a liberal, it's impossible for you to understand the written word. Try to get a Republican to read what I wrote and explain it to you a few dozen times, you might be able to get the general idea.
Get over it. You want to drive on the road, you need insurance. You want to use the healthcare that my insurance pays for me to use, you need insurance too. Not sure how that's taking away freedoms. People keep claiming how high premiums will go now, even though insurance companies are going to have more people paying premiums and less of a burden on everyone else to pay for the uninsured, yet you think this is going to lead to HIGHER premiums for everyone else? It's just ironic that everyone wants to complain that Obama is turning the country over to socialism, yet this law, which will make everyone pay their own share and not put the burden on everyone else is bad? So you're okay with paying for other people when it comes to insurance, thats NOT socialism, but everything else is? Hmmm.
Have we even heard from anyone who doesn't have insurance and now will have to have it? Everyone complaining seems to be those already insured who are making up statistics to say they're going to have to pay more.
Caligula-1763025 - what secret? It's not a secret the insurance industry was in favor of this law. More money and less risk for them in many aspects.
ROY WILSON-336103, Jug-head spent two years convincing the stupid among us that this wasn't a tax, then he went before the court and said it WAS a tax. Now, he'll again spend the time till the election convincing the stupid among us that it ISN'T a tax, and they'll believe him, again.
@zorloc, that's ridiculous. You choose to drive, you don't choose to have a heartbeat...huge difference. Also, read my post #1.274. This is bad for a large majority of the uninsured.
If States can come up with a better plan, that includes the same results, they can. Now... if only there was a state that implemented a successful universal health care plan, run by a Republican governor... that we can look to as a model. Hmmmmm... I seem to recall a state that did just this... what was it called? Momney-care? No... Romnis-care? No... hmmmmm, can't seem to remember.
"Contrary to popular belief, the working poor will bear the financial brunt of this as companies who don't currently provide insurance will lower wages to make up for the added insurance cost and to remain competitive/still in business."
I disagree. The working poor who are a large part of my patient pool will be covered through the expansion of Medicaid (depending on what their state does with this part) or can be covered through the exchanges with part of what they will pay covered by subsidies on a sliding scale should their employers decide not to offer health insurance. Employers are not forced to provide health insurance, but will get a tax break for providing health insurance if they chose to. If you talk to my patients in this economic bracket you would find the vast majority will benefit from this, being able to get healthcare on a preventative basis AND not having to either use the ER or do without healthcare when they are sick.
Eh, no. Chief Justice Roberts realized that the Constitution of the United States does not prohibit the government from doing this and that the court has no standing to take action on it. The court basically does not 'approve' anything, it's strike it down or leave it alone. If the Constitution does not bar the government from doing something or it does not violate any of the rights it guarantees the citizens of the United States, what ever law being challenged in front of the court is allowed to stand.
Frankly, I wouldn't hold my breath. I've got a feeling a lot of people who are thinking this are going to be in for a rude awakening one of these days. On the other hand, this will be a 'great incentive' for a lot of people out there to never really strive to amount to much of anything. Health care is expensive. Health insurance coverage is expensive. If you're below a certain income level, the government will subsidize your mandatory coverage (in the interest of disclosure, they fully subsidize mine, which is 100% through the Department of Veterans Affairs, so personally, I really could care less one way or the other on this. Nothing changes for me.) Sooooo.....if you're young, healthy, and enjoying life, why bust your behind at a 'good' job and fork over a nice chunk of your income for that required insurance premium? Just get an easy, 'fun', part time job, rake in $10-15k per year or whatever working only half time or what suits your fancy, and spend the rest of your time playing video games, on social networking sites, chatting on the phone, fishing, hanging out, or anything else that grabs you? No small number of younger folks will do just that; I've known many of them through the years. You can also rest assured that the 'shadow economy' will get a real shot in the arm from this as much income will go unreported in efforts to keep the taxpayer paying for insurance instead of people having to cough it up for themselves.
Ain't that the truth! So, then, why doesn't everyone already have it? Oh, yeah. That's right. Health coverage does not equal health care. Health care means going to the doctor. Health coverage is help in paying for some (if not most, or all) of it. We have long had a shortage of physicians and other medical professionals cropping up in this country. We have a community college in my town that cranks out nursing students by the truckload, so they're essentially disposable here, but a few hundred miles' drive will land a person in a place where nurses are so hard to come by that they'll often make $75k per year just so qualified nurses can be lured into these areas, then hopefully stay there. While nurses are plentiful here, we are direly short of all types of mental health professionals in the area. Various specialists are also hard to come by, and those that are around stay booked solid and with some of them, there's routinely an 18 month waiting list, unless someone dies or moves away and creates an opening. People not seeking care because they can't, or think they can't, afford it, keeps some of the 'heat' off of many physicians, giving other people a chance to see them. Inflation, an economist will tell you, happens when too many dollars are chasing too few goods. Prices shoot up rapidly as the people who really want something become willing to spend more money that they've got in order to get it. Naturally, those who don't have it or don't want to part with it give up trying to acquire whatever it is. More people being able to have the funding available to seek medical assistance does not magically mean that there is going to be more doctors and the lines will only get longer and longer. Doing anything to 'create' more doctors, PA's, nurses, etc., provided it's effective, won't have any effect for at least several years. One can't just decide it's a great time to become a physician and start practicing medicine next Monday morning!
Now...
It will be interesting to see where this leads now. The healthcare crisis many of us know is all about money - health care, and thus health coverage, costs too much! Too much for most of us, anyway. The problem is MONEY. So we're solving this by throwing more money at it? Remember what happened when college educations started to get expensive, so a lot of scholarships, grants, and loans became available? I'd say what we're dealing with here is kind of like a fire, where the problem is that something combustible is on fire. And the 'solution' is adding more 'something combustible' to the mix. Nice.
I suspect this is going to end up a lot like Prohibition. A lot of people clamored for it, some for a good 50 years or so before it was finally enacted. They could point out all kinds of wonderful reasons why no one should have or consume alcoholic beverages. Then, in 1919, the Volstead Act was instituted, and all their wish was granted. Throughout the 20's, America found out the hard way that not only was it largely ineffective, it was resented by many and flouted, even outright defied, by some. No, not everyone suddenly started drinking in rebellion, but it did spur a lot of people to start who otherwise hadn't really been. A relative handful really created some serious problems that they would not have had Prohibition never come to pass, and too many people were injured and killed as a result. After about a dozen years, wiser heads prevailed and it was decided to do away with Prohibition.
I would not be surprised if this may well lead the US into a genuine economic depression. We've been startlingly close to one for several years now, with true unemployment rates not all that far away from the 20-25% numbers of the early 1930's. There are a surprising number of small businesses, and many not so small, that derive a good portion of their revenues from discretionary spending of younger adults. This means they sell products and services that appeal to that demographic, and that people in that age range tend to have money to blow on stuff that they could ill afford to in a few years when they've settled down and started a family. A lot of younger, healthy people who are not paying for insurance are spending that money on things they enjoy spending it on, instead. For a young, healthy adult, health insurance starts at well over $100 a month in most cases. If you have to pay that bill, or else the 'tax' to the IRS for not having health insurance, you're not spending that money downtown, at the mall, or wherever. There are a lot of boutique type shops that will not be long for this world at that point. Many other larger, more well established businesses, could lose anywhere from an eighth to a third of their sales revenue, depending, in short order. That may not be fatal per se, but it would certainly result in A LOT of layoffs and probably no new hiring for quite some time as they struggle to stay afloat. A very small business closing may cost the job of the proprietor and a handful of hired helpers, mostly young high school and college age folks trying to earn a few bucks. A larger retailer could be forced to lay of hundreds, or even thousands, in order to remain economically viable. And this could happen thousands of times over.
I don't hear any mention of any caps or limits on premiums! I'm hoping I just missed that part, because if more and more people have to be subsidized, I doubt the rates of those who aren't are going to remain steady for long. That's the scary part.
I think the decision perfectly fulfills the prophesy that the SCOTUS would hand Obama a lump of coal. The administration got Obamacare... but seriously wounded. The mandate WAS indeed a tax increase and it is the most unpopular feature....and is live tinder for continued political agitation. But it lost the power to force Medicaid increases in coverage and costs on the states. And, most importantly, it lost the expansion of the Commerce clause that would have validated the underlying premise of the Nanny State.
@ Bob - Apparently nobody read the part about "premiums"--excuse me--the "tax" for not having insurance. First year: $95; second year: $320; third year: $695; then indexed for inflation. My MONTHLY premium falls in the middle between the 2nd and 3rd year penalties for REMAINING UNINSURED. It will be cheaper to pay the penalty and not carry insurance. Just exactly how did this help anyone?????
You're right, I read the renalty part of it too. There aren't even late fees or interest to be charged for late or non-payment.
Tony_Baloney "You will be in the same boat as a huge number of people in the 'middle class'. The rich already have insurance so they are not affected, and the poor get free medical insurance from Medicaid - courtesy of taxpayers like you..............So you're saying the rich should pay for it?"
Not at all. The rich won't have to pay for it because they already have health insurance. Each family will now have to prove to the IRS that they have health insurance 'acceptable to the government' or pay a fine (tax).
That burden will fall almost entirely on the middle class, since the government will cover the poor for free under Medicaid and the rich are not affected.
This is a huge $700 Billion tax increase on the Middle Class because a family earning $35,000 per year will still not be able to pay $10,000 per year out of pocket for health insurance - thanks to Obama.
"I can stop paying for health insurance now!!!"
On the contrary - you will now be REQUIRED to pay for health insurance - whether you can afford it or not.
I hope this decision finally shuts the re"pig"licans up. "con"servatives are so stupid and idiotic. I am not a democrat or liberal either, but it is amazing for everyone to get healthcare. It just does not make any sense for the re"pig"licans to oppose the health care law unless they are just being dicks and difficult. No matter how wonderful and great a law is, the pigs will just oppose it just to oppose it because they are upset they did not get to do it first or that it was their idea.
Also, the democrats have supported many "con"servative laws even though they were unconstitutional, but you do not hear the democrats crying about the lame and horrible laws that the moronic re"pig"licans pass.
I mean the social security law is so unconstitutional to make everyone pay taxes for something that we may not even see one penny from and that is a re"pig"lican law as well as medicare and medicaid, but when a smart and intelligent democrat tries to pass similar laws, the re"pig"licans cry to mommy.
I say boo hoo to you, you evil and vile pigs (re"pig"licans) and con artists ("con"servatives). What are you all going to do now? apeal it again. Just let it go and be happy for all the people who get to have health insurance, which is affordable. You know how many people this law will help. Millions and millions of people. It is great, and now you have a very powerful "con"servative supreme court justice who says that the law is constitutional. So, there. Shut up and start your next idiotic and stupid battle. I am sure that the re"pig"licans have plenty of other dumb ideas and false claims to make about other laws and ideas that the democratic party has made or will made.
I would like to see the re"pig"licans come together now and support the health care law and focus their attention on having a healthier and more appropriate presidential candidate who is not racist, sexist, biased, ageist, and prejudice. I mean, come on, Romney is a tool. Obviously, Mitt is trying to fight battles out of hate and stupidity instead of him focusing on what matters, such as the economy. Oh wait, he doesn't know how to deal with any problems what so ever because he is an out of touch rich pig who only cares about billionaires. Come on, it does not make any sense to support re"pig"licans and "con"servatives unless you are at least a millionaire because that is all they care about is keeping the rich rich and the middle class and poor poor. In addition, it does not make any sense to support the re"pig"licans if you are not white. For one, re"pig"licans hate minorities and people who are not born in the United States. It always makes me sick to see someone who is not Caucasian who is a re"pig"lican and "con"servative. Do they think that Romney and co. care about them. I don't know who is more stupid, the Romeny and the re"pig"licans or the minorities and foreign citizens who say they are re"pig"licans. They obviously do not know what the pigs are trying to do.
This country will never fully progress and succeed while we have re"pig"licans and "con"servatives living in the United States. It is such an old and ignorant party who focuses on treating others differently and oppressing women and minorities. Re"pig"licans are evil and disgusting.
It is so nice that we can get insurance without being denied for preexisting conditions. What a special and amazing victory. I wish the re"pig"licans would stop trying to make like horrible, aweful, and miserable for the citizens of the United States. That makes me sick. I guess under re"pig"lican rule, if I was sick, I wouldn't be able to get affordable health care and then I would probably die. I guess that is what the re"pig"licans really want and do not understand is that their ignorant and stupid lack of support for the health care law will really kill and neglect our children and citizens who cannot get the health care that they need.
What a victory indeed. But, we already new that the health care law was a great and amazing accomplishment and victory. We just had to swat the flies, I mean pigs away, I mean the con artists who are trying to ruin what is good and right in this world just because they have so much hate for the demcrats.
Let's hope the 14% of people who are underemployed, not employed, or have given up finding a job reverse that status before they have to pay for the health insurance or face a fine.
First of all what koolaide are you drinking there is a lot more than 14% underemployed, unemployed or just too poor to pay for the forced insurance.
I was a dumocrate until Obuma was picked for the dumocrate candidate and now I will vote republican. I hope that all of the people that voted this bill in get beat in there re-election. what a shame that good ol' teddy drown em and leave em did not die a little earlier and had not been able to help cram this bill down our throats, as for Tim Johnson dumcrate sd, obuma's yes man his brain hemorrhage did permanent damage and he should not be allowed to vote period. God help this country we need it with obuma and the dumocrates running it to the ground.
Oh, by the way. The re"pig"licans do not care about anyone but themselves. So selfish greedy. Wake up everyone and see the truth of how bad and evil the re"pig"licans really are. All they want is for all our taxes to do into their pockets and to the military and to big busienss. re"pig"licans are so hypocritical. They do not want the government in our business, but they want to pass laws that takes away all of people's freedoms, such as making women do things to their bodies that they do not want to do. or, the re"pig"licans try to take away rights of monority groups such as homosexuals and immigrants. It is disgusting that re"pig"licans can treat others with such disrespect and oppression, but when the democrats try and do something good, the pigs cry that it is unconstitutional, but it is ok for the pigs to take away some groups freedoms and choices. That is proof that the pigs are hypocrites and only care about themselves and do not want goodness to prevail in the United States. They just want to be rich.
Oh, by the way. The re"pig"licans do not care about anyone but themselves. So selfish greedy. Wake up everyone and see the truth of how bad and evil the re"pig"licans really are. All they want is for all our taxes to do into their pockets and to the military and to big busienss. re"pig"licans are so hypocritical. They do not want the government in our business, but they want to pass laws that takes away all of people's freedoms, such as making women do things to their bodies that they do not want to do. or, the re"pig"licans try to take away rights of monority groups such as homosexuals and immigrants. It is disgusting that re"pig"licans can treat others with such disrespect and oppression, but when the democrats try and do something good, the pigs cry that it is unconstitutional, but it is ok for the pigs to take away some groups freedoms and choices. That is proof that the pigs are hypocrites and only care about themselves and do not want goodness to prevail in the United States. They just want to be rich.
One thing is for sure... Fox News has been extremely successful at spreading false information and lies to the public.
So much misinformation... it's not even worth it. Go watch your Hannity, ROY. You two can scream together like an angry, old married couple.
Obama and Dimnocrats may have won today, but the victory will be hollow when they all go home in November. This action has P**sed off a lot of people and energized them to get out there and make sure Obama and his minions are not re-elected. The court admonished the American People, telling them it is not their responsibility to save them from their bad decisions...(who they voted into office.) Only the kool-aid drinkers and the free loaders will vote for them now.
Romney, you got a big boost today, make sure you follow through with your promise, and Republicans, be ready with a new plan that actually addresses the problems with health insurance.
@momus, "Nope! I'm not worried about going to jail, because I've never been uninsured! Not only that; I'm a veteran! I earned the health-care I receive through the VA."
Funny, I'm a veteran too; I was recently required to buy supplemental insurance or not recieve care and 5 months after I did, my benefits were yanked completely. You might want to check your status with the VA...
willowbrook
When has Romney ever... EVER... followed through with any promise, or anything he has ever said? What would make you think that Romney will follow through with ANYTHING he says?
Are you just ignoring his entire political career? His fastest flip-flop is clocked at 3 hours... 3 hours, and he completely changed positions. What in the world would make you think that Romney will EVER follow through with ANYTHING he says? What possible evidence do you have to support that claim?
It would benefit people if they actually read the decisions, both for and against the ACA before spouting their opinions.
CJ Roberts said that the Supreme Court is not there (paraphrasing) to mitigate the consequences of voter decisions, they are there to rule on the Law's Constitutionality.
While I disagree with CJ Roberts in his majority opinion that the alleged "penalty" for not having Health Insurance is actually a "tax" therefore within the powers delegated to Congress, I wonder how it can be enforced when there are no "penalties" for failure to pay. It would seem that all one would have to do is change their witholding (W4) to reduce the amount of taxes taken from their paychecks to the point where they break even or have to pay a portion at the end of the year. How this is going to be accomplished will be interresting to see unfold.
The bottom line is that Government just got bigger.
Nowhere in the Supreme Court decision does it state that health care is a right, all the majority said is that Congress made a law that is Constitutional, that it does not fit under the Commerce Clause, and that WE are responsible for OUR decisions politically. The saying that "Elections have consequences" is no more evident than in the anouncement by the Supreme Court.
George H.W. Bush lost an election in part because he said "no new taxes, period" then he had to sign legislation imposing increased taxes.
Barack H. 0bama said he would "not raise taxes on people who made less than $250k per year." I hope that the self described liberals and progressives here hold him to his promise and help to vote him into retirement Nov. 6, 2012.
Because your taxes will go up starting in 2014. And not by the estimates you have seen presented by the 0bama Administration, but by a percentage of your income as the law is written.
And you thought 0bama wouldn't lie to you?
Over 120 NEW TAXES in the ACA, including a 3.8% SALES TAX on House Sales! I guess we are not allowed to sell our homes any longer without "contributing" to Fedzilla.
@ROY WILSON-336103
I realize that inflection cannot always be properly conveyed in printed text, but trust me when I say I was being sarcastic in my reply you quoted. Regardless, you're welcome (I guess) for the opportunity my post gave you to reiterate your negative commentary. You're correct that (almost) everyone will now be paying into the system, whether by purchasing health insurance or paying the "get out of responsibility but not for free" penalty/tax/whatever. However, it's awfully disingenuous for you to not mention the upside of it, i.e. the rest of what the legislation does in exchange for us all paying into it, such as the additional regulation of the health insurance marketplace to enforce fair, unbiased offerings to the public, preventing price-gouging, forcing insurance entities to apportion their expenditures properly or be compelled to grant refunds -- in other words, all that stuff we know as today's status quo that needed correcting. Sounds like a good trade in theory; we'll see what the next few years brings as it's put into practice. In the meantime, you're complaining about the wrong things for the wrong reasons. Get off the right-wing talking points and argue the substance of the bill, if you will, because stamping your feet and saying, "Look! They're making us PAY for this!" and assuming it's bad without bothering to learn what you're really getting is just ignorant.
I'm PRETTY sure THAT guy was being sarcastic, too. Regardless, your supposition here is wrong. The law basically states that those with income below a certain threshold are exempted, as noted by Roberts in his majority opinion. I'm still poring through it all to wrap my head around the details before I comment on specifics; maybe you should, too.
Welcome to the rest of the industrialized world. Don't like it??? Move to Somalia.
Ladies and gentlemen, on June 28, 2012, at exactly 10:00 AM, the Supreme Court of the United States declared the Affordable Care Act to be constitutional. This from the same court that opened the floodgates to corporate campaign financing and essentially gave George W. Bush the keys to the White House. This is truly a great triumph, not only for Obama and the Democratic Party, but for the entire nation. Now, this law is not perfect; it lacks a public option (to the consternation of many liberals, like myself); it does not focus enough energy on lowering costs (yet it does bend the curve of increasing costs); it offers exemptions to millions of Americans. But, after decades of trying and failing, healthcare reform has finally come to America. Not only does it deal with the embarrassing statistics of uninsured people in the Land of Plenty, but it also opens the door for further reforms, and hopefully the introduction of single-payer healthcare into the United States. Finally, we can join the ranks of the rest of the industrialized world who have universal healthcare.
Now, Republicans have sought to repeal this measure, as we all know very well. The irony that lies in this is that the Republicans created the concept of the individual mandate to serve as a "free-market alternative" to Bill Clinton's more government-centered healthcare plan. Prominent Republicans like Newt Gingrich and, lo and behold, Mitt Romney, supported the individual mandate; Romney even adopted it in Massachusetts and promoted it for the rest of the nation until he ran for president. Obama himself opposed the individual mandate, favoring single-payer healthcare, but settled for it when it became apparent that government-run healthcare was, for the time being, politically unfeasible. Now, is the issue of healthcare over??? No. Costs are still high in our nation and outpacing inflation; we still have millions of uninsured Americans even with this bill; and we need to deal with the growing costs of Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security (which this bill deals in part, but not completely). But this has opened the door to fixing all these problems, and truly making America the land of opportunity and wealth.
And to all those who say that this shall lead to socialism, I say no @!$%#ing way. For one thing, the entire health insurance industry requires compulsory participation if it is to be efficient. For another, this is a CONSERVATIVE idea brought about by the very Heritage Foundation that now condemns it. And finally, who cares???? People lambasted programs like Social Security, Medicare, and even the G.I. Bill as either socialist or pertaining to welfare. And yet they were huge successes. If this is socialist, then let it be. America is supposed to be open to all ideas; if socialist policies work, than they ought to be implemented, or at least considered.
Thank God the bill is constitutional. We are finally free from the bonds of capitalist and conservative ideologies and our own stubbornness. As Winston Churchill once said, "Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing...after they have exhausted all other possibilities. Amen.
OBAMA BIDEN 2012
YEAH!!!!!! So sad for those of you that are so unhappy about this. Sometimes things go your way and sometimes they don't. Wait till November...
OBAMA 2012!!!
I can't believe that the re"pig"lican and "con"servative readers of this community and MSNBC collapsed my post when everything I said is so true and honest and a fact. That is censorship and unlike the health care law, collapsing my post and taking away my freedom of speech is unconstitutional. But, as I read, the re"pig"lican posts are so degrading and threatening, but the community and MSNBC do not censor or collapse those posts. I see what is really going on here. I rest my case on the fact that re"pig"licans and "con"servatives are vile, evil, disgusting, should leave the United States and start their own country, which will resemble China and/or Cuba, but maybe the USSR because the re"pig"licans want the government to take away our rights and freedoms and have laws in place that discriminate others and keep the rich rich and the poor and middle class poor. That is pure communism and socialism. I think that the re"pig"licans claim that the democrats are being socialist to distract everyone from the truth that they are the true communists and socialists. The re"pig"lican party and conservative beliefs are a cruel and sick joke. My question to the pigs is "is it worth your soul?"
I am re posting the following because of the jerks who tried to censor me and take away my freedom of speech. If I have to read your lies and hatred, you should have to read my honesty and facts. Trust me pigs, it is for your own good. And, if I can show the light to at least a few people, it was worth it. Unlike the pigs and the con artists, I am trying to do good and create a better and healthier world. I guess the pigs want to live in this aristocratic society. Shame on you.
I hope this decision finally shuts the re"pig"licans up. "con"servatives are so stupid and idiotic. I am not a democrat or liberal either, but it is amazing for everyone to get healthcare. It just does not make any sense for the re"pig"licans to oppose the health care law unless they are just being dicks and difficult. No matter how wonderful and great a law is, the pigs will just oppose it just to oppose it because they are upset they did not get to do it first or that it was their idea.
Also, the democrats have supported many "con"servative laws even though they were unconstitutional, but you do not hear the democrats crying about the lame and horrible laws that the moronic re"pig"licans pass.
I mean the social security law is so unconstitutional to make everyone pay taxes for something that we may not even see one penny from and that is a re"pig"lican law as well as medicare and medicaid, but when a smart and intelligent democrat tries to pass similar laws, the re"pig"licans cry to mommy.
I say boo hoo to you, you evil and vile pigs (re"pig"licans) and con artists ("con"servatives). What are you all going to do now? apeal it again. Just let it go and be happy for all the people who get to have health insurance, which is affordable. You know how many people this law will help. Millions and millions of people. It is great, and now you have a very powerful "con"servative supreme court justice who says that the law is constitutional. So, there. Shut up and start your next idiotic and stupid battle. I am sure that the re"pig"licans have plenty of other dumb ideas and false claims to make about other laws and ideas that the democratic party has made or will made.
I would like to see the re"pig"licans come together now and support the health care law and focus their attention on having a healthier and more appropriate presidential candidate who is not racist, sexist, biased, ageist, and prejudice. I mean, come on, Romney is a tool. Obviously, Mitt is trying to fight battles out of hate and stupidity instead of him focusing on what matters, such as the economy. Oh wait, he doesn't know how to deal with any problems what so ever because he is an out of touch rich pig who only cares about billionaires. Come on, it does not make any sense to support re"pig"licans and "con"servatives unless you are at least a millionaire because that is all they care about is keeping the rich rich and the middle class and poor poor. In addition, it does not make any sense to support the re"pig"licans if you are not white. For one, re"pig"licans hate minorities and people who are not born in the United States. It always makes me sick to see someone who is not Caucasian who is a re"pig"lican and "con"servative. Do they think that Romney and co. care about them. I don't know who is more stupid, the Romeny and the re"pig"licans or the minorities and foreign citizens who say they are re"pig"licans. They obviously do not know what the pigs are trying to do.
This country will never fully progress and succeed while we have re"pig"licans and "con"servatives living in the United States. It is such an old and ignorant party who focuses on treating others differently and oppressing women and minorities. Re"pig"licans are evil and disgusting.
It is so nice that we can get insurance without being denied for preexisting conditions. What a special and amazing victory. I wish the re"pig"licans would stop trying to make like horrible, aweful, and miserable for the citizens of the United States. That makes me sick. I guess under re"pig"lican rule, if I was sick, I wouldn't be able to get affordable health care and then I would probably die. I guess that is what the re"pig"licans really want and do not understand is that their ignorant and stupid lack of support for the health care law will really kill and neglect our children and citizens who cannot get the health care that they need.
What a victory indeed. But, we already new that the health care law was a great and amazing accomplishment and victory. We just had to swat the flies, I mean pigs away, I mean the con artists who are trying to ruin what is good and right in this world just because they have so much hate for the demcrats.
I am glad and thankful that the Justices voted for the higher ideal. As for the actual application? My opinion is that the enemys of national health care have stuck a significant number of trigger points in this bill. How will those 'come out in the wash'? At his time, I do not know.
Other than that, I really hope that the widespread problem of lack of integrity in the health care industry will also be addressed; that in and of itself could be the undoing of the whole new system.
Will we be made into commodities? That intent may exist, as some corporations (I do not recall which ones) have been attempting to patent the genes of the human race.
Zen...doode I believe you mean right wing fascist dictatorship is what the Republicans truly stand for Heil Hitler...thats what they were.Communism is the 180 degree opposite of fascist totalitarianism though Communism still takes away your freedom,but Communism in its pure form stillguarantees you food,healthcare and a roof over your head,you just have to do everything the govt tells you,Fascism does not.They will tell you where to go,what to believe and what to do and if you dont they will kill you and as far as food and healthcare are concerned your on you own.
Romney 2012.....Obama = Epic Fail
The little sheep just think they won 'free healthcare' and guarantees. The only guarantee they got was that the Supreme Court just gave Congress the taxing powers only dreamed of in nightmares. The tax and spend crowd just got a huge boost, ditto the insurance companies, big Pharma, GE and SEIU. Welcome to your new and improved 'tax' masquerading as healthcare.
When Republican pundits talk about "Freedom for America", the majority of them connotate "Freedom" if you can afford to buy it, "America" means "Corporate America" or are you all too ignorant to see that? When was the last time a Neo-Conservative had your individual freedom at heart? Abortion has been and never will be FEDERALLY FUNDED or are you so stupid you don't understand how health care is reimbursed/not reimbursed by Insurance Companies? As a Health Care Professional I am sick and tired of informing patients and their families that they are being denied coverage for a particular treatment, diagnostic, or physician referral becuse their "Health Insurance Carrier" won't pay for it. As Americans we have always cared about and for one another with empathy and compassion. The only losers here are the Insurance Brokers and CEO's who charge outrageous prices for Health Care Coverage that never meets the needs of the insured (Unless you are wealthy enough to pay for the most coverage at the best institutions with the best providers.) and invest YOUR premiums in the Stock Market to get rich off of you! Romney says it will "Kill Jobs?" It already has...Nursing Professionals have had their patient loads increased with actual bedside care decreased by CORPORATE OWNED HOSPITALS that care only about bottom line profit. Profiting by the illness of a Human Life is Pathological. Soon your Nurse will be replaced by something less qualified. Compassion and empathy in the Nursing Education System across the Country no longer exists. What do you want when you are scared, sick, out of work or underpaid faced with making life altering decisions. Government, weather Federal, State or Local was designed and established to do what the private sector cannot or in this case will not do. Some of you who write such toxic words should volunteer in a free medical or dental clinic. Maybe you will see this is a different light. People who oppose ANYTHING that is not Corporate Business Generated will call it what it is not. A TAX. GOVERNMENT RUN HEALTH CARE. They say these things because they do not care weather you or I live or die. Catastrophic Illness will change you. If you lack the ability to see life threatening issues in another human being's skin, then you are not Humane. That is what separates us from the uncivilized, not how much money you generate to pay off your politicians and CEO's. Not how much you can accumulate in wealth and not make a service contribution to make the human condition more bearable. World wide studies have proven that our Corporate Health Care Structure does not administer care efficiently or effectively. The United States ranks among the highest in infant mortality of any developed Nation in the entire World. How's that for compassion? The United States ranks the highest in elder deaths of any developed Nation in the entire World. Long Term Care for the aged is not considered a profitable investment. When did you consider your aging parent or grandparent a profit margin? This is sick. So when Michelle Bachman, Rick Perry, Mitt Romney state that the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of the United States of America made an "Unconstitutional Decision" are they in their sane minds? Obviously they know little about the Constitution and what it says. If anyone is going to tax the Law, it will be someone who is looking at perpetuating the gross wealth of Insurance Companies to "Fund" their CEO's wealth accumulating interest. Health Care will be payed for from a pool of those who have the ability to pay, who are "well" vs. those who need care who have traditionally been disenfranchised from the system. The myth that the Federal Budget MUST be Balanced is a falacy. Who plans for extreme and worsening disasters (9/11, Colorado Wildfires, Florida flooding, "Katrina", devastating tornadoes, etc.) how can ANY Government plan that into a working "BUDGET?" Again, that is what we Constitutionally agreed upon a tax based Government. We have moved from generating jobs through industry to outsourcing to not taxing International Businesses that locate to the U.S., to not taxing Corporations enough. Left to their own decisions Corporate CEO's will not pay any more than the minimum tax allowed them...and they can afford to pay in to this Democracy. They NOT to. You and I have no choice because our payroll checks have an established 30%-38% tax burden whereby our roads must be maintained, our Fire Fighters are paid, Our Paramedics are paid, our Police Departments are paid, our ER & Trauma Romms stay opened in addition to pay into State and Local Tax burdens. We have a duty to pay for Veterans Benefits and their Healthcare for fighting our battles. So, get rid of the Pentagon. When there are no more payroll taxes, fire the Litigators in the House of Representatives and the Senate and all of their expensive massive staff and we will no longer have a Government...it will be anarchy and the U.S. will be reclaimed by British Colonial Rule or the rest of U.S. will be purchased by Syria. Good Luck with that one!
Exactly right. My honey and I WAY more than that (six figures) and we have hefty copays on our plans carried by our respective employers, and each year they take a bigger and bigger bite, although we have decent plans. If we're finding it difficult to meet the insurance expense, what makes the Obama administration and the SCOTUS think that a family making 35K is going to fork over half of it's income in insurance payments?
Folks, you honestly don't think these families will pay an insurance company over paying their mortgage, do you?
Didn't think so.
hahaha...the simple fact is the nation is short of doctors by approximately 100,000 doctors to implement this stupidity , cool , and well under than 50% of internists (a primary care doctor who deals with adults) accept Medicaid patients , so what are libbys gonna do? , put a gun to their heads and MAKE them take patients? , I don't think so although an attempt to wouldn't be to unexpected.
...and since the student loan takeover was , for some stupid azz reason , included in this "health care law" I envision your heros telling new college loan applicants that "we don't have money for a business degree , but we DO have money for medical degress , if you take the cash and graduate you can work where we tell you until you have paid it back , it will be cool "
"and well under than 50% of internists (a primary care doctor who deals with adults) accept Medicaid patients"
While this has been cited over and over by conservative pundits, it comes from a poll of Massachusetts physicians ONLY. PPACA contains provisions for training new physicians, particularly in primary care and for rural areas.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-06-20-medicare_N.htm
" The American Medical Association says 17% of more than 9,000 doctors surveyed restrict the number of Medicare patients in their practice. Among primary care physicians, the rate is 31%."
hmmm doesn't say a thing about Massachusetts
Texas Tribune
"The proportion of Texas doctors accepting all new Medicaid patients has tumbled in the last decade — falling from 67 percent to 42 percent, according to a Texas Medical Association survey. Medicare acceptance took a similar spill in that study, dropping from 78 percent to 64 percent."
article doesn't mention Massachusetts
http://mlyon01.wordpress.com/2007/07/19/note-to-medicaid-patients-the-doctor-wont-see-you/
"About 51% of family physicians in California participate in Medicaid. For a number of specialties, such as orthopedic surgery, the percentage is much lower, according to the California HealthCare Foundation."
article does not mention Massachusetts study
"In Michigan, the number of doctors who will see Medicaid patients has fallen from 88% in 1999 to 64% in 2005. Many of those doctors tightly cap how many they’ll see or refuse to take on new Medicaid patients. At the same time, enrollment in the program in Michigan has risen more than 50% to nearly 1.6 million since 1999."
some of that info is from as far back as 2007 , do you think that those doctors changed their minds and are accepting them now?
you lose......again
Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country
JFK
JFK wouldn't recognize the libbies of today...you know , entitlements and all
"PPACA contains provisions for training new physicians, particularly in primary care and for rural areas."
what is that going to do ? , are they gonna force people to "get trained" , that's just what I want in a doctor ,someone who didn't "choose" to be a doctor...more libby babble and rhetoric
Romneycare upheld. Yeah!!!!
This stinks just as bad as Prohibition stunk. Unconstitutional regardless of what those pompous asses say. They are either SERIOUSLY out of touch with the reality of the people, or they are purposely trying to screw the living hell out of us...
If you have to ask, the system for medical training needs an overhaul. Only the US demands that inpsiring new docs go through four years of college, gain admission to med school, which by the way is limited on a yearly basis, do a four year training in medicine and then intern for another two years minimum. If the educational system modified medical training like Britain or Canada this would save ten of thousands of dollars, cut the limiting of admission to med school we would have plenty of docs. Of course begin limiting educating all of the foreign students who get free rides in addition to stipens we would not have a shortage of docs. In turn the AMA would need to agree to modify limiting physicians licensed on a yearly basis and open the doors. I believe the supply side of the curve would be met or actually a surlpus would be seen causing the cost of medical care to decrease due to the supply side curve being greater than the demand and docs would not have huge debt loads to pay back. It is, was all regulated to create more money for those docs who are licensed through a restrictive system.
Well, I don't know what "dirt" Barry has on Roberts, but I think Roberts may have just put the final nail in Barry's coffin as payback!
Come on November!!! 130 days and counting!!
One and DONE! C YA!
Let's see now;
The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office now says that Obamacare, which was supposed to be 'revenue neutral', will likely cost $1.76 Trillion (link below), so who's going to pay for this massive new 'entitlement'?
The 'rich'? No, because they already have health insurance, so they don't have to pay the fine/tax.
The 'poor'? No, because they get free health insurance from the government thru Medicaid- paid by taxpayers.
Let's see now, who's left to pay for it? Oh yes - the Middle Class. This could be the biggest tax increase in history on the Middle Class.
When they find they've been 'snookered' by Obama, I doubt that they will be very happy.
Remember how Obama said "I pledge that any families making less than $250,000 per year will not have to pay any increased taxes - not one dime"? Well guess what - the Supreme Court says Obamacare is OK because it's a TAX.
Remember this in November.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/article/1175831
Two things that I find interesting is that the media and everyone is saying this is a win for democrats, but in the supreme court decision they said that states can not be punished or funding withheld for not participating in the program. So how many states will actually participate? 25 were involved in the lawsuit, both blue and red states, because they simply can't afford the costs pushed off on them by the feds. I wonder how many implement it. On a side note, if someone is in a state that decides not to implement it, then can that person be fined because they are not insured although it is not offered in their state.
Another thing I saw in the comments is that the individual mandate is a progressive tax. This would be really dumb to think. The rich already have insurance, it is the lower middle and middle class people that have not been able to afford insurance and make just a little to much to get subsidized by the government that would pay the fine. By far, that would make this part of the tax/fine a regressive tax, although the 3% tax on people making over $250,000 would be a progressive part, but not involved in the individual mandate.
@You Enjoy Myself
If you read my post....We do take responsibility for our family. We pay for insurance for my husband and 5 children, and pay directly for all medical expenses for myself. However, if I send away $400 more dollars of our income for health insurance for me I couldn't put groceries in the kitchen. My oldest son is diabetic (has been for 21 years, he's 22 and finishing college). If I don't have sufficient food in the house he gets sick. My other 4 children like to eat also.
And yes my husband knows I call his salary "pathetic". He sits down with me every month to do the bills and it sickens him everytime. He thinks it is pathetic, that after teaching for 15 years he still can't pay all the bills at the end of the month. (Mind you we drive 5-10 year old cars, don't have cable or satelite TV, live with old used hand-me-down furniture, etc.) We don't live extravagantly or even comfortablly some times. It is a basic math problem....We have had to prioitize expenses and food for the children comes BEFORE health insurance for a reasonablly healthy mother.
I guess now we start yelling about raising teacher pay while my husband completes his maters degree. Maybe between a COLA raise and a salary schedule lane jump we might be able to afford my health insurance. NO ONE EVER CALLS ME IRRESPONSIBLE!
" in the supreme court decision they said that states can not be punished or funding withheld for not participating in the program"
That's not what the SCOTUS ruling said. It said the federal government could not force states to expand their Medicaid programs, but they still must participate in all the other parts of the law or come up with a plan that is as good or better than the federal one.
Zen Love, you're suspended for a week for violating #1 of the Code of Honor.
...
Commenting on a private website and freedom of speech have no relation. This isn't a public park.
The MA poll with the numbers of internists who don't accept MA's form of Medicaid: http://www.massmed.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Home6&TEMPLATE=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&CONTENTID=54338
YOU said: and well under than 50% of internists (a primary care doctor who deals with adults) accept Medicaid patients"
and then cite a USA Today poll that states: "17% of more than 9,000 doctors surveyed restrict the number of Medicare patients in their practice. Among primary care physicians, the rate is 31%"
Neither of those numbers = more than 50% and Medicaid is not the same thing as Medicare. Neither their funding mechanism nor their reimbursement structure are the same.
Then you say: "The proportion of Texas doctors accepting all new Medicaid patients has tumbled in the last decade — falling from 67 percent to 42 percent" which does not mean that less that only 42% accept Medicaid. Please read your own cited sources.
You say:" For a number of specialties, such as orthopedic surgery, the percentage is much lower" which has NOTHING to do with internists as you originally claimed.
And as for the claim that 64% of physicians in Michigan participated with Medicaid in 2005, that is not necessarily germane 7 years later, and it certainly is not "well under 50% of internists."
Perhaps you could explain how any of that is a "fail" other than it doesn't support your perspective.
As to the training piece and your fear that "they" will be "forcing" people into training? Yeah, they're gonna kidnap high school seniors and force them at gunpoint to go to pre-med and med school. REALLY??? C'mon.... They are working on accrediting more medical schools and helping to subsidize the very expensive education physicians must have to practice. Is it really necessary to jump to the most outlandish, ludicrous interpretation possible?
hahaha...everyone of those quotes says doctors are not accepting those patients and less are accepting them each year , spin as you see fit , but the facts won't change , and I son't see anywhere that I said "only" internists don't take them , adding further examples seems lost on you , sorry about that
Romney says...corporations are people.......Birthers should be all over this one....Protect the country from Citizens United allowing Foreigners to buy an American republican politician. ...Republicans allowing Foreigners to buy the republican candidate of their choice. Meanwhile, real Americans were dying and getting wounded In Iraq fake WMD war. Did a corporation get blown up by IED? Did a corporation get wounded, or serve 3 terms in Iraq? Did a corporation come home in a coffin?
Don't forget ever what Bush/Cheney/ reepubs did to economy and to our soldiers. Romney wants to do it all over again.
Corporations are NOT PEOPLE! Vote President Obama/Biden 2012
No duffus, your insurance just tripled and you are FORCED to buy it or pay a fine! Happy now? Oh, the naivety is frightening!!
I will be happy to pay the fine...at the worse point $695...Right now I pay over $1500 a year for insurance and have a $2500 ded...now I can quit paying that and use the ER for free...the best part is I don't even have to pay the tax...no liens or seizures of property...not subject to criminal or civil penalties under the tax code for failure to pay...I can just tell them to send the bill to congress.
What fool would write a bill like that with no penalty for refusing to comply...I love it...I save insurance money and don't have to pay the tax or ER bills.
Tony_Baloney "@ROY WILSON-336103 your supposition here is wrong. The law basically states that those with income below a certain threshold are exempted,"
I think I already said that the 'poor' get free health care through Medicaid (courtesy of the taxpayers). And the 'rich' already have insurance.
What's ironic is that the ones that will be penalized (working lower middle class incomes who can't afford insurance) will be the ones forced to buy insurance or pay the fine - the very same ones that voted overwhelmingly for Obama in 2008.
I guess some might call that 'retribution'.
"hahaha...everyone of those quotes says doctors are not accepting those patients and less are accepting them each year , spin as you see fit"
No spin involved as that wasn't your original assertion. I demonstrated that you were citing numbers from one survey from one state, and you have yet to be able to demonstrate otherwise. If your original point was only that 'fewer doctors are accepting Medicaid' then you should have said so. Even that is debatable. The percentage of doctors accepting ALL NEW MEDICAID patients may be lower, but there has been an increase in the number of doctors overall. Those numbers will continue to rise as the changes to PPACA kick in.
"What's ironic is that the ones that will be penalized (working lower middle class incomes who can't afford insurance) will be the ones forced to buy insurance or pay the fine - the very same ones that voted overwhelmingly for Obama in 2008."
No. That's incorrect, but I expect you guys will keep repeating it over and over until you all believe it. PPACA wants the states to expand Medicaid coverage to those making 133% of the poverty level or less, which for a family of 4 would be about 30K a year. See here: http://www.kff.org/healthreform/upload/medicaid-coverage-and-spending-in-health-reform-national-and-state-by-state-results-for-adults-at-or-below-133-fpl.pdf Those above that level whose employers don't offer coverage or whose employer-offered coverage is too expensive may get their insurance from the state exchanges. And there are subsidies that range between 84% of what the family pays in premiums (for families of 4 making $40K) tapering to 27% of what the family pays (for families of 4 making $93K). See here: http://healthreform.kff.org/SubsidyCalculator.aspx I think that pretty handily covers lower, lower-middle, and middle class families.
"We won, We won, We won", you short sighted leftists are Sooooo predictable. The only difference between the left and right are the suits. If their mouth is moving they are lying to you, if you believe otherwise you're an idiot.
You people honestly think a government run system is going to be better, cheaper, and more inclusive? Fools. Name ONE program the government has started that was a success, just one. The war on poverty, failure at the cost of Social security thanks to LBJ. The war on drugs, failure. Public housing, failure. HUD housing turned into drug dens and crime centers. Welfare, failure due to abuse and pandering.
If you people like standing in line at the DMV, you'll love this. If this is going to control costs, the stock market apparently feels differently. Medical stocks soared to new heights on the announcement. Not the reaction one would expect on passage of something that was going to cost them billions. One would think the stocks would tank as profitability outlooks diminish.
Oh, and the extra taxes you will get to pay because you don't have insurance. I can't wait a year or two down he road if this remains in effect. All of you "We won's" will be the one's crying the loudest how it's unfair you have to pay extra taxes to cover the uninsured. The fact is you do that already, it's called medicaid, so this is just another leftist double dip into the pocket of the people. "It is not the place of government to take food from the peoples mouths or to tax the fruits of their labors." Thomas Jefferson, Democratic-Republican. How soon they forget.
from starsailing
" Did a corporation come home in a coffin?"...hmmm
does the same tired and played diatribe apply to your liberal heros JFK and LBJ and the 63,000 soldiers and 5 million civilians that they murdered in a little place called Viet Nam ?
I would think it has to...thanks for pointing it out
"Commenting on a private website and freedom of speech have no relation. This isn't a public park."
hahaha...chortling and guffawing ensues
Woo Hoo!!!!!!!!!
I rofled
The only good thing about this is that it further solidifies the need to get this administration out of office in November so we can repeal the law.
Having a court uphold something that nobody wanted in the first place is a Pyrrhic victory at best, and in reality more detrimental than advantageous.
WOOT! Great news! Not only this, but Guild Wars 2 announced a release date of August 28th, so I'm basking in the warm glow of a wonderful day.
I was honestly concerned that insurance companies may have decided to try and recoup lost co-pays for preventive care if the whole thing was ruled unconstitutional. Fortunately, millions of Americans won on this day.
So you are cheering on the largest tax increase in modern history, and the fact Obama lied. How many times did Obama say this was not a tax, because each and every time he was lying.
Obama led on health care, and its moving forward despite the obstruction at all levels from Republicans.
The only thing that millions of Americans won today was another big ol' tax. Is that really something to celebrate??
You idiot...they just slid another tax onto you and you don't even realize it....next they will tax the damn air that we breath. Socialism here we come.....I really fear for the future generations if this socialist idiot gets another four years. Romney is not the best ..but better than the socialists running the country. Big brother is in the sky with drones....now we get taxed when the majority of people don't want it...what's next....??? Like I stated ...TAX THE AIR THAT WE BREATH.....!!!!!
Constitutionality ≠ good legislation.
To to silly conservatives who are now saying that we are a socialist society,
Get a clue! We do have certain socialist programs, like schools, fire and police departments, roads, utilities, military, etc.. If you want to show your conservative values, then lead by example. Build your own roads, don't call for the fire department when your house is burning, stay out the hospital when you are sick, and if you retire with no money so be it! Lead by example, instead of decrying the services that you take advantage of every day. And stop whining when someone you don't like is successful at implementing YOUR bright idea.
The Democrats, in preparation for the worst case, have said all along that a ruling against the mandate would be to their advantage going into the election. Obama would be the defender of the people. That advantage has now shifted to the Republicans. ObamaCare will be Obama's downfall yet.
Greatest part was the dejection of the anti-Obamacare crowd near the court after the decision. Absolutely delicious (burp).
I would rather be taxed a trillion for healthcare for AMERICANS, than 3 trillion for an Iraq War in which many innocents killed for NOTHING and Rich carpet bagging defense contractors like KBR getting billion dollar no bid contracts to supply troops with drinking water with @!$%# in it. Next question!
So why aren't they 'spiking the ball' (chuckle)
The Supreme Court just over stepped their jurisdiction. They didn't vote on the law before them, they re-wrote it. The individual mandate wasn't a tax and they changed it to be a tax to make it constitutional. That is not their job. The American people are in big trouble now. The federal government can now tell us to do anything they want to keep us on this path to socialism or they will tax us.
Did you think out and write up that excuse last night? LMAO Let the excuses fly!
Eric-913730
Why does that statement sound familar?
Since the dems were so quick to point out how this was based on a plan from Romney, can we just say this was really a victory for Romney? So Obama's biggest accomplishment is passing his oppenants idea?
Thank you Justices Roberts, Kagen, Sotomayor, Gingsberg and Breyer!!!!
This is Great News for America!
2-Lane,
You don't spike the ball when you are down one touchdown. We still have another quarter to go.
The bottom line is that this will be tweaked in congress again. Because there are some gaping loopholes all around.
.
Wait Bob 902090 ( section8 ) Tax the air is Romneys idea!
I would rather not be taxed for either of these...
pjam09 Speak for yourself. I honestly do not want Mitt in office. If we think Obama is bad. Mitt is jumping out of the frying Pan and into the fire.
For those that equate the healthcare mandate to the mandate to have car insurance - this is not a valid argument. You can choose not to drive or buy a car, thus alleviating the need for car insurance. You would have to commit suicide to get out of paying the healthcare tax.
You can already see the television ads of Obama saying over and over and over that Obamacare is not a tax. Then the big bold letters across the screen, OBAMA LIED. By a 2-1 margin people are against the mandate, and now they learn it is one of the largest tax increases in modern history. Yeah, this should really help Obama and the Democrats in November.
WOW! Good for the Justices. Finally they act as justices, not as part of the GOP.
THANKS!
Most of you people don't understand what's happening. This is actually very bad for the left. Americans by in large don't like this idea. In fact, as near as I can tell, freeloaders are the only real "winners" with this thing. Doctors don't like it because anybody that has ever dealt with the government knows it takes forever to get your money. Business owners don't like it, more expense meaning less hiring discontinue offering healthcare the works. If it would have been shot down rockstar Obama could have a do-over and have the court to blame for the reason everythings not perfect. Now the election will boil down to his performance in office which clearly makes the decision a no-brainer for everyone except the extreme left.
kemesty...Pelosi/ReidCare is full of holes to be filled with more and more expensive entitlements. It will be like Medicare very soon, having tens of TRILLIONS of dollars in unfunded liabilities.
Future generations, bend over.
I wonder when my Tea Party relatives will send out a retraction to all their hysteric email forwards with the garish colorful fonts and poor spelling now that Obamacare IS Constitutional.
common sense finally triumphs...delivered by supreme judges
Mitt has NEVER offered to show us his own certificate of Live Birth....I truly believe that he was hatched from a reptilian egg which slid out the door of a Mormon UFO.............
However Mitt did do ONE great thing !! MITT INVENTED ROMNEYCARE here in Massachusetts, and President Obama HIRED the same team which Romney used, to create Obama-Care !!!
ODD FACT : ROMNEY is a certified BISHOP in the Mormon Church.....HOW can a man serve two masters at the same time ? Wouldn't he HAVE to renounce his title and duties as a BISHOP if elected President ? Romneys church headquarters is on Brattle Street in Cambridge,Mass. close to Harvard U,. his Alma Mater.......
This decision by the SCOTUS sets an extremely dangerous precedent. How can you tax an American for simply living in our country? This so-called tax is reminiscent of the type that sparked the Boston Tea Party. What's even more disturbing is that some Americans are viewing this victory, if you call it one, at a micro-level which appears to me to be very disconcerting. This goes beyond they realm of healthcare reform.
Americans by in large don't like this idea.
Yes, we do. The GOP keeps of saying that, but MOST people are tired of the old way of "health insurance for profit"
Start crying Boehner
One tiny step toward being a civilized country that favors its citizens' well-being over endless turf wars.
As for those weeping about Big Taxes -- you get taxed only if you don't buy insurance. From those of us whose insurance rates ascend every time you shove a Twinkie in your mouths, put on another hundred pounds, suffer the consequences, and otherwise drive up the costs on the actuarial tables: tough.
Romney just wrapped up the Election in November. With a majority of Americans not wanting to absorb the largest tax in History, the Supreme Court just sealed the Fate of Obama. One and Done!
One tiny step toward being a civilized country that favors its citizens' well-being over endless turf wars.
As for those weeping about Big Taxes -- you get taxed only if you don't buy insurance. From those of us whose insurance rates ascend every time you shove a Twinkie in your mouths, put on another hundred pounds, suffer the consequences, and otherwise drive up the costs on the actuarial tables: tough.
One tiny step toward being a civilized country that favors its citizens' well-being over endless turf wars.
As for those weeping about Big Taxes -- you get taxed only if you don't buy insurance.
From those of us whose insurance rates ascend every time you shove a Twinkie in your mouths, put on another hundred pounds, suffer the consequences, and otherwise drive up the costs on the actuarial tables: tough.
AMERICANS, unfortunately are FAT STUPID & LAZY, they would rather SURRENDER their FREEDOMS to an OPPRESSIVE government!!! The GOVERNMENT is SUPPOSED to SERVE the PEOPLE, the PEOPLE are NOT supposed to SERVE the GOVERNMENT!!! I have never been more ashamed to be an american. JFK said "ask not what your country can do for you, ask instead what you can do for your country". This decision is the ultimate in selfish whining crybaby bull@!$%# I have ever had the misfortune to see or hear and on top of the DICTATORIAL attitude to AZ and the others who DEMAND an END to ILLEGAL WETBACK IMMIGRATION this is just too much and the WHOLE DAMN crowd of ILLEGIMATE BASTARDS should be IMPEACHED, STERILIZED, TARRED & FEATHERED then shot while being hung & electrocuted!!!
I'm thinking, this may NOT be good news for Obama. Most people DO NOT WANT his HCR as it stands. All the more reason, even more people will VOTE HIM OUT!
His HCR bill is a DISASTER, especially to the middle class. And if "the poor" can't afford to get out to get a voter ID..and they're free...they sure as hell can't afford his mandate, oops, TAX, for GOVERNMENT RUN healthcare no less. Come to think of it, won't we need ID to get the "care" administered?
He may be doing a "happy dance" today, but come November he can start packing up his dancing shoes, his dog and family and head back to Chicago..or Hawaii, who cares.
The Democrats will not be able to blame the court for striking down one of the worst pieces of legislation ever passed. The Democrats and Obama will not be able to hide from the fact they totally mislead the American people by claiming the individual mandate was not a tax. Now for the election season the Democrats are going to be bombarded with their words and the fact they lied to pass one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and one that will most definitely be a tax on the middle class. Yeah that should play well in November.
MSNBC Politics, since when are posts collapsed because of a single word? Can you uncollapse this post please?
How many times did we hear our President state that the individual mandate was not a tax?...LIAR, LIAR, LIAR...so much for the will of the majority of the citizens of the US...
Let's vote this LIAR out of ofc in November.
If the fine is less than the cost to actually buy Healthcare coverage. I'll pay the fine and use my savings to cover my mortgage and food for my family. If you think this will lessen the burden on the Healthcare costs then you are sorely mistaken, it may for select groups, but whatever savings that may be provide, will be quickly reclaimed by increases in our taxes. Thanks to those with narrow minds who are unable to look at our nation at a macro-level. At the end of the day, if you do pay the fine and you do get hurt, you cannot be denied health services. Congrats, you've made huge strides by support of this law. This is the beginning of ala carte healthcare. Guaranteed.
As they are considering it a "tax", you BETTER know WHO they can tax, and WHO you are!
It isn't called the INTERNAL Revenue Service for nothing.
According to the INTERNAL Revenue Code (Title 29), "Internal" is DEFINED as being within the confines of the CORPORATION of the United States and NOT the CONTINENTAL United States. (Yes, I HAVE read it.) The IRS IS Constitutional. The big problem is that they do NOT do their duty, they do their "job" to intimidate NON-Taxpayers into paying a tax they do NOT owe.
Taxpayers include:
(in the capacity that only applies to that contract)
Non-taxpayers included:
Now would be a good time for EVERYONE to LEARN the truth regarding taxation in America. "Cracking the Code" - by Peter Eric Hendrickson should be MANDATORY reading for ALL high schoolers to read. With this going through, everyone ought to pick up a copy.
NOTE: I DO NOT GET ANY FINANCIAL COMPENSATION BY PROMOTING HIS BOOK.
Ohioan First. American Second. US "citizen", NEVER! Any docs that say otherwise were created in either fraud or deception.
Disclaimer: As I am not a "tax professional/attorney/etc.", I cannot give advise and you should read the law yourself to make your own decision. No representations are otherwise being made.
No rebuttals will be given. Do your own homework.
We need a militia to SHOOT TO KILL THE ILLEGALS THAT COME INTO OUR COUNTRY TO STEAL JOBS THAT MAKE SO THAT AMERICAN'S CANNOT WORK AND PAY FOR FORCED HEALTH INSURANCE. Thank Obuma and the unsupreme court for again screwing america. Canada is starting to look good!!!!!!
FINALLY...albeit a PAINFUL start, but PRESIDENT OBAMA did what every other president tried to do!
And never succeeded.
We are on the way to doing what is right for American citizens.
FINALLY...albeit a PAINFUL start, but PRESIDENT OBAMA did what every other president tried to do!
And never succeeded.
We are on the way to doing what is right for American citizens.
This rolls the political scenario to 2010 which was the initial backlash against this law.
Stop whinning!!!! The majority of the justices were elected by Republican Presidents. You FINALLY CAN'T BLAME Obama on his one.
Hey maybe they'll cover brain transplants for all the idiots in this country. Like all the ones who didn't actually read this 2,000 page unconstitutional nightmare and supported based souly on being told what they wanted to hear! Maybe they'll right in to cover a cure for stupid cause I'm getting tired of having to pay for the mistakes of every moron in this country. That's okay though I'll be the one who get's to laugh when all those same people are shocked and start bitching about what their "health care" entails and see how much they really like getting what they "wanted".
Let's put to rest the presumptions of how many disapprove of this law...Let's take a headcount on this board...Respond if you DISAPPROVE of the SCOTUS Decision...I'll start..I DISAPPROVE!
Let's put to rest the presumptions of how many disapprove of this law...Let's take a headcount on this board...Respond if you DISAPPROVE of the SCOTUS Decision...I'll start..I DISAPPROVE!
@B.Chester
You just made me ashamed of being American.
Thank you for your asinine comment, I think you may have actually made everyone reading these comments a little dumber today. Good job, now go off and continue to fight for a higher fence.
@B.Chester
You just made me ashamed of being American.
Thank you for your asinine comment, I think you may have actually made everyone reading these comments a little dumber today. Good job, now go off and continue to fight for a higher fence.
Well, it looks like the Cry-hards will just have to write-in Sarah Palin, cuz Romney won't change a thing.
Other than the Amish, nobody lives a more Social life style than Mormons, their mentors mentors have mentors who mentor every step of your life.
ctdad, your previous comment is spot on. Most don't realize how deep this decision will effect the future of our country. The only people who actually won today are people who genuinely want tear away the fabric of which our country was made. In the future when constitutionalist and historians can make a disconnected unbiased assessment of this day, it will be considered one of the worst decisions in our nations history.
"The Supreme Court just over stepped their jurisdiction. They didn't vote on the law before them, they re-wrote it. The individual mandate wasn't a tax and they changed it to be a tax to make it constitutional. That is not their job. The American people are in big trouble now. The federal government can now tell us to do anything they want to keep us on this path to socialism or they will tax us."
From the decision: 3. CHIEF JUSTICE ROBERTS concluded in Part III–B that the individual mandate must be construed as imposing a tax on those who do not have health insurance, if such a construction is reasonable.
The most straightforward reading of the individual mandate is thatit commands individuals to purchase insurance. But, for the reasons explained, the Commerce Clause does not give Congress that power.It is therefore necessary to turn to the Government’s alternative argument: that the mandate may be upheld as within Congress’s power to “lay and collect Taxes.”
How many of you saying what you're saying have read this thing? They most certainly did declare the individual mandate unconstitutional but decided to call it a tax instead, which is the only way they could find to make it constitutional. The mandate was never called a tax until the trial, even Obama said it wasn't. It's shocking when I can call a dog an aquatic animal all day long, but that interpretation doesn't make it a fish. This is a little disturbing.
As for you people that are against Obama Care think about this you paying very high rates for insurance. $80-$90 a week for people with families. The tax % more is going to be less. Personally I got tired of being ripped off every week by them. There are only 2-3 co on each state and the States don't allow Companies from one to make any offer in the next state. therefore denying compatition for people to have same coverage with lower rates. good deal!
When health Care is looked at in one lump people say ok. But when it is looked at provision by provision they start say aaaaaaaaaaah. and aaaaah.
Horsepucky.
TiredofStupidity,
# 3 just shows the stupidity and and how out of touch the typical liberal is. Social Security is the quintessential example of why this ruling is so bad. It forces you to contribute to fund that for most of your life, only to get get a fraction back in return. SS as bad as it is, was not designed to be a give away program, but thanks to like-minded liberal it has become one with programs like SSI. I would be very careful about telling Americans who have paid SS for 50 years to return the check because its a social program.
Remember Madoff is in jail for doing exactly what the federal government is doing. SS is nothing more than a government ponzi scheme, and the only ones receiving any real benefit from it are those collecting checks who have never paid into the system. Now we want to do the same with our healthcare.
Well, and how many people will this put out of business? how many jobs will be lost? how much inflation will this cause? do you see a endless spiral of complications lurking around the corner? now you will be forced to buy what you cant afford isn't that nice, it will ease the burden of government and put it right on the public, the government will have lots of money to piss away now, some people think they won something but all you will get is a tax that is double what you pay now, of course we can shut down the VA hospitals because they wont be necessary, the health clinics they wont be necessary, all the currently funded free medical programs that are supported by the Government they wont be needed, yep the government won a big dollar victory today and you will pay for it for the rest of your lives. this is all about the government getting taxes and some industries getting rich. what you will get is substandard health care, long waits at your health care provider. health care on the assembly line. and double your taxes why don't you all just buy your insurance outright now it will cost even more because this monster will want to eat. you didn't win anything. wait and see! now whats next involuntary euthanasia? its Pandora's box. move over Greece make room in the poor house for us Americans. on the bright side this will put the bars out of business and cut the fortunes of those Hollywood tycoons and dozens of other frivolous expenses people pay for, it will cut back on people traveling and adding to the pollution, yes everyone will have to tighten their belts by about two to three hundred dollars a month per person to pay for this affordable health care and that will have a direct effect on the economy, small business will suffer and the downtrend will effect everyone. your income will be cut in half. mine wont be different but yours will if you are one of those that didn't have insurance, because now you will be forced to pay for it and you call that a victory, no more stopping for a beer after work, no more movies, cancel that cell phone and cable TV, vacation at home, because you will be paying for insurance that will be paying for someone Elsa's birth control and liposuction. I guess my lifestyle will change after all because I will get caught in the wild inflation that this is going to cause and the repercussion's that will follow, but Uncle Sam is going to have allot of fun spending all your money, on what ever he wants just tap into it and spend spend spend, till its all gone.
Well, and how many people will this put out of business? how many jobs will be lost? how much inflation will this cause? do you see a endless spiral of complications lurking around the corner? now you will be forced to buy what you cant afford isn't that nice, it will ease the burden of government and put it right on the public, the government will have lots of money to piss away now, some people think they won something but all you will get is a tax that is double what you pay now, of course we can shut down the VA hospitals because they wont be necessary, the health clinics they wont be necessary, all the currently funded free medical programs that are supported by the Government they wont be needed, yep the government won a big dollar victory today and you will pay for it for the rest of your lives. this is all about the government getting taxes and some industries getting rich. what you will get is substandard health care, long waits at your health care provider. health care on the assembly line. and double your taxes why don't you all just buy your insurance outright now it will cost even more because this monster will want to eat. you didn't win anything. wait and see! now whats next involuntary euthanasia? its Pandora's box. move over Greece make room in the poor house for us Americans. on the bright side this will put the bars out of business and cut the fortunes of those Hollywood tycoons and dozens of other frivolous expenses people pay for, it will cut back on people traveling and adding to the pollution, yes everyone will have to tighten their belts by about two to three hundred dollars a month per person to pay for this affordable health care and that will have a direct effect on the economy, small business will suffer and the downtrend will effect everyone. your income will be cut in half. mine wont be different but yours will if you are one of those that didn't have insurance, because now you will be forced to pay for it and you call that a victory, no more stopping for a beer after work, no more movies, cancel that cell phone and cable TV, vacation at home, because you will be paying for insurance that will be paying for someone Elsa's birth control and liposuction. I guess my lifestyle will change after all because I will get caught in the wild inflation that this is going to cause and the repercussion's that will follow, but Uncle Sam is going to have allot of fun spending all your money, on what ever he wants just tap into it and spend spend spend, till its all gone.
Dead on (no pun intended?) Modern day. This is one more program the gov't will control and will be yet another example of how inept they are at it. Hmm - let's see Social Security, Medicaid,Care, USPS. This will be the biggest program yet to fail miserably. How stupid do you have to be to believe in this; given the gov'ts track record on fiscal irresponsibility. You can take it to the bank - if you've got anything left to take.
Chris,
To to silly conservatives who are now saying that we are a socialist society,
What you don't realize is that the only ones that don't pay for these items is those of you that are sucking our system dry by being on welfare for LIFE. CHILD AFTER CHILD when does it stop. So I can tell you that much.
Do you know what's more entertaining than watching a bully slink off after he gets his butt kicked. It's when he dances in the street claiming he won as he bleeds from every orifice. Just another ploy from the Rove handbook. Pitiful.
Most people are NOT against affordable national healthcare;
Some bought into the Republican fear-mongering lie that national healthcare will lead us to become a "socialist" nation.
Some actually believe that the free market will correct all of the problems with healthcare. Despite the fact that 30 years of the free market experience saw snowballing rates consume over 20% of our economy and force 1/3 of our citizens out of the system.
Some are unhappy that the bill does not include a single-payer system.
Many of us realize that the Democrats had a very short window of opportunity to join the rest of the free world in caring for it's own citizens. They were forced to include provisions from Republicans that would weaken the bill to gain Republican support. The Republicans then simply walked away as they ignored their promises to support the bill with these provisions. This is a done deal now. There is plenty of time to refine the bill into what it should been in the first place.
The Republicans picked the wrong fight. Their own candidate instituted a remarkably similar bill as Governor. Enough of the benefits are pouring in today to demonstrate the bill's effectiveness to millions of Americans. If the bill had been struck down by the U.S.S.C., those millions of people would kick the Republicans in the teeth on election day. The fact that the bill was upheld is a great victory for the President and his party despite the ridiculous spin from some Republicans.
Well, looks like the working class got the shaft again. Those companies that can opt out will, probably won't offer an increase in pay for not having the benefit since they'll be paying the penalty (which will be less than offering insurance) and the workers will have to buy their health insurance using AFTER tax dollars.
What does this mean, another bill that alot of working people didn't have.
This isn't free health insurance.
Amen Brother Buck.
probusiness wrote
Unemployment would reach 15%.
I agree, but it will be closer to European unemployment, even higher numbers.
This decision made today will not help anyone, but hurt everyone in the long run. Just another dumb liberal fix to a dumb liberal mandate from prior dumb liberals who merely want to feel good about themselves.
Wow....the Republican PR agencies are out in full force with this one...lol
Love these fake a$$ screen names with tons of numbers in them.
What do ya'll make....about $8.50 an hour??
:)
Even if they were making $8.50 an hour, at least they are working.
Bob-902090, you're suspended for a day for violating #1 of the Code of Honor.
Does this mean that you don't have to be an "elite" in the U.S. to afford
healthcare?
When elites are held in check, typically by effective legal mechanisms, everyone else in society does much better and sustained economic growth becomes possible. But powerful people - kings, barons, industrialists, bankers - work long and hard to relax the constraints on their actions. And when they succeed, the effects are not just redistribution toward themselves but also an undermining of economic growth and often a tearing at the fabric of society.
Please sign the petition to the U.S. Senate Banking and House Financial Services Committee asking for improved oversight of federal banking and market regulators that have proven ineffective at not only detecting inappropriate behavior, but also preventing such behavior that has crippled our economy.
To read more about what we’re trying to do and to sign the petition, click here:
http://www.change.org/petitions/u-s-senate-banking-and-u-s-house-financial-services-committees-use-technology-to-provide-oversight-of-u-s-banking-and-market-regulators?share_id=HTpDoOQNJgpe=d2e
It'll just take a minute!
Romney says he can find some common ground.....meaning ...he will hire some more illegals for cleaning, mowing and taking care of the grounds around each home he own...!
Common ground indeed. That's is funny, he has no plan other than supporting the Ryan Plan and his statement "corprations are people." So what have we learned from Romney? He wants to destroy Social Security, Medicare, and replace the Post Office all with his rich friends corporations so they can make a bigger profit after they raise prices on everything and give worse service or none. Ryan plan gives Romney over $700,000 tax break while you get a 20% hike and pay the taxes the rich would have been paying but won't. Cuts to food stamps and programs for the midlle class while paying for the 1% tax breaks. Why does he not have a plan for jobs? Because he is a job killer and his past work shows it. Repubs need to be investigated for trying to kill the economy so they can regain the whitehouse. Take the economy down...Just like Bin Laden wrote as his master plan. Take the economy down.
This is flat out stupid. Why would you tax people because they DON'T want your healthcare? Let people choose for themselves. I know this will probably get down voted into oblivion because of all the people on here that can't stand other peoples opinions, but that just has to be stated. It's foolish to stand here and say "We will give everyone healthcare, but if you don't want to join our club we will charge you an annual fee!" It's like a gas station saying "You have to buy gas from us and if you don't we'll charge you a thousand dollars." Sorry, but that is just flat out stupid.
The point that I'm trying to make is that if people have healthcare through a job that is better than Obamacare, then why should they get taxed for not switching to Obamacare?
Hopefully this will put every private health care company in this country out of business! Yes those people will lose their jobs but just think of how many government jobs it will create that pay a LIVING WAGE instead of the peanuts this private companies pay their workers while raking billions in profits every year! Might be a good idea to dump all those stock shares you might have in these companies and buy stock in the auto industry (No not the ones like Honda who pay peanuts for wages) like GM,Ford,Chrysler etc. You know, the ones making record profits while still paying UNION wages!
Blake...because when they show up to the emergency room and dont pay for it...you do!!
Get it?
I don't necessarily have a problem with SCOTUS decision as most might have. I just wish that 1. Obama's buddies who received EXEMPTIONS from the law should have to join in with all of us...No exceptions for anyone, and 2. We the American citizens should not be required to provide free health care for anyone willing to illegally immigrate to this country.
Let's face it. Healthcare as we currently know it is broken. Anyone who looks at their healthcare costs and how they rise every year should understand that something needs to change. Some parts of what is in the plan are good.
A fine is now called a Tax? This is a very puzzling decision. I image most , if not all private sectors companies will now drop health insurance from their benefit package to their employees.
Unconstitutional ‘Laws’ are in fact, NOT Laws at all!
“The general rule is that an unconstitutional statute, though having the form and name of law, is in reality no law, but is wholly void, and ineffective for any purpose; since unconstitutionality dates from the time of it’s enactment, and not merely from the date of the decision so branding it… No one is bound to obey an unconstitutional law, and no courts are bound to enforce it.”
— 16 Am. Jur. Sec. 177 late 2d, Sec 256
Even if it has been deemed constitutional by the SCOTUS.
Anyone remember Prohibition?
****************************************************************
Time to show the pompous Sonsabitches that "think" they're in charge that We The People are still the boss.
ToxicChemist:
Please list them. Your rates just went up for the same policy.
Mad_Dog:
This just increased their revenues. The ACA is NOT federal government provided coverage. It is health care insurance from the private sector. Now that you are required by law to have coverage.
Perhaps you need to read the 2,700 pages of the ACA.
Let me start by stating that I am 70 years old, and a disabled combat veteran. Now, I realize that this may be collapsed, but I still have to say it. Will I have to appear before the panels that decide whether I may receive health care? Will my doctors (if they can affored to keep me as a patient) be allowed to give me curative treatment, to actually cure what at that time ails me? Or will they be allowed only to keep me comfortable while I am forced to die from something cureable?
For all the people that think this law is wrong, stop complaining about people without health insurance going to hospital's emergency rooms for their healthcare and making everybody with health insurance pay for them.
Republicans don't like this law, not because it taxes people that refuse to get health insurance, republicans hate this law because with it, mega-rich insurance companies must cover everybody and they cannot drop people with serious and very costly medical condititions. Republicans don't give a damn about our health, they are only concerned with making the rich, richer, and for all you die-hard republican voters that believe the things republicans tell you, you are just as nutty as republicans say you are.
Die-hard republican women voting for republicans that has declared war on women's health and equal pay, republican voters who's sole income, comes from SSI, Disability, Social Security etc. voting for republicans that have said they will vote to end these unneeded programs. If these die -hard republican voters are not just plain nuts, then somebody please explain to me what a nutty voter is.
topane725:
You need to read the ACA. If you do, you will realize that what you just posted is not true. Any insurance carrier can cancel your policy for lack of payment. The companies may charge whatever rates they care to. ACA does not control costs. Please go read the ACA .
The ACA law just handed more customers to the health insurance companies you seem to hate and allows them to increase their rates.
The Republicans do NOT like it because it was rushed through witout memebers of Congress knowing what was in it, does not improve care, and does not help the sitution.
CLUE -
We've always had a socialist health care program.
Go to any public hospital when you are sick or hurt. They cannot refuse your care.
Failure to pay your medical bill at a public hospital cannot go on your credit report.
The only problem with the existing health care system is QUALITY of care.
How do I know this? I've done it quite a few times myself because I had no other option but to die without surgery.
No one dies in the USA without medical care if they WANT it and do what they are told. Period.
Just goes to show how completely uneducated and ignorant most spoiled brat Americans really are. It's sad when indigent people and those in poverty know more about our country than you spoon fed yuppies.
This is a GOOD day for President Obama.
Hopefully, Romney does not win the November Election. If that should happen, it could be appealed, just like The Prohibition Act in Dec. 5, 1933. The Prohibition Act lasted 13 years.
It will be hard to undo the new Health Care. The next Congress is key to what happens.
Congratulations President Obama!!! What a great fete for the American people.
Thinkstraight: " Canada is starting to look good!!!!!!"
You're RIGHT! They have UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE!
Mitt Romney is a sure thing this November! YEAH!
Justice Kennedy summarized the dissent in court. "In our view, the act before us is invalid in its entirety," he said.
The dissenters said in a joint statement that the law "exceeds federal power both in mandating the purchase of health insurance and in denying non-consenting states all Medicaid funding."
its NOT A TAX!! its a penalty as written in the ACA, so the supreme court made an illegal ruling based on lies. where in the ACA does it say TAX? and how is mandating a service now called taxing?
over my dead body will i allow a government to force me to purchase anything and i have the DoI and the US constitution in my hands that gives me that option. i will never allow myself to be ruled over like most people would like to be.
id like to see how forcing people into contracts will work out, i guarantee ACA will fail as it goes against everything that freedom stands for, how can you consider yourself free if the government tell you how to live your life.
Chief Justice John Roberts switched his vote at a late stage. If so, it would appear that the Chief Justice may have succumbed to the bullying meted out by President Barack Obama.
Did Justice Roberts Give in to Bullying?
Yes!
Can't wait until the Liberals start recovering from the hangovers from tonights "victory" celebration and realize they really didn't get squat from this "dramatic victory" for President Obama and his bill.
If you want the definition of spin...read the above headline again...read a few comments like "We have free health care!" Then read the official Supreme Court ruling in detail on PDF. This headline+Liberal reaction=spin defined.
Wow, the neo-fascist tweakers sure are cranked.
Just few points: The GOPiggy is the party of mass murder. Studies show 20-45,00 people are dying every year for lack of health care - not due to calamitous injury or illness, but simply because they can't afford the regular care necessary to maintain health. When you read the tweakers' posts here, you have to conclude that the GOPiggies won't be happy till the numbers are ten times higher.
Cost: we have the money; there's plenty of money in the country. It seems scarce because the neo-fascists have allowed it to accumulate in the wrong hands.
OMG they're going to tax us!!!! The whole thing should be funded through taxes. If you pay 3500-7500 in taxes per year to fund your health care, in what way are you worse off than paying 5500-13500 a year to a health insurance company?
But, you counter, I don't pay if I don't want health insurance. But then if you get sick or get hurt, I pay. Let me be a GOPiggy for a moment: I don't want to pay inflated premiums to my health insurance company so they can pay inflated hospital costs to cover your emergency room visit. So, if you don't buy health insurance would you be willing to sign a waver of care, so the EMTs can let you die in the street?
What the solution should be: single payer, universal coverage, the whole thing to be administered by an entity grown from the Cleveland Clinic, which provides better outcomes at lower cost than the rest of the "two boats at my waterfront vacation home" vampires. Then maybe the level of our expense and the quality of our care would rival that of other 21st century nation.
@Roy Wilson.....you posted:
"So it will be enforced through the IRS when people file tax returns, so the illegal immigrants that get paid under the table and don't file tax returns will still get free medical care at hospital emergency rooms, courtesy of the taxpayers"
BINGO!......Father, check his card...
Actually, I would argue FOR, not against, tax increases. I even say let the Bush tax cuts expire for EVERYONE. I don't care about the tax increases; I want to talk about the reforms and the effects.
Actually, this is both legal and ethical. People have been using taxes (which this fee is essentially, I'll admit it) or penalties to influence behavior for years. Don't like it??? Don't accept the deduction that you get for owning a home or having children, etc. Not to mention that unless we are to expand access to healthcare while controlling costs, everyone needs to be apart of the insurance market.
Not really. You don't necessarily need gas to survive (at least not in the sense that you will die without it; you could grow your own food and live in a simple home), and the gas market doesn't need everyone to be part of the market for it to function properly. Healthcare (and health insurance in particular) is different. Unless everyone is in the system, reducing discrimination is virtually impossible.
And to anyone who says that the poor people who cannot afford insurance will be forced to get it or pay a fine, there is an exemption for people who cannot afford healthcare from the individual mandate.
OBAMA BIDEN 2012
we know you are for rasing taxes , you don't work or pay taxes , I do hope you have kids though because you AND you kids will be working till you die to pay for all the unecessary trips to the medic that I am going to take , you see I am retiring soon and I don't have any children so I don't give a rats how much YOU have to pay out in taxes for MY free health care , I intend to game the libby free mentality for the rest of my life and if you go down in the process it won't cause the slightest ripple...thanks for your support
You know, I'm in my 50's so I expect to go in 20 years or sooner, after today you younger people that are jumping up and down thinking you won some great prize will see the gravity of your mistake. Hell, you just cut your life span by 20 years and aren't smart enough to realize it. Crack cocaine is a very powerful drug is what you will be telling your grand-children. Good Luck explaining this to your kids and grand-kids. Oh wait, you'll brame this on Bush too.
Common,
Maybe you don't understand the difference between State and Federal. The state as it own republic of a Nation it has a right to impose those types of thing and if you don't like it you move to a state more in line with your thinking. For the Federal Government should of never been given this rights. As it strips me of my Constitutional rights. Just another thing the A88 in the big propeller hat keeps screwing-up or I mean his handler.
That is only because I cannot work, via my age (go ahead and call me a young idiot; I think I can handle it). I do plan to work; I'm not the "free-riding" liberal that you think I am.
I don't see how this is unconstitutional. Under the tax provision, it is perfectly legal. The Federal Government is larger than the states, and so it is my opinion that it ought to be a bit more powerful than the states. The 10th amendment, in my opinion, has been taken completely out of context by the conservatives. They think that the government can only do what is stated in the Constitution; everything else should be left to the states. That is not practical. For one thing, states are too small and too fiscally volatile to handle the things that conservatives want them to handle. For another, allowing states to adopt certain measures, like healthcare reform, will created a country that is completely out of balance. And finally, the Constitution is 230+ years old. For God's sake, it was written by people who knew nothing about terrorism, derivatives markets, big banks, and environmental problems, to name a few. Of course we need to expand the scope of government at certain intervals, lest our nation become disadvantaged due to our government being too small. And yes, that is a possibility.
OBAMA BIDEN 2012
I'm not sure what everyone is so upset about...you still do not have to buy insurance and still do not have to pay the tax...it states that plain as day in the article///no penalties/liens/seizures of property or criminal or civil penalties for failure to pay the tax...so whats the big deal...just ignore it.
IRESPOND;
Failed American Government class in school, didn't you? Supreme Court Justices are not elected, they are appointed to the bench, for life. Tell me the last time YOU voted for a supreme court justice. Even state Supreme court judges are appointed by the governor. So, I'm guessing you NEVER voted for any Supreme Court Justice. Elected Supreme Court Justices,, that's novel and by Republicans no less. How do explain the presence of Ginsburg being on the bench?
Do you see the boogie man under the bed at night? Do you see Republicans as being the all inclusive wrong in the country? Do you honestly believe these things? If so, perhaps you should consult a mental health professional. It's called Paranoid/Schizophrenia. It's treatable,, if you don't let it go too long. You aren't alone, however, it seems a condition that grips many on the left these days. And as with all ill people, they will never admit having a problem.
Well, what I know is this.
The United States Government has seen the last dime it will ever see or receive from me. Ever.
I had already stopped paying personal Income Taxes a few years ago, but up to now I have been paying all of my Business Taxes. That is now over with.
I love my Country, but things have simply gotten ridiculous. I am 110% against the direction this Nation has taken and I will not support it. And this did not start with with the current clown in the Oval Office. If I had to guessimate, I'd say it really started under Nixon and the beginning of that Historic failure we know as "The War On Drugs".
All you Righties can blame Obama all you want, but this goes back much farther than him. In the grand scheme of things, he is nothing more than a Pawn for the real powers that be. A scapegoat, somebody for the average Joe to point their fingers at and blame.
All I know is, I will not support it. I am not responsible for other peoples lives or welfare and I will not be forced to. Both the Government and everybody who believes in these types of Laws or Legislation can simply.....well, you already know.
And I will fight for my beliefs by every means necessary.....
So, Screaming, what you're saying is that you want to enjoy the benefits that come from taxation (roads and infrastructure, fire protection, clean water, etc.) but you don't want to contribute because of your warped and incoherent personal views?
Good. Prison is the just the place for self-absorbed snivelers like you. Better yet, emigrate to a country that shares your hateful, selfish political ideology. Australia? No, they have universal health care. Germany? No, Hitler died a long time ago. England, France, or Sweden? No, they are socialist states in the insane fantasies of people like you. Iran? Looks like a fit! See ya!
"I am not responsible for other peoples lives or welfare and I will not be forced to."
Then go live out in the wilderness in a plastic bubble. In modern society we are interdependent. If you pay property taxes that support local schools, it's because we all have an interest in having an educated society. Having access to healthcare means that today's children and families may be stronger and healthier tomorrow, meaning more productive. We should ALL be invested in that.
SAILCAT:
Whatever. Just because you say something doesn't make it so. And yeah, I guess I will take advantage of all those things. Why not? It's no different than you having Health care at the expense of Johnny B. Public.
Whats the difference?
You people kill me. Where the @!$%# do you come up with your ridiculous sense of entitlement? I mean, get real. You can have anything you want, but it will not be at my expense. And you can call me whatever you want. Like I care about what you think about me.
I know this. Depend on me to feed you, house you or give you Health Care, you will be one @!$%#ed up individual.....
Screaming, you are the poster child for the Republican Party: selfish, hateful, bigoted, intolerant, and delusional. No wonder the GOP is crashing and burning.
I did not realize the Republican party had a monopoly on that. Thanks Sailcat ,i feel so Enlighten.;-)
SAILCAT:
You are laughable, since you clearly know nothing about me whats-so-ever.
I am not a Republican.
I am not a Democrat.
I think both Parties -and most of their members- are a joke. Their cattle in a herd. Sheep. Baaaaaaa!
In fact, the only difference between the Left and the Right is who gets @!$%#ed and how.
Selfish? Yep.
Hateful? Na, I just dont have any use for certain types of people. And by that, I mean people who have this delusional sense of self-entitlement. You know, the people who want everything at the expense of others.
Bigot? No more so than you.
Intolerant? Dead on. I have no tolerance for people who agree other people should support them. So you got me there!
Delusional? Not even a little bit. I'm not the one who thinks or believes that it's okay for other people to pay my way. Thats delusional.
In the end, enjoy your victory that isn't. I know you wont get health care, food or housing at my expense anymore. Leave it to me and you'll be @!$%#ed up for sure. I could care less about you or anybody else like you.
What I know is, I do not work 80 hour weeks so other people can enjoy the benefits. It will not happen here. Not now and not ever. And God help anybody who tries to take what is mine.
I do not have much, but what I do have is mine. I worked my ass off to get it and I work my ass off to keep it. I'll be damned if I let a bunch of..whatever..to reap any benefits from my sweat. Those days are over with.
Period.
You may not be a Republican nor a Democrat but you're 100% loser, trust me.
Awww geeee...coming from the likes of you, that sure hurts my feelings!
Wait! I'm hurting! I will go to the Doctor and get some help on your dime! I've got Obummercare!
Woo Hoo!
Rotflmao!
You people are so predictable and....easy.
I rest my case.
Don't let the door hit you in the.....
from Freshie - quite the laff
"That is only because I cannot work, via my age (go ahead and call me a young idiot; I think I can handle it). I do plan to work; I'm not the "free-riding" liberal that you think I am."
"via" ? try school..."I plan to work" hahahaha , I started working around age 13 at anything that would pay me , car washing , lawn mowing , my uncles demolition company , then at 16 at the grocery store , etc etc etc...so I guess I will call you young , and lazy , as you have no skin in the game you ARE a free rider and Nancy Stuplousey was talking about you.
so get off of your mom's Compaq and get a job so you can pay for my free stuff , and the sooner the better thank you very much
"Blake...because when they show up to the emergency room and dont pay for it...you do!!"
he is still going to pay for it , this scam doesn't change that , have you had you mom read you the whole bill or just the Chris Matthews talking points? ... oh the "fake azz" names with the numbers? , far better than your choice of American Bonehead
we are done as a society
Greece...here we come.
I am moving to Canada, oh wait, too late.
I agree and don't expect business to hire either. Hopefully Obama is done too.
The deadbeats are cheering.
Next step, repeal this garbage ! Today's announcement will likely lead to an Obama defeat in November !!
Most U.S. citizens are against this government takeover.
Your tears taste like Christmas.
Conservative policies are identical to those now playing out in ireland. Read something other than Murdoch/Fox News reports. Those policies are leading to the total destruction of that economy. Republicans/Tea Bigots are foolish and wrong.
at least in Canada, you will have health care...........that you are NOT paying an arm and leg for......which is going to be exactly what we will be doing! Paying insurance costs that will be crazy expensive!
Yeah, that's what they said about rock & roll in the 1950's ... which is where you morons wanted to take us.
Deadbeats are cheering, Mark Taft? I'm cheering, and I make 6 figures.
Not everyone is blind to the suffering of others.
I'm moving to Canada to get away from the USA's SOCIALIST MEDICINE!!!
Mark Taft, I hope you get a rare cancer that your insurance doesn't cover.
Take a deep breath guys. The world isn't going to come to an end just because SCOTUS agrees that ALL Americans are entitled to healthcare and ALL must pay for it. If you will remove your Republican sunglasses for just a moment you will see how this is exactly the way it should be. And by the way Canada, like all other Western countries, has universal healthcare coverage that is much more socialistic than ours.
This is a sad day. This may very well energize the left and put obama back into office for another four years! A sad day for Americans.
Poor people wanting heath care makes them deadbeats? Where is your compassion? Sickening that people don't know the facts. Fox news lies, and weak minded people follow.
you can go their your not needed here
For those who cheer in support of this horrid sausage of a 3000 page plan...most could not fill three written pages with things that are actually in it. The dust up with the Catholic Church came out of nowhere...then it is learned that there will be a tax imposed on any implanted device such as artificial knees, hips, teeth, etc. That tax will be passed along like all taxes are.
Mr. Obama's naivite...or ignorance...or, he lied...was evident after the flap with the Catholic Church. As to the co-pays for contraception that the Church does not want to be forced to pay...the President came out and said that the insurance companies were going to "step up" and take care of that issue.
"Step Up" ??? Was the President trying to say that the insurance companies were going to pay those co-pays out of their own pockets ??? Not going to happen, as anyone with grey matter in their heads surely realize. Any cost or tax imposed by government gets passed along to someone else for payment. Insurance rates will be raised to cover those costs.
But it fits right in with the supposed "war on women"...which I guess means that if a woman wants to have sex and has to pay a $10 or $20 co-pay for her own use of contraception each month...that's a war !
Wow !!!
Well said, Eevie!!
Gaithersburger
the fact of the matter is that this is now going to slow the outrageous rate hikes the insurance companies have been loading on the shoulders of small businesses. Over the last 10 years health insurance premiums have jumped 100%, that is the fact, the other fact is most republicans have never really understood, or read the bill.
This is a great day for the 3 million children covered now by the health care law, and for all of those that will be covered in 2014.
The US may finally move up from 37th in the world in terms of health care.
nonsense JamesInSeattle - as a politically independent physician who has read a substantial portion of the health care bill, this is a good decision - I doubt you and a substantial number of critics have done so - and I'm doubtful that you have the knowledge of the medical system to make an informed decision re this important step forward
this is not a perfect bill and I don't agree with everything in it but let's not throw out the baby with the bath water - there are numerous pilot programs in the study which are critical in determining how to move forward towards a less expensive, higher quality system - from a macroeconomic our current system is a serious detriment to our globabl competitiveness -
states require motorists to have auto insurance - what's the problem with requiring healthcare insurance???? AC Sands MD
Chief Justice Roberts said its reasonable to expect that some faced with the choice of buying Health Insurance, or paying a fine , will choose to but Health Insurance.
Well Mr Chief Justice, what about the person thats only employed part time, and cant AFFORD to buy insurance, or pay a fine for not doing it? What do you say to THAT American? Do you Care, or do you say, "ive got a government job and this law doesnt apply to ME so who cares?" I'm surprised you didnt end your decision by saying "Let them eat Cake"
judicial restraint is defined as 'submission to the popular will as expressed by laws made by people's representatives - a majority of Congress'
That's one of reasons conservative judges joined the majority in upholding law by congress
MSNBC Politics, since when are posts collapsed because of a single word? Can you uncollapse this post please?
There are many irresponsible uninsured people who COULD afford to pay for health insurance, but opt to roll the dice. Not a priority. They'd rather use their money for big screen TV's, 4-wheelers, other adult toys, bling, booze...whatever. I'm sure there are plenty in the count of uninsured who COULD be insured, easily.
Eric,
the US may move up from 37th (in terms of healthcare COVERGE), but our healthcare system is tops.
I am the administrator for a large physician/ surgical group in the Houston medical center, and we see people from all over the world. On a daily basis we hear patients complaining about the healthcare in their countries. Socialist medicine is not the answer. I pray your family is a health one. There is a reason that more people die from "natural causes" in places like England. It is because cancers and other treatable/ preventable disease is usually detected upon autopsy. When your wait to be referred out to a specialist is six months to a year, and unknown to you, there is a large tumor growing...well...you might reconsider your view on healthcare.
The working class will continue to bear the burdon of paying for "entitlment healthcare" of the able people who refuse to work. We will see how it all pans out. Unfortunatly, then it will already be to late to turn back.
@ConcernedByStupidity:
"The working class will continue to bear the burdon of paying for "entitlment healthcare" of the able people who refuse to work"
We do so today anyways, so your point is? At least with this new law, people without insurance will be forced to chip in or buy in. Chip in, if they decide not to sign up, or buy in if they decide to be insured.
Now, whether people choose to go to the doctor or not, is still their own damn right, which is what happens in EVERYWHERE in the world where there is a healthcare system in place, public or private.
@Gathersburger
"All Americans are entitled to healthcare"? It is so comical that this is the mantra of proponents of the Law. It should be reworded to say, "All Americans are entitled to healthcare even if someone else has to pay for it". Why not just say it for what it is.
When does the liberal concept of a person is entitled to the assets of others. Obviously it doesn't stop with healthcare, it doesn't even stop with cell phones.
What if I, against your will, took part of your lawn? I won't take much just enough to place my trash. What aboutyou car, how about I come over in the middle of the night and take your car? Maybe I need it to take my son to the hospital, you would deny me the ability to get my son to healthcare? Sounds absurd? About as much as taking the fruit of my labor for anything I don't get any benefit without my consent.
According to the mandate if someone doesn't have insurance and doesn't get insurance they will be fined. There is no statute for forcing them to pay the fine however, so this can go on for year after year.
Ultimately, WHY would anyone who already doesn't have insurance and doesn't want to pay for it suddenly opt to buy it now? I am willing to bet at least half of the 15mil odd who don't have it because they don't want it will STILL not have it when this goes through.
Our Illustrious leader told us that those 15odd million are the healthy young who will be helping to pay for the uninsured who because of their health can't get affordable insurance.
But guess what? If those 15mil Healthy American decide not to buy into this new plan, we, the taxpayer WILL be paying for it.
THIS IS NOT A TAX. Yeah right.
If you believed that one, I have a bridge to sell you.
Cheesehead-1110193, don't troll. You're suspended for a day for violating #5 of the Code of Honor.
Steve L.-2369556 banned, ending a bad history.
Don't cancer-wish fellow commenters, folks.
Okay, I admit it: I get a real kick out of seeing Boehner and the rest of the GOP big shots squirm. Does that make me a bad person? :-)
One bit of good news is Mitt Romney is now a lock for becoming the 45th president and the Senate will be won by the Republican Party in November 2012. Romney was going to win anyway, now it will be by a larger margin (20%).
One question: Will the administration "enforce" the requirement that those without insurance pay the tax...while that is now the law remember this...the administration has chosen not to enforce "all" of the immigration laws...if this tax is not collected but the benefits are expanded...what happens to you?
Sadly even though the tax amounts are small, I think a large number of those owing the tax will not pay it!
For those of you who keep saying over and over that the majority of those in US are against PPACA, please look at the attached compendium of polls. It demonstrates that for the most part, there is a pretty even split and that at least a portion of those who oppose the law believe it doesn't go far enough. http://pollingreport.com/health.htm
The GOP friends in medicine have been getting a free ride long enough from the middle class. It is time they are on a level playing field with the middle class and the GOP elected officials stop getting wealthy from those they have been making laws for such as the medical field, insurance companies and lobbyists who pay the elected GOP party cry babies. Cry me a river Boner and go back home to Cincinnati and maybe your minions back there will give you some Kleenex tissues to wipe your tears away and give you a big hug.
In dissent:
Justcie Kennedy summarized the dissent in court. "In our view, the act before us is invalid in its entirety," he said.
The dissenters said in a joint statement that the law "exceeds federal power both in mandating the purchase of health insurance and in denying non-consenting states all Medicaid funding."
Mitt Romeny is a shoo-in to the White House now.
id like to see anyone force me to pay for insurance or fine me, please come to my house government and force me to do something. i will neither be force into a contract nor be penalized for not doing so. right now my freedom is being infringed upon by the federal government and i am invoking the DoI to protect my freedom as our founders setup
How is this that much different than Social Security? I see them as basically the same idea.
So, Judge Roberts didn't want to go down in history like justice Tawney, and found an excuse to not thow at least 30 million Americans off healthcare. Too bad congress couldn't come up with a way to keep a private option, thus throwing 26 million Americans off of healthcare. I guess that's why congress is less popular then communism.