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Subscribe to RSSWatch the full NBC News/National Journal/Tampa Bay Times GOP presidential debate as Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney set a combative ahead of Florida's Jan. 31 primary.
Updated 10:56 p.m. ET
The long-awaited showdown between Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney erupted into a slugfest at a Republican presidential debate in Florida, setting a combative tone in the campaign ahead of the state's Jan. 31 primary.
The former House speaker and the former Massachusetts governor began sniping early at Monday evening's NBC News/National Journal/Tampa Bay Times debate; they carried on through much of the debate before finding more conciliatory turf when answering questions specific to the state of Florida.
Still, the gathering delivered what had been expected: Romney taking a new, aggressive tack against Gingrich, and Gingrich finding himself in the frontrunner's spotlight after having scored a decisive victory in last weekend's South Carolina primary.
The sharpest exchange over the evening came over Gingrich's work on behalf of troubled mortgage giant Freddie Mac. Romney had assailed that work, which earned Gingrich's consulting firm a lucrative contract, on the campaign trail, and repeated it tonight.
"The fact is I offered strategic advice, largely based on my knowledge of history, including the history of Washington," Gingrich said of his work. (His campaign released a copy of his contract with Freddie Mac this evening at the behest of the Romney campaign.)
At Monday's Republican presidential debate in Florida, the showdown between former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney and former House Speaker Newt Gingrich erupted into a verbal slugfest. NBC's Peter Alexander reports.
Romney insisted that Gingrich's advocacy work on behalf of Freddie Mac — as well as the ex-speaker's push for a prescription drug benefit in Medicare during a legislative battle in 2003 — represented nothing more than lobbying by another name.
"If you're getting paid by health companies … and you then meet with Republican congressmen and encourage them to support that legislation, you can call it whatever you'd like. I call it influence-peddling," Romney said. "It is not right. It is not right. You have a conflict."
The sparring between Romney and Gingrich was reflective of the uncertainty injected into the primary campaign by Gingrich's victory in South Carolina. None of the four candidates onstage tonight in Tampa has won more than a single nominating contest, and the campaign now threatens to extend into Super Tuesday and beyond.
Romney had sent every signal between Saturday night and Monday evening's debate that he planned to take a more aggressive tack against Gingrich as part of an effort to halt the former speaker's momentum in Florida, which isn't just a key primary state, but a pivotal swing state in the general election, as well.
'Historic losses'
Romney launched into the criticism in his very first answer, assailing Gingrich as an unreliable conservative who could embarrass the GOP.
Former speaker on the defensive over his role as a paid adviser for Freddie Mac, insurance companies.
"The speaker was given an opportunity to be the leader of our party in 1994. And at the end of four years, he had to resign in disgrace," Romney said.
"Don't forget at the end of the speaker's term as speaker, his approval rating was down to 18 percent. We suffered historic losses after his four years in office," Romney added.
For his part, Gingrich opened on a more optimistic note and appeared reluctant at first to engage Romney's attacks.
"I'm not going to spend the evening trying to chase Gov. Romney's misinformation," Gingrich said, explaining his campaign would provide rejoinders on its website tomorrow morning. "He just said four things that were false. I don't want to waste any time on them."
But any hopes for a high-brow affair quickly disappeared when Gingrich sharply disputed Romney's account of his speakership: "He may have made a good financier. He's a terrible historian."
It was the kind of red-hot fight most political observers had expected after the GOP presidential primary was thrown into upheaval by the former House speaker's victory in this past weekend's in South Carolina.
The two GOP front-runners battle over their past in a pivotal NBC News debate.
The debate was one of the fiercest battles of the Republican campaign, presaged by a day of sniping on the campaign trail that saw the Romney and Gingrich trade rhetorical blows in a preview of the new phase of the GOP campaign.
The Romney campaign is hoping Florida proves to be a firewall against Gingrich's surge. They've spent millions on advertising in the state, and Romney has enjoyed an early advantage in the polls — one his campaign hopes transfers to the over 225,000 early and absentee ballots that have been cast.
But the voting is limited to registered Republicans only, meaning the electorate might be composed of the more conservative voters that fueled Gingrich's win in South Carolina. Gingrich is hoping that twin victories in South Carolina and Florida would decimate the aura of inevitability Romney built around his campaign.
Texas Rep. Ron Paul has elected against participating in Florida with much vigor. He spent most of the debate voicing his usual message, decrying government spending and U.S. involvement in foreign conflicts.
NBC's Andrea Mitchell, David Gregory and Chuck Todd provide analysis following tonight's GOP debate.
Former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum, the winner of the Iowa caucus by the slimmest of margins, put himself forward at the debate as the only true conservative. He went on the attack against Gingrich and Romney by saying there is little different between them and President Obama.
"They rejected conservatism when it was hard to stand. It's going to be hard to stand whoever this president is going to be elected," Santorum said, echoing that same line of attack at the end of the debate. "There is no difference between President Obama and these two gentlemen. And that's why this election in Florida is so critical, that we have someone that actually can create a contrast between the president and the conservative point of view."
Republican presidential hopeful Mitt Romney released his tax returns, which reveal he paid a 14 percent rate on nearly $22 million in income for 2010. NBC's Chuck Todd talks to TODAY's Matt Lauer about how this release might impact the race.
Romney, on the attack for much of the night, stumbled on a question regarding how he would handle illegal immigrants residing in the United States.
"Well, the answer is self-deportation, which is people decide they can do better by going home because they can't find work here because they don't have legal documentation to allow them to work here," Romney said, raising eyebrows if nothing else than for the opacity of the concept. "And so we're not going to round people up."
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We are with you all the way Ron Paul the only one who wears the halo of truth . Wake up my Fellow Americans nothing changes if nothing changes ............................
Obama / Biden 2012
Ron Paul acolytes believe that people will hear "the truth" and will be swayed to vote for him. The thing is, most people know a lot of his positions are off the wall. He can't even convince Republicans nationally. Does say some things that makes some sense? Sure, but it doesn't outweigh his crazy.
Florida is Newt country.
Not really.
Ron Paul wants to destroy the GOP let's all hope he succeeds!!
Sorry, but everyone knows Ron Paul is out.
Ka-put. Done. Thats all folks.
Did you ever notice how easily the public is manipulated by the media? It is in their best interest to perpetuate the race for their ratings. When you look at everything they say and do within this context, things become much clearer.
I do know one thing, if Newt Gingrich is the Republican nominee, you can prepare yourselves for another four years of Obama.
SI
I see NO mention of Ron Paul as if the media has already chosen between 2 candidates. SHAME ON THE PRESS! Ron Paul has a following that CAN NOT and WILL NOT BE DENIED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Spoken like a true fanatical believer.
Don't all you ronites get it, most of us are NOT interested, and frankly are MORE than a little turned off by your "enthusiasm".
Ron Paul is the only candidate who will end the wars and honor his oath to uphold the constitution. The ignorant statements of the propagandabots are sickening.
Thanks Very Much NBC for tape delaying the West Coast!! I realize our primaries don't count for squat, but we would like to see what everyone else is voting about!! By the time Rock Center is on out here at 10 pm, its old news!!
AMEN to that! Ron Paul allllll the way INCORRUPTIBLE and cant be bought!
Diane - I just heard that the debate will be on NBC at 9 pm not 10pm pst but even so you are totally correct!
The world is watching not just the citizens of the USA. A large number of us folks in Canada love and respect your current president. We believe he has re-established the USA as a world leader that can be respected and trusted. Your foreign policy has never made more sense to us and we are all starting to see economic gains after the disastrous eight years of George Bush. Nobody can expect to clear up that mess in just four years. We honestly believe that President Obama sincerely cares and worries about the plight of the "average" American. We do not trust any of the Republican candidates in this regard. God Bless The United States of America. (A Canadian fan)
There must be some kind of sinister element in the GOP, when polling between Paul and Obama shows a 2 point margin, however Obama against every other GOP candidate shows Obama with a 9 point lead. Ron Paul is by far the only GOP candidate with the ability to defeat President Obama in the general election, yet Republican establishment and the media are doing everything they can to pretend Ron Paul doesn't exist. Conspiracy anyone?????
What is a ron paul??
Debates? It's more like "Let's get ready to RUMMMBBLLLEE!"
Why would "Gingrich will be targeted by Romney and the two other remaining candidates, former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum and Texas Rep. Ron Paul"?
They know as well as we do that what was reported as a Gingrich "win" cannot have been "counted" right. Didn't the news just release a report before the last primaries that Gingrich had cancelled his speeches as no one, very few was showing up?
If we won't go to listen to his speeches what makes you think that we had/would vote for him? (The weather cannot be blamed as Ron Paul had over 1000 people who came to listen to him).
I think when it is rechecked they will "discover" errors, lots of them in Newt's benefit. Not saying Newt was involved, but someone did not "tally" that one correctly.
Thankfully "We the People..." have time before the elections to make sure that we can rely on what is being presented to us to vote on, now owned by a worldwide corporation, right?
Maybe we need to figure out a "better" way to do our voting, as we want all the votes to be counted correctly and legally.
and no, we do NOT trust those in our govenrment to see to it that it is correct and legal.
Drewster
Obama wants to destroy the U.S., I hope he doesn't succeed.
Judith - is it me, or does it sound like being a follower of Ron Paul is like being a member of a cult? I don't know about most people, but I am always leary of people, churches, and religions that say they are the only way. And that from someone who has the opinion that there actually is one belief that is the right way.
Watch Gingrich fall because he is trying to portray himself as really the only conservative that can defeat Romney or Obama. This kind of thing has gotten him into trouble in the past.
Wildcat west, Thank you for telling me that Florida was Newt country. I will steer clear of being tourist there again and will spread word to all the friends and relatives it is dangerous to visit Florida!
Shut up Romney!!!! All you do is run your mouth and not answer any questions presented to you. Give it up and go home.
And HEY NBC!!!!! What are you doing? Giving free air time to Romney?
Poor Mitt he didn't drop His Gloves he dropped his class and grew cheap and tacky.
What it's all the other guy's fault---me me me me Mitt is a picture of dysfunctional narccism.
Way to go Silly Shrinks!!! Well said!! He has no class. Period. I just watched him ask himself a question and then answer it. Oh please!!! Why does poor Terry Shrivo have to be included in this debate....when the country is burning under Obama?????? I am very disappointed with this debate. I think Brian Williams along with NBC has done a lousy job tonight.
clwyd...... I live in So. Florida and have for over 30 yrs and no way would I consider this to be Newt country. Florida as you may know is a very large state, with several distinct areas, the area around the Panhandle is very conservative, and could very much be Newt country, the middle of the state is conservative to a degree and he will find some support. South Fl is more moderate with pockets of TP not sure how he'll play here.
It is not dangerous to visit my beautiful state, where at the present time we have many winter visitors from all over the country. Our weather is wonderful, and you will have many opportunities to enjoy much the state has to offer.
Florida is a closed primary state, only registered Republicans will vote for republicans on the 31st. Likewise if it were a Democratic primary only Democrats would vote. There is a higher number of registered Democrats than Republicans in the state and a voter must be registered at least 30 days prior to an election.
So come on down, and enjoy.
judith, Face the truth about your hero Ron Paul.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/the-fantastical-crackpot-_b_1200608.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/ron-paul-is-no-friend-to-progressives_b_1185055.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/noah-fitzgerel/the-perplexing-popularity_b_1218950.html?ref=politics&ir=Politics
Polls suggest Ron Paul runs neck and neck with Obama.
Cherry picking the anti-Paul pieces in Huffpo is hardly an intelligent argument. Especially picking the ones which are wrong.
Almost every national poll has Ron Paul statistically tied with Obama.
So, is Ron Paul electable? Yes, he is.
Gerry: If Obama worried about the people, then why are we still in these useless wars? You must be stupid to believe that the war on terror is legit when 90% of afghani people don't even know what the World Trade Center is... all they know is they we are over there shooting them up and deciding their elections. When is the last time you have seen an Afghani in the news with cable TV/radio/newspaper? They're oblivious to the world. Get these troops out, send that saved money back into the economy and medicare, and then it might be somewhat sane to say Obama cares about the American people.
That was his biggest promise. How did he fail on that? WHY would he choose not to fulfill that promise?
Sorry to say this but Romney won tonight in Florida, Next was Paul, than Newt, last was Santorum. I think Santorum is looking to start a war with Iran, this Rick is a sick dog that needs to be put down.
Paul won that debate and didn't even have to say too much. I really appreciated that he defined conservativeism since a lot of people including the other candidates don't seem to know what it means.
This GOP campaign could just as well be called the republican verison of "Ring around the rosie". Appropriate I suppose. They are all plagued with a plague.
I think any of the four remaining candidates would easily make a better president than Mr. Obama. Which isn't saying a whole lot since Mr. Obama isn't much of a president, and being better at it than him wouldn't be much of an accomplishment. Still, each of the four has some excellent policy perspectives. Of the four only Ron Paul, I think, would refuse to continue to grow the budget. Sadly I think his constitutional purity regarding foreign policy is mistaken. I still have not heard a satisfactory answer about how to deal with nations that simple diplomacy and compromise have no effect upon.
Santorum has Iran right, and he also is speaking to the slow-motion crisis in the USA caused by the demise of the traditional family. It could be that all sorts of alternative families are good, but the people making the case to diminish the traditional family don't seem to be able to make that case.
Gingrich is an idea factory--which is both good and bad since he seems unable to keep any of them quiet until he's thought them all the way out--but he is able to do something we've needed for a very long time too: He is both able and willing to say to liberals they are wrong and why, and then explain why a more conservative policy approach is better. He used to be called a "bomb thrower" when a back-bencher in Congress. Maybe we need more people like that.
And Romney seems fully capable of explaining to Congress why their various and sundry stimulus ideas, passed at the urging of this epic failure of a president, Mr. Obama, do not work. What holds me back from Romney most of all though is what Gingrich possesses, that ability to call a spade a spade unapologetically. He needs more passion, more anger. No one that loves the USA, no one that loves our history, can be anything at this point BUT angry at the crazy pace we have been abandoning it. If Mitt wants to win he had better step up to that plate. Conservatives want this.
Whoever the nominee is will get my vote and whatever I can do to help make his campaign a success. Mr. Obama, while he didn't change the direction we were headed, has sure made us go that direction at a much faster pace. He has two signature "accomplishments. The first, health care reform, is disliked by more people than it is liked. It will increase our budget deficit by hundreds of billions annually. And it is a quantum leap away from constitutionalism.
The second was the "stimulus", which has turned out to be a complete failure. Some will argue it stopped the free-fall, but this is fatuous at best. What we do know is that of the 3 million jobs Mr. Obama seems to think he helped save or create the cost for each is an AMAZING 2/3 of a million bucks each. As a nation we are less wealthy because of this. We're in a bad way and Mr. Obama hasn't got a single idea which makes any economic sense.
JoobyFoo, I hope you are only badly mistaken. I would hate to think anyone would tell such a blatant lie. Candidate Obama promised to get us out of the illegitimate war in Iraq and concentrate on the the true terrorists of 9/11 in Afghanistan. He has fulfilled both promises despite criticism from a united Republican front. Bin Laden and many of his prime leaders are finally dead under this President's leadership. A definite time table has been set for withdrawal from Afghanistan. What would you have him do differently?
Press doesn't talk about Ron Paul because truth is not glamorous, and most readers choose glamor and sensation over truth. Feed-them-what-they-want; the greasy sugary stuff that sells well.
Hey Patriotic American,
I don't think SAntorum wants to start a war with Iran. But if we are serious as a nation when Mr. Obama and democrats and republicans say that a nuclear armed Iran is unacceptable, and Iran won't stop until they obtain nukes, then what are our options? Obviously economic sanctions won't work without all other nations faithfully supporting them, which we know will not happen if for no other reason than it never happens. And a sternly worded missive just doesn't seem like it will do the trick.
We should either be honest about what our policy means, which is at some point we must attack Iran's nuclear capability, or we should stop pretending to be serious about opposing Iran's nuclear ambitions and their flauting of the NPT. At least Santorum is being honest about the situation.
Babina, I have read all three of those articles, and none of them state a single fact that deters the message, integrity, and truth about Ron Paul. You probably didn't even read them yourself, but that is just a presumption on my part, because you would have found better articles to support your point. Most people on these posting are fairly educated, well versed in the art of debating with persuading facts, and producing examples. These articles do none of that. I'm not attacking your character, or anything about you, however, I am stating that you have made a poor campaign in your attempt to materialize whatever you could find to down-play Ron Paul.
Paul is 76 years old. Sorry, but I don't want a POTUS who's going to be 81 at the end of his first term, assuming he lives that long. No offense intended.
Representative Ronald Ernest 'Ron' Paul - R-TX has served in the House of Representatives for 20 years. Rep. Paul has repeatedly stated his opposition to monetary and foreign affairs policy. Exactly what has Rep. Paul accomplished to change monetary and foreign affairs policy over those 20 years?
Making speeches in the House well and simply submitting bills that are not considered is not a measure of accomplishment. Has Rep. Paul actually changed policy in a material way? What are his governing accomplishments?
Rep. Paul has sponsored a number of bills - many without a cosponsor. Which of the bills that Rep. Paul has submitted were actually voted on by the House?
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d112:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
If Rep. Ron Paul cannot show any governing accomplishments over a 20 year career in a governing body - why should the voters believe he can accomplish what he is proposing as President?
Is Ron Paul 'all talk - no action'? I believe the Texas style question would be 'how many cattle goes along with Ron Paul's hat?'
Well Nerm_L ;
Ron Paul managed to get an audit of the Fed. Who else has done that? No one.
Ron Paul voted NO to ALL the bailouts.
Voted NO to invade Iraq.
Voted NO to NDAA.
Voted NO to the Patriot Act.
Voted NO to SOPA.
That's a pretty stellar record in my book.
And he's introduced a bill to try and repeal the NDAA.
Who do you think is better? Who is your congressional hero?
I'd be surprised if you have the courage to name any.
I like how all the anti-ron paul people on here can do nothing to prove why Ron Paul would be a bad president, rather just shoot him down for his elder, wise age or state opinionated articles like Babina did. BTW Babina, those articles did nothing but explain how good people like Ron Paul don't get elected into office, because unfaithful Americans like you don't have the courage to fight for freedom and choose the corrupt politician that steals your money without you knowing about it because you're so freakin naive.
"Oh in a perfect world where people really want freedom(CUZ PEOPLE IN THE REAL WORLD DON'T DUHH), Ron Paul would get elected! But people in America are unintelligent idiots who choose to vote for the glamorous candidates who are only in the race because they pay their millions of dollars to advertise themselves!" Thats basically what those articles said. If you haven't realized yet, money buys fame, and if you vote for any one of those top candidates besides Ron Paul..You just fell for the government and medias marketing scheme. *Clap Clap Clap*.
I don't care if any of you say he won't win it. I'm still going to vote for Ron Paul, because its MY FUTURE in this country. Let me ask any of you 40+ year olds that question..Because I'm guessing I still have a solid 50-60 years on my belt left to go. But wait, I'm only voting for Ron Paul because I'm 19 and all for the "revolution." You older people really do wanna screw it up for the younger generation don't you? Just think about that before you go and vote folks..
The same FatCats that controls the Federal government also dictate the media coverage of the presidential election. Just as the FatCats directed the Federal government to bail them out with trillions taxpayer money, they have also ordered the media to promote Romney and Newt as the Republican front runners having real leadership. They have nothing of the sort. Both are cut from the same cloth from the same 'Old Boy Network' as all the Democrats and Republicans who voted repeatedly for one bailout after another. Nearly all the incumbent Democrates and Republicans in DC voted to enslave America's working stiffs to pay the WallSt FatCats. Except Ron Paul.
And they all want to marginalize Ron Paul, the only candidate who wants a strong US economy, sound money, and withdrawal of all US troops in the MiddleEast and Afghanistan.
Whether the next president will be Obama or one of the stale Republican challengers, nothing will change because they all say the same old thing and will do the same old thing once in office using the same old paradigms. How little and short memory Americans have of phony political slogans and empty promises: Hope and Change. Peace with Honor. The Great Society.
The stupid American voters are like sheeps, duped into allowing the corporate media to dictate the choice of candidates, political agenda and landscape.
...heck...Ron Paul gave his son's company a $250M 'earmark' whilst operating his constituency's budget a few years ago...so he's just as good at nepotism as any other politician with picking his choice of ethical notions all the while he's in charge of revenue generated by the taxpaying citizenry...
not to say he doesn't have some decent ideas...but; he's as loony as the rest of the crooks he's associated with and won't have any more impact with his head in the sand foriegn policy...as well as he's so clearly already known to be a John Birch Society supporter...which no clear headed individual would ever associate with...unless you're a segregationist or bigot...pick one or both I guess...
A better question could be, "when are we going to stop being a nation of sheep?"
Dr. Paul has accomplished something: he has managed to stay honest, consistent, and principled in Washington D.C.! He has stood alone at times, stood with his convictions, stood against the unconstitutionality of laws that have been passed. Yes, others have passed laws, lots of laws. One such law that was passed recently was the NDAA. Wow, congress accomplished something. Well, does that always mean it is a good thing? When congress passes more regulations, more taxes, more restrictions, more mandates, more foreign aid, more..... Well, it would be better if they didn't! It would be better if they stopped trying to accomplish something. Seems like they just create a bigger hole with all of their ideas.
Besides that, Ron Paul has accomplished something even bigger. He has woken up some of us out here in America. He has made us aware of what it truly means to be a patriot, how important it is to stand up for our rights, to learn about our government, our Constitution. And how about this: who was talking about the Fed before Paul? Who else predicted the housing bubble, among many other crises that have happened? Who has the most loyal following and why?
Sometimes it is better to stand alone, to stand out, to stand for something, than to join with others who have sold out.
Ron Paul should take the lead on his own proposal and adhere to term limits...also no more taking earmaks...and that going back to the gold standard is just utter nonsense...Ron Paul may sound good but his policies are not based in the realities of this century.
Why not talkingtoyou55?? Let me rephrase that last sentence for you.
"Ron paul may sound good but I'm not voting for him because its more realistic to vote for a corrupt politican in this century."
Michael O'Brien your piece was very slanted. I like Rick Santorum a lot but his performance on Thursday was not strong as you say, but I thought his weakest so far. And there is no opacity in Mitt Romney's plan for illegals. I thought it was brilliant. If you require ALL employers to verify the legality of a person before they hire them, with the threat of legal action if they don't, then illegals will have to return because they will be unable to find work.
@Jungleboogie -- How does voting NO materially change monetary and foreign policy? Are you suggesting that a President Ron Paul would only veto legislation?
The audit you speak of is H.R.459 -- Federal Reserve Transparency Act of 2011. Rand Paul sponsored similar legislation in the Senate.
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c112:H.R.459:
Is an audit the only thing that Rep. Paul has accomplished in 20 years of governing? I realize this is public scrutiny of the Fed. How will an audit change monetary policy?
Rep. Paul has been submitting bills for college affordability, hemp farming, various concealed-carry laws, police security, and several other 'causes' over the past 10 years. How has Rep. Paul materially changed any government policies related to these?
Here is Rep. Paul's history of sponsored bills since the 106th Congress.
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d106:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d107:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d108:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d109:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d110:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/R?d111:FLD003:@1%28Rep+Paul+Ron%29:
Mitt Romney is running on a career of 'success' as a businessman. Newt Gingrich is running on a career of 'success' as a Representative in Congress and Speaker of the House. I still have not heard what Ron Paul's 'successes' are. How does Ron Paul's 'successes' compare to those of the other candidates?
A lot of people who think the "Golden Age" was so great, want Ron Paul to lead us back to the 19th century, when government didn't do much. Well, we can't go back, and Ron Paul can't lead us there. You think you would be some wealthy land owner, or even wealthier industrialist, or businessman? Fact is, its way more likely you and I would be factory slaves. We'd be working 14 hour days, 6-7 days a week, for 5c an hour, til the day before we died. We'd buy rotten meat for our families (laced with arsenic- to keep it looking good), the patent medicines we took for a hundred ills, would be worthless (and maybe dangerous), the air would be unbreathable, the water would be polluted. 8 year olds would be slaving beside us in the factories, ship yards, and coal mines. There'd be no weekends off. No paid holidays, or vacation time. Your retirement started the day you were too sick to work, and ended the day you died. You trusted the grocer, baker, and butcher not to short weight you (which many did often), because nobody checked on any business. It was individuals, like you and me, alone against, our employers, the local and national businessmen, industrialists, and a thousand kinds of cheats and "sharps" who made their living sucking off folks like us.
It was you and me, alone against all the crooked businessmen and industrialists. Often as not we worked for them, rented from them, borrowed from them, and died owing them money. Oh, and the average age that we died--47 years old!!! Ron Paul is selling you a pipedream, and the rest of the Republicans are not much better.
Your parents retired, and you want to? Thank the federal government! The medicine you take is safe, and effective? Thank the federal government!! You live in Pittsburgh (or Detroit, LA, etc.), and you don't die young, from the air pollution (and your car doesn't rust away in 3 years)? Thank the federal goverbment!!!
These, and a thousand other things regulated by the gvt, and produced by business and industry, make life in the US worth living. What?? You think business did all that stuff voluntarily, out of the goodness of their hearts? You know better than that. They screamed bloody-murder! It was going to be the "death of freedom in America". Each and every one of those regulations was going to put whole industries out of business! NONSENSE!!! Business people are wealthier now than ever in human history. You want to modify the regs Fine, suit yourself (until you realize that half the people want to add, and the other half want to cut the same things!!). But don' but the lie that govt regs are bad for you, or that you can live a decent life without them. In my opinion.
Ok, maybe Mitt and Newt should try to go about their little squabble between themselves a little differently. Ok, this is the old school, back alley/backyard way, but I think it will work for them too. Ok, they both whip it out and see whos bigger and the loser sits down and the winner goes against Ron Paul and lets see who's really got what as far as running for the president of the country goes. Santorum can go for it too but he's going to lose. Then the winner between these two gentlemen, Mitt and Newt will eventually have to go up against the president. I suggest they don't try the same thing with him. Its a thought, just saying? NO?
ron paul would have been a great candidate IF we were in 1816. We aren't and he has zero chance of being elected
First it was snow bitch and the 7 DWARFS (all named DOPEY)
she quit and now we are down to 4 of the DOPEY DWARFS remaining
santorum is the next absolute @!$%#ing idiot tits on a boar hog who will leave
Rethug candidates - gotta LOVE 'em. IDIOTS one and ALL
Oh God, please! Please let Gingrich be our next president!!!
God doesn't vote for adulterers with 84 ethics violations under their belts.
Stop fascism.
Obama/Biden 2012.
To all the Ron Paul supporters out there - I admit I haven't listened to his "message". Listening to him say that we don't need regulations in this country because we're smart enough to know if our cars are safe enough or our food and water are safe - well, it just weirded me out. But one of his other ideas has me wondering. Let's say we do away with most of the federal regulations that he wants eliminated in favor of states rights. So different states are now passing all kinds of laws that individually apply to each state. Where does that end? When the United States of America becomes 50 different countries? Do you need "papers? Because you know that if some states are allowed to run wild, the idea of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness will only apply to some people. And then where are we? The separate states of America?
Isolation is NOT the way to go. Didn't world in World War II, Wont work now. I Say All candidates, GoP & Democrats alike arnt worth voting for this year...
Please, Rich - I know you're talking about homosexuals. Could you please draw a line of logic between homosexuals and this 'demise of the traditional family' and exactly how it impacts the country?
I'm waiting.
Yep, a Confederacy - just the way the
former DixiecratsGOP wants it.That's not a halo around Ron Paul's head... it's a sphincter. He's a walking @!$%#. Sure let's take America BACKWARDS... back before there were meat inspectors... back before there were child labor laws... back to the good old days before minorities or women could vote.
Let's march straight back to a time when lynching a black man was 1000000 x more common than voting for one for the office POTUS. Let's take it back before school desegregation and the voting rights act... back before Jews were allowed in country clubs. Back before there were safety standards for autos or the workplace.
Those are the good old days for conservatives... back when they could work a man to death in a coal mine and then send his family a bill for his pick and the oil he burned in his lamp.
"We don't need FEMA," Paul says. "We had a big hurricane in my district back in 1900 and the locals cleaned up all by themselves!" LIAR... what he doesn't mention is local emergency services were either destroyed or isolated. It took weeks for outside relief to reach the coast.
The residents had to burn upwards of 6000 bodies right on the beaches because they couldn't bury them. It was so bad they never got an accurate death count. The local economy was crippled for years.
So all you Ron Paul self reliant pioneers just keep on posting the internet on the power grid supplied with electricity generated by dams built by the TVA. Keep on buying goods or have your own goods brought to market on inter state highways built by the taxpayers, in trucks driven by Teamsters.
Last night's debate was absolutely pathetic. It was like watching two school boys on the play ground. The one who could say or do, the worst to his opponent, was going to be king of the hill. Ron Paul seemed to be the only adult in the room, last night.
I always thought, political debates were about discussing your ideas, and you opponent discussing his ideas. You then debate, the differences between the two. In 18 debates, I have heard very little of this. If they're not attacking Obama, they're attacking each other. It's no wonder, that the republican party was begging Christie to get into the race. If Romney and Gingrich is the best that the GOP can offer, we are in serious trouble.
"Conservative" is the newest four letter word.
Kevin; You nailed it.
Actually, in the CNN debates I think it was either Mittt or Newwt that said something like "We could all be up here talking about eachother all night long, but I think we would be better off talking about Obama!"
I replied to the television, "Why not your platform or something worth hearing?"
Seriously, it's pathetic. It's Reality Television for uneducated pretend adults.
Priceless..................Mitt and Newt, two members of the 1% debating over which one of them knows what's best for the rest of us 99%....................
Newt was Choking on his Viagra last night with fannie mae 1.6 mill, tax payers money. ( "Newt + 1.6 = Crook, end of my story.
This is the best reality TV on right now.
Newt didn't win SC but the networks would like you to believe he did.
Ron Paul this and Ron Paul that... it doesn't matter the two headed monster would never let him in on it. Case in point last nights debate. He may as well been Herman Cain up there answering 9 and 9 to every darn question fired his way.
Mayans '12
GOP Tea Retard dog show and lots of barking, dog fight dog. What a joke. This is the best the Retards have, sad day for America. Their dog days are coming when the American people kick the dirty dogs out.
@ "Patriotic" #1.65,
The Dumbocrats have given us the vagueness" of hope and change which has turned out to be more like dope and strange.
Obama's focus has never been on jobs and the economy, it has always been about his re-election, trying to look good and maintaining his power. As President, he has accelerated our national debt rapidly with little or no results in reducing unemployment. He has played class warfare continuously as he tries to pit U.S. citizens against those who have successfully attained wealth. He got us into an irrelevant war in Libya costing U.S. taxpayers about $1 billion and his "loans" to campaign contributors at Solyndra, representing the worst in crony capitalism, cost U.S. taxpayers $535 million. He screwed GM bondholders while bailing out his union buddies, and the GM stock "Uncle Sam" owns is now worth substantially less than invested.
He has failed to offer Congress a meaningful, realistic budget proposal as a guide to our country's financial health, and he has pushed the onerous, massive expansion of government growth upon us through his ego-induced Obamacare. The regulations on this one bill alone were last reported to be about twice the length of the gargantuan bill itself.
The only "dirty dog" to be kicked out, as you say, is the barking little chihuahua that resides in the White House ..... residing for a little while longer. The lack of experience, the "grow government at all costs" mentality and the totalitarian mentality of this President will be his undoing !
Nerm_L... Your argument is put together poorly... do you not understand your own premise?
Let me put it into a very short and simple format...
1) Ron Paul has only made one significant change (audit the fed to a very small factor)
2) Despite the quality of the bill, it's not enough
3)Henceforth, Ron Paul has made no significant governmental changes allotting him title of "worthy"
Now, here is the problem with that, you have COMPLETELY overlooked how his legislation in EXTREMELY unpopular because it denounces the government, strips power from the corrupt fed and their play-thing (our monetary system), reduces regulation, puts jobs/money/freedom into the hands of the states and people which creates economic freedom (Btw, Hong Kong is rated with the highest economic freedom in the world, Canada also being higher than us now), get rid of the IRS so they will stop stripping money away from people for useless government spending, and overall let progression take it's toll in the hands of the individual, the creative... and not the mass mob, not the government...
Think about your argument for a second there
Jim1455,
You and the GOP are the only ones barking... and you are chasing your tail. These are the facts:
22 straight months of economic growth. Not tremendous growth, but steady growth. Wall Street is certainly enjoying record profits... ironic under a President who is slurred as anti-business.
13 straight months of private sector job growth. The economy was hemorrhaging 750 K jobs PER MONTH for Bush's final year in office... Obama inherited an economy in free fall.
The 2009 budget was written and passed by Bush so any job losses or deficit increase for 2009 still belong to Bush.
The housing bubble burst under Bush, so the dirty doings of Fannie/Freddie belong to him. Although dis-honorable mention must go in particular to a certain genuis consultant of history and definer of civilization, one Newton Leroy Gingrch!
TARP and the initial Wall Street Bail out were both initiated by Bush.
Obama has cut taxes... for everyone.
Obama owns the GOP on foreign policy and the so called, "War on Terror." He did exactly what he said he would do when he ran for office.
He is restoring American prestige and dignity in the foreign community without the mindless blather and bluster of Bush/Cheney and without the disastrous consequenses of trumped up invasions.
The Federal Goverment is smaller by several hundred thousand jobs right now than when Obama took office. In addition to which he has proposed eliminating and merging several departments which would result in an even smaller, more efficient goverment.
Of course the GOP objected... to a plan that will make goverment smaller! Just like they objected to continuing the Payroll Tax Cut. Ha, Ha, imagine all those morons who signed Grover Norquist's pledge voting against a tax cut... Obama is playing your team like a fiddle!
And despite all the right-wing propaganda, the Obama Health Care bill is not a government takeover. The insurance idustry is still very much in private hands. In fact they have over 30 million new paying customers. How's that for stimulating business??
Besides, your number one and two top dogs in the running both previously advocated for health care systems that were much more strict! Newt pushed for a Public Option in 1994. Did god change Newt's mind about health care when he forgave him for adultery?
Mitt is so pathetic he has to disavow his OWN health care plan from Mass. which is working so well over 95% of the residents have affordable health insurance! Own it Mitt, be a man not a eunuch!
The truth and the facts are clear and still Obama gets splashed with the hog wash of the previous administration. Even in spite of fanatic opposition by a do-nothing Congress Obama has been able to stem the tide and avert what most experts agree would have quickly become a Depression.
So when the facts tell the real story you do what Newt is famous for and blow up in the messenger's face, blame the media, elitists, international boogey men, Obama's the antichrist and a European Socialist effete and appeaser. Are you all on the same meds as Beck and Limbaugh?
Too bad the world can see Obama is actually a hard working, honest, brilliant strategist who is dedicated to every citizen of this nation and it's constitution and a president who has kept most of his promises. He's proven himself to be one bad ass mofo too! Go ask Al Qaida, but you'll have to hurry!
At least Newt pays taxes. He has a lot of baggage, but at least he pays taxes. I can respect that.
I respect Romney for being rich, but that doesn't mean I'm going to let him rob me of my social security account and let him divide the proceeds between himself and his rich pals.
Ron Paul should run as a third party candidate. It's obvious the Republican Party does not want him.
What talent!
NDAA is the name of the Appropriations Bill. What needs to be repealed is the AMENDMENT that the GOP forced into the appropriations bill (a non-germane amendment that should NEVER have been allowed to be attached to the bill). Technically, all such non-germane amendments should be declared unconstitutional when attached to appropriations bills.
Ron Paul - the home has a bed for you. Newt "the swinger" is just waiting for his payoff to get high enough to quit- the 1% will have to pay dearly! But Florida is all fixed anyway - does Bush like Newt??
Mitt will win Florida.
Mitt will win the GOP nomination.
and America will be the big loser because of it.
We love you Ron Paul and we are with you all the way ...you Sir are the only one who wears the halo of truth . Wake up my fellow Americans nothing changes if nothing changes . We need to weed out the corrupt government and lets all join together and save our Nation ....
Can you or any other Paul supporter please, seriously answer these things for me? Why is Ron Paul running to be the Republican nominee for President? Ron Paul is not a Republican. Ron Paul spends as much time bashing th Republicans as he does bashing the Democrats. Ron Paul has very plainly and very loudly made his feelings about the "establishment" known. Is he not aware that actual, you know, Republicans are the people voting in a Republican primary?
But lets move ahead. Ron Paul doesn't have any friends in Congress seeing as he's spent YEARS telling them all how sh*tty they are. Everyone knows that this government is gridlocked because half the Congress opposes the President. HALF! Now if by some gigantic act of God Ron Paul finds himself elected I'm sure he will want to start rolling with his plans to save the country. I am ABSOLUTELY dying to know how Dr. Paul is going to get ANYTHING done with 534 members of Congress that aren't inclined to give Ron Paul the time of day? I'm actually serious. President Ron Paul would not be able to get Congress to approve his lunch order. So please, Dr. Paul, or a Dr. Paul supporter I'd really like to know how he's going to pull this off.
Do you all really THINK that the Republican National Commitee will allow Ron Paul to get on that stage and on national television go on a 20 minute rant about the "establishment Republicans" in front of 20,000 establishment Republicans?
So please, stop complaining about Ron Paul being ignored. Stop whining about Ron Paul being pushed aside. And for the love of God stop blaming the "liberal media" for conspiring to phase him out. If you want to be angry, be angry at the RNC. Actually no, be angry at Ron Paul. Because as much as I detest the things coming out of the Republican Party I'm not so sure that the Republicans wanting the Republicans Party nominee for President to actually be a Republican is such a terrible thing.
Maybe a Paul supporter will reply, but I will give it a try. Dr. Paul certainly belongs in the Republican Party as do all Libertarians. We believe in smaller government, less taxes, the Constitution, and above all - the individual. We all generally believe Capitalism is the best way to regulate and parcel the opportunity and rewards. Something like that..
Some Republicans will fall closer to the Socialist model in some circumstances, and some as far as they can get. Libertarians are about as conservative as you can get, almost full circle at times.
I think the media does short Dr. Paul his due in getting votes and representing a dedicated base. In a fair media world, there would be much more talking head stuff around his issues - guess we will have to settle for Stossel awhile longer. And yes, I do hope there is a place for Paul at the convention. He has earned it. Then again, listening to his shrill voice will be difficult. I listened to Perot; Guess I can take it.
Frankly, ron is LUCKY the press is ignoring him. If they REALLY started examing his policies, the guys in white with the nets would be out after him, ready to fit him with a coat with extre long sleeves and put him up in a nice padded room.
That makes no sense to me. Ron Paul, like all Libertarians should be in the Republican Party? Why aren't Ron Paul and all Libertarians in the Libertarian Party?
Why would you run for a party where the vast majority of that party has a platform that is directly in conflict with yours, and then be offended when the vast majority of that party whos platform is in direct conflict with yours don't vote for you?
An overwhelming majority of registered Republicans fall right into the category of "establishment". Honestly, how can your whole M.O be to tell the establishment how crappy they are, and then when they not only don't vote for you, but pretty much ignore you all together claim that you are being treated unfairly.
Wouldn't it be, for the most part extremely arrogant to slap someone around and then expect them to vote for you?
Here is an interesting point for you. If there is a difference then how come he is garnering so much of the vote? especially early on. he had 22% for a while in this and 08 as well but the press keeps putting him off like a uncle no one wants at a party and the other contenders fear him.
all of you people who say he's crazy are probably foaming at the mouth with Support For Isreal, the so-called "Blessed nation"
The hypocrisy on the vine is STUNNING.
Ron Paul was in the Libertarian Party and was there candidate for Pres in 1988 I believe. Thing is the electioin laws are very biased against 3rd paries. They have to collect a lot more signatures, etc to get on the ballot. Since they are non establishment, they don't have money to campaign or just advertise they even exist, thus Paul had to become a Republican to get anywhere. If Paul stayed a Libertarian, he wouldn't have ever bee noticed or heard.
I am a Paulite and I will try to anser your question the best I can. Yeah, Paul will have 537(minus his son) congressmen and senators that are not going to go along with most of his stuff, but just the fact that he is the Pres and has the bully pulpit so to speak allows him to go directly to the American people for support. If he can articulate his plan to the American people we believe most will like what they hear and demand that their congressman or senator will play ball. Yes, it might be a stretch my good man, but it is the only shot we pretty much have left. Romney is white Obama, and Newt is just a big fat turd, so you really don't have much of a choice in terms of men that actually have any idea of what change is, with the exception of Dr. Paul. With the Federal Reserve prepping QE 3 and 4, our time to even have any chance of turning this thing around is very slim.
Ryan NYC you are so disconnected from reality. People like you who watch one news program and claim to "know it all" drive me crazy. The worst part is you are spreading your ignorance around and most likely influencing the other people who only read one source (nbc).
You said, "I am ABSOLUTELY dying to know how Dr. Paul is going to get ANYTHING done with 534 members of Congress that aren't inclined to give Ron Paul the time of day?"
You apparently dont know that the president can veto every bill that comes across his desk. Congress HAS to work with him.
There is so much incorrect information out there about Ron Paul that he will never get a fair shot. WAKE UP PEOPLE! Seriously do some research. Find out what each candidate really stands for. For example, If the media says, "This guy is out to close the EPA" They seem to conviently leave out what "this guys" plan actually is. Guess what? You might not like the new plan but if you researched enough on the candidate that you do plan to vote for, there is probably something about him that you don't like as well. The fact is that none of these guys can do everything they want when they get into office. I would suggest picking the guy with the strongest message and if you haven't researched Ron Paul yourself then you are seriously doing yourself and this country an injustice.
There is one candidate that wants...
1. Limited government
2. Repeal the Patriot Act (if you don't know whats in it, LOOK IT UP).
3. Repeal NDAA (indefinite detention of US citizens without trial)
4. To Audit the Fed (why would he want to do this? LOOK IT UP)
Where can you LOOK UP these issues and Ron Pauls views on them? (www.)ronpaul(.com)/on-the-issues/on-the-issues/
There you can find out what Ron Pauls true views are on these issues like...
Honest Money, Budget, Foreign Policy, Healthcare, Immigration, Audit the Fed, End the Fed, Gold Standard, Taxes, Israel, Iran, Libya, Afghanistan, Civil Liberties, Education, Abortion, Global Warming, War on Drugs, TSA, and National ID.
@Stop the fed
I never said that he wasn't getting any votes. I'm saying that there is no possible way that he will come anywhere near getting enough to win. Again, the MAJORITY of registered republicans are the same people that Dr. Paul rails against.
@Thel4ugh!ngm@n
I'm not a fan of Israel, BUT, Dr. Paul's feeling that if Iran wants a nuke then Iran should have a nuke is monumentally stupid. Irans favorite past time is pissing Israel off. At least once a month we have to pull Israel back from the ledge. So we leave, how long do you think it will take for Iran to threaten to nuke Israel, Israel gets jumpy and fires one off at Iran, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, and possibly Egypt and Iraq make a move on Israel, and Israel nukes everyone.
He also wants us to bring everyone home, lock the door and close the shades. I'm not sure how old you are, but we actually have done that before. And the end result was 6 million Jews were murdered, Europe was pretty much razed, and Japan got nuked.
@Robert Bruce
You should go ask President Obama how having the "bully pit" has worked out so far.
@Jason,
Well after you insulted me and presumed to tell me what I watch and what I listened to you went on and spouted the same old Ron Paul Revolution talking points. And seeing as I have a Masters degree in Poli Sci with a focus on International relations I'm fairly sure I know how the veto works. The President cannot VETO a bill that doesn't exist. There will be nothing to veto because they won't send any bills.
I'm glad you are under the impression that Congress HAS to work with the President, you obviously havent been paying attention to the US Congress the last 2 years.
Why is it that out of all of the responses I got to my post yours was the only arrogant, and confrontational, which not surprising also contained nothing but talking points and misinformation.
How is Saint Ron going to do any of these things without Congressional approval? Since you're so AWAKE, please educate me.
So to paraphrase you, maybe its YOU that needs to wake up, perhaps go take a civics course so you can actually understand the talking points you are copying.
The only way Ron Paul will ever be taken seriously
is if he runs as a third party candidate for the Libertarian Party or what ever name you want to call yourselves. Other than that he should quite.
From what I have read and heard, Ron Paul is living in some other universe, or is at least from said universe. Reducing government intervention is fine for those able to fight back but has everyone forgotten the Vasquez, Love canal, the gulf oil well disaster, Dioxin poisoning of whole towns? Etc. Etc. Etc. If you think corporate America is going to magically start being responsible employers, environmentally aware and all around good citizens dream on! Do you really believe the average person will all of a sudden be able to afford decent health care/insurance? Of course, when he gets elected, all the terrorists and those countries which have a serious hate on for the U.S. will all of a sudden throw flowers instead of bombs. I dislike government intervention and do believe it has gone way too far but people are often greedy, uncaring monsters who will take every advantage of those who are too weak to defend themselves; thus the need for controls.
Paul supporters: Face the truth about your hero Ron Paul.
For all:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/the-fantastical-crackpot-_b_1200608.html
For progressives:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/ron-paul-is-no-friend-to-progressives_b_1185055.html
For the younger generation:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/noah-fitzgerel/the-perplexing-popularity_b_1218950.html?ref=politics&ir=Politics
Ron Paul had some interesting points. Reducing the military is not a bad idea.
We didn't beat the Soviets by invading them. We talked to them.
Would be nice to not see America become the next Greece because some drooling moron sees a terrorist under every rock.
RyanNYC...
Do you know what a classical conservative is? Ron Paul is THE MOST CONSERVATIVE CANDIDATE in the Republican race BY FAR. Neo-conservatism covers less than 20 years of conservative thought in this country, and hopefully it collapses and dies quicker than it developed to spare this country any more grief from crooked neo-con Republicans. You have a terribly poor understanding of conservatism.
And trust me, I'm not a Paul bot, but I'm gonna call out idiocy and misinformation when I see it.
Screw oil. We have water to fuel our cars... and this is no joke, look it up. Get a president that fully supports free markets (truly) and he will be behind this 100%, unlike most who have their vehicles to themselves and either a. sold it to the govt and the govt trashed it, or b. they just disappeared.
The American people are being puppets of the puppets. It's so ridiculous, yet true.
Judith, its statements like that that get you called a cultist. Believe me. I support Obama, but whenever I show that there is at least 3 people ready to bash me in. And although I admire some of Ron Paul's ideas, the guy's is very radical (no offense). I mean he wants to take us back to the 1840s, with a weak government, an unregulated bull of an economy, and a rampant financial crisis. The guy wants to cut $1 trillion IN A YEAR, eliminate entitlements, AND DO NOTHING ABOUT TAXES!!!! WTF??? I mean, I like his bold deficit reduction plan, but he is off by about $200-300 billion AND IS DOING IT ALL IN CUTS?? Why can't he just let the Bush tax cuts expire and then he is free to cut perhaps a few more trillion to significantly reduce the debt?? But no, he has to be consistent on his "small govt, small debt, and low taxes."
OBAMA BIDEN 2012
NBC blew the coverage. Host acted as if there were only 2 candidates. The debate after only focused on 2 candidates.
Ryan, if you want to know why Paul is in the Republican party, look into the party's history. The other Republicans are really democrats. A wolf in sheep's clothing still isn't a sheep even if they outnumber the sheep a million to one.
Paul isn't worrying about Florida. It is a winner-take-all state... not to mention they were penalized and only half the amount of delegates will be allowed to show. As long as Romney doesn't win, he's clear. Gingrich and Santorum aren't on the ballots of 7 or 8 states, leaving over 500 delegates up for grabs between Paul and Romney... as well as making it practically impossible for Gingrich and Santorum to win.
The man knows what he is doing...
Freshieee - I voted Obama in '08 too. When Obama focused on Healthcare instead of jobs/economy I knew we were in trouble. Then war in Libya, troops in Africa, and in Iraq much longer than promised. Guantanamo. NDAA. SOPA. PIPA. OPEN.
All these things cost money. None of it is being paid for. It's debt, debt, debt.
Would like to see us rebuilding America, NOT Iraq and Afghanistan. That's why I'm leaning Ron Paul this go round.
@Stop the Fed
"...the press keeps putting him off like a uncle no one wants at a party and the other contenders fear him."
You wanna know why that is??? Because Ron Paul is EXACTLY like the uncle no one wants at a party. The reason??? They are BOTH batsh!t CRAZY!
IF RON PAUL ISN'T RUNNING . I'M NOT VOTING . SAME BS THEY GIVE US A REPUBLICAN THAT IS JUST AS BAD AS THE DEMOCRATS . Obama picks up where bush left off they are both batting on the same team for the new world order .
listen to all the sheeps on here..Wanting the big men with all the money to win. Hey guess what? They're going to take more of it when you elect them in. Who the BLOODY !@#$ cares if they're republican or democrat???? IDGF if they're a manbearpig! If they believe in what they say and are looking to put good policies into place for our country, then I'm backing them up! Like I really care for candidates who sit there and bicker at eachother and talk eachother down. All they're doing is trying to prove who is least corrupt between themselves. Like Matt P said, if Ron Paul's not in the race, I'm not voting. I will never vote for any of those money hungry CEO idiots. They don't even know what the hell "industrialized hemp" is. Romney, Santorum: Industrialized waaahhh?? Whats that????
Freakin morons.
I know I'm just wasting space here, I'm just an individual. One that is self supporting and does not believe in Government to help me OR control my life. I'll never get entitlement because I'm one of the 51% whom supports the dreaming 49% that's living on "entitlement". {Note to self: I shouda ben dumb}
I'll be working my hobby and skill of helping others (and it's a skill) till the day I die, not looking for a "GIVE ME". I must be blessed knowing that my own actions have propelled me into being a "HAVE", not a "HAVE NOT".
I know this is off the "idea string" of the subject (probably not), but yes.....VOTE Republican, Libertarian, or ONES SELF, and get all "Wanabees" out of my face (or get an education/skill). The current POTASH is taking this country down. If you don't believe me, I'll be living in my own encampment, peacefully. You can live in Obummers tent camp.
Godspeed, Think right, Take care of Family and Self.......................and have a great day!
tomtexasborn; The Texas wilderness is calling you.
Obama / Biden 2012
to destroy it more and more
Obama, Biden? No one who wants a free America wants those them
Let's see, extended the Patriot Act - Unconstitutional.
No Warrant searches - Unconstitutional.
Funded Operation Gunrunner (Fast and Furious) in 2009, took him two tries where he Funded selling arms to illegal gunrunners for foreign nations which were used on US soil to kill American citizen(s). We only know about the latest, not how many for sure. This is Unconstitutional, makes him a traitor, and a murderer under our penal code (along with Holder and every other "higher up" associated with this operation).
Chair for the UN - Unconstitutional
Bush had Special Ops in 70 foreign nations, Obama has over 140 Special Ops in foreign nations (and in much less time)
UN Small Arms Treaty - Secretary of State Hillary Clinton announced the Obama Administration would be working hand in glove with the U.N. to pass a new "Small Arms Treaty." Disguised as legislation to help in the fight against "terrorism," "insurgency" and "international crime syndicates," the U.N.'s Small Arms Treaty is nothing more than a massive, gun control scheme. Unconstitutional as it is agaisnt the Constitution (2nd Amendment) for Obama to hold UN laws higher then US laws and Constitution (not sure if it also makes him a traitor, but sounds like it. Clinton also)
and a lot more
Breaking his Oath to "preserve, protect and defend the US Constitution" is an impeachable and prosecutable offense. (Yes, there are legal precedents for it) Going against the US Constitution, not following the way it defines our govenrment to operate, trying to take away our Rights makes him a domestic enemy of the USA.
Operation Gunrunner (Fast and Furious) makes him a Traitor, domestic enemy, and a murderer under our penal code.
Obama and Biden released sensitive information on the Seal team.
Etc
The Constitution only grants our federal government certain, specified powers. The framers wanted to make sure everyone understood that the Constitution only grants the feds prescribed, specific, enumerated powers. The federal government may not exercise any powers not granted by the US Constitution.
Our US Constitution was created to define the way our government will operate and to Protect our Rights from those who serve in our government who would take them away. In fact, the Bill of Rights sets limits on the federal government, making clear it has no power to infringe on rights we already naturally possess, or limit traditionally held privileges, such as trial by jury.
The first eight amendments making up the Bill of Rights specify rights and privileges the federal government may not in any way abridge. It puts into writing the protections of life liberty and property (rights each of us naturally possess) and the specific privileges in the judicial system already accepted in Anglo-American law.
President: I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.
military officials to support the Constitution.
The wording of the Presidential Oath was already established in the Constitution in Article II, Section 1, Clause 10. The requirement for all other Federal and State Civil officers to give their solemn and binding Oath is established in Article VI, Section 1, Clause 4. They are BOUND by their Oath to support the Constitution, and should they abrogate their Oath by their acts or inaction, are subject to charges of impeachment and censure
Khane, Starting two wars based on lies about WMD. Stating that the oil of Iraq would pay for bush's wars. $4,000,000,000,000 in war and Pentagon expenses added to our debt! Tarp to bailout bush's buddies in the banking business trying to be greedy thugs. Loopholes that have millionaires and billionaires paying 15% in income taxes or less while we pay 28%. This former Nixon, Goldwater and Reagan republican is ashamed of his belonging and campaigning for the republican party and being a YR back in the 60's. Shame!
Interesting how the '"community" collapsed your comment. Best one on the Blog. They let stand the one promoting Ron Paul as the only bastion of truth. Just goes to show how rabidly ignorant these folks are and how far to the Right the Republican Party has swung. These debates are the death nell of the Republican Party, and Good Riddance.
David: Your comment makes you ignorant. If the Republican party swung too far to the right, they would support Ron Paul 100%... but he would keep them from their $$$.
Knine: Best comment on the thread regarding Obama.
We already got a taste of that "free America" under Bush. And all we got was the freedom of Wall Street and the banks to screw Americans out of the value of their homes and retirement savings. Then we had the pleasure of bailing them out with our tax money. But I guess you Republican supporters want to do it all over again.
Let sanity and intelligence prevail.
Obama/Biden 2012
Both GREED and ignorance know no boundaries....
Knine,
Operation Gun Runner began in 2005! It was already being misused when Obama took office. Besides, he can't be impeached for the failure of ATF or Justice department heads. Reagan on the other hand could (and should) have been impeached for selling missiles to Iran and funneling the money to the Contras. The RJCOS at the time recommended Oliver North for Courts Martial.
The Patriot Act was signed into law in Oct. 2001... if it were unconstitutional it would have been declared so long ago. You give an excellent example of how the right wing twists facts and gives Obama dubious credt for the failures of the previous administration.
Obama gets slammed for TARP, Fannie/Freddie and for Bailing out Wall Street... all of which initially happened under BUSH!! The 2009 budget was passed under BUSH. Obama is slurred as a "European Style Socialist," but he didn't push for a gov't. take over of the banks. Obamacare is NOT a takeover of the insurance industry... both are still very much in private hands.
All those right wingers in Congress who slur the President are fighting to push through austerity measures exactly like those which are failing in Europe!! So in reality (a little known concept to rabid conservatives) it is Romney, Boehner, Cantor and Gingrich who are acting like Europeans! The U.S. economy needs more stimulus not less!
President Obama wrote a signing statement declaring he would not act on the controversial detention provisions contained in the current defense appropriations bill.
The last time this country declared war was in Dec. 1941. Every president since then has conducted military operations, whether unilaterally or in concert with U.N. or NATO allies with little question as to constitutionality, so long as congress was informed and happy.
U.S. citizens within U.S. borders are subject only to the constitution (and State/Local rules) regarding guns. Any action entered into by the U.S. with the U.N. on international gun treaties will have NO EFFECT on U.S. citizens within U.S. borders. Obama is not coming for your guns.
International treaties are just another big imaginary boggie man propped up by right wing-nuts. They puke up everything from the BuyBull to the Mayan Calendar to Nostradomus to prove someone they hate (Obama) is the antichrist and the end of the world is near...
Get a clue. Obama got elected. The world did not reverse its orbit. He turns out to be to the right of much of his base. He's been a steady hand through troubled waters stirred up to a great degree by his own domestic enemies...
The constitution was written to be flexible. Hence the amendment process. It was not written to cement our feet into the past. It does not mention the Air Force... so should we declare the Air Force unconstitutional??
Obama is a PROFESSOR of CONSITUTIONAL LAW. He's not a radical revolutionary, just like he's not a foreign born, muslim mole. And judging by the clown show of lying, hypocritical candidates on the GOP side, his second term will be magnificent!
If Willard Romney did NOT give his church 10% of his GROSS INCOME EACH year, he cheated his church…. and Gordon B. Hinckley WILL KNOW for sure !! OMG !
To be of good standing, all Mormons MUST tithe, or give 10 percent of their GROSS INCOME to the church.
Have you wonder WHY HE STUMBLES AND REFUSES TO SHOW THE LAST FEW YEARS OF HIS INCOME TAX RETURN?? 10% of any figure is EASY TO CALCULATE- WILLARD MAY BE DISGRACED !!
FORBES MAGAZINE IS REPORTING THE IRS IS GOING TO SEIZE HIS FOREIGN BANK ACCOUNTS IN THE CAYMANS for tax fraud and money laundering
GOOGLE IT . (copied)
Ed, Really, wouldn't you love for this to be true, sorry to dissapoint! Sorry, if this was the main story, it would be on every headline and the center of all cable news networks. Allegations are completely false but nice try. Then you all wonder why Romney was hesitant to release his tax records, to avoid rumors like that circulating around. Romney has every right to do what he wants with his hard earned money, he made a commitment every year to give 10% to his church so be it! His choice!
The Obama's are cheap-skates and failed to give enough of their rich personal wealth to charity.
Shame on them.
And Romney's getting blasted for giving money to his church. Typical!
Dee Patriot - here is the story I have waited for Romney to properly reply. Seem there was value in the company to be looted. Shouldn't the tithing Mr. Romney given a little to those 1700 workers he cut to sell off their plant? This is why it's vulture capitalism and looting - NOT venture capitalism, and capitalism in general for that matter, are very different. You agree?
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2012/01/14/v-print/135889/romneys-bain-made-millions-as.html
I don't really want to get into another debate in his business dealings and profits from Bain Capital. It is a mute point and will go nowhere on this post. All I can say, I will always defend captalism and free enterprise. Once again, it is Romney's choice what he wants to do with his earnings. If a company's business model is not working, people are going to be laid off regardless what Bain Captial does. That is a reality, it happens. Romney is a business man, not a philanthropist. I do know he has done a lot of good creating new jobs from the businesses that were turned around, people do not want to talk about his business successes but they are there. If this issue comes up and Romney answers for it, we'll just have to wait to hear what he says. That is all I am going to say on this subject.
Ain't that just GREAT for the Republican Party. Romney cheats on his taxes and therefore cheats on his tithing to the Mormon Church, whereas Newt just CHEATS PERIOD. So Republicans have a choice between a selective cheater and an indiscriminate cheater.
Dee Patriot... I too support the capitalist model. Owned and operated several small businesses. I just don't see Romney as a real venture capitalist. I see him more s a money/banker type who brings a big name to bring in big money. I would like to hear some real talk from Mitt.
That's why I like Newt. Most of the candidates just blah/blah apple pie and freedom, small government, nasty Dems. For some reason I hear Newt's reasons and they make sense. Paul has some good points too, but goes way beyond the pail.
Sorry you didn't want to say more - good reply.
Newt is a egotistical pig, and the consummate politician. Yeah he dodged Nam what 4-5 times through deferrments, but doesn't have a problem sending others in harms way to beat down any Third World natioin with oil or other natural resources for Exxon Mobil or BP, etc to exploit for monopoly type profits. His economic plans are no different that Ws, Clinton's, Bush Srs, or even Reagan's, so what change are you expecting from him.
"The Obama's are cheap-skates and failed to give enough of their rich personal wealth to charity.
Shame on them."
Wow, another imbecile heard from. At the risk of wasting my time replying to someone so spectacularly stupid that they think "Obama's" should have an apostrophe, the actual fact of the matter is that they donated $329,100 to charity in 2009, IN ADDITION to the entire $1.4 million for the Nobel, and $245,000 in 2010.
Welcome to the new anti-Obama GOP. Even the Democrats weren't as publicly critical of Bush as the GOP are today.
Freshieee, the Dems shouldn't criticize Bush because Pelosi/Obama have done the exact same thing.
Spend like crazy.
Too cowardly to either raise taxes or cut spending.
Torture: definition has not changed.
Sopa: GOP and Dems support, until THE PEOPLE protested
NDAA: GOP and Dems support
Guantanamo: Still open
Bush & Obama both supported the bailouts
It's all the same Freshieee
That is why I am an Independent.
Jungle.... above seems to think that the President controls spending, taxation and can do a lot of things......
........Seems to be unaware that we have Congressional representatives that are elected based on promises and pledges NEVER to raise taxes, and increase government spending in THEIR districts. When Obama proposes ANYTHING (even previous proposals supported by the Repubs) they go crazy in finding reasons that those previous ideas are now contaminated by Democratic thinking and are therefore very, very bad.
Repubs are very good at one thing...........brainwashing thin headed followers who think that those 1%ers reeeely care about paying good wages when they can get those IPods made overseas so quickly and cheaply.
Sir- Why are you trying to condemn the man for how much he chooses to give to charity? Without the facts out on what he has or has not tithed you already have jumped to the conclusion that he hasn't given enough. Last I checked tithing was a voluntary thing not a required tax. Before you go all judgemental why don't you try something new and actually research and get some facts first.
Newt as the republican nominee can NOT get elected and he would be the destruction of the party. Stop listening to what he says and do your research on him.
84 ethic violations- the reason they didn't do more against him was not because they couldn't but because we were coming off the Clinton fiasco and the democrats saw how that hurt the republicans and didn't want it to look like payback so they made a deal as they do in Washington. You don't have 84 allegations against you and not have done something more wrong than misuse of campaign funds.
Reprimanded as speaker by a bipartisan vote. Wonder why so many people who worked with him in the past are NOT BACKING HIM now? The American public might not remember more than 5 years ago but those that worked with him can't forget the unpleasant experience.
OUSTED as speaker- when your own party wants you gone because you are doing so much damage and are so ethically challenged you know things are bad
House banking scandal- bounced 20+ checks- you really want someone who can't manage money in charge of our government now?!
With Newt as the Speaker the Republican party lost the most seats in 64 years of any party not in control of the White House. We control the House and stand a chance at getting the Senate- I don't want to lose that because of Newt.
Unethical hypocrite- lectured on family values while he was committing adultry. On his second or third religion now and claims he has been forgiven but lacks remorse or regret so I'm not sure how that works. When asked about the affairs remember he said a couple of years ago how "he loved his country so much and was just too patriotic and was working too hard and that's why he had those affairs". Also, in the South Carolina debate when he pivoted onto the media with his "everyone has felt pain"- that is true but not usually something you hear from the person that CAUSED the pain- not an ounce of remorse there.
Divisive and abrasive- he makes so many statements that put so many people off that there is no way he can get elected in a general election.
Newt being Newt- Just google some of his past statements- the democrats could run an ad a day of Newt speaking for Newt and it would just kill him in the election. Remember this one: "I am not a leader. I'm too intellectual; I'm too abstract; I think too much."
I could go on and on all day and THAT is the biggest problem with Newt- if I can find all this stuff in his past after a few minutes of researching him you know what the campaign against him in a general election will be like.
I want to win in the fall and Newt can't do it.
Am I the only one here to notice that our president, according to previous posts, has given more to charity than most American families will see in 20 years of working hard every day? Am I the only one to find that ironic, in that our president wants us to all hate bankers, mortgage lenders, wall street traders, when he must be worth at least as much as they, if not more, in order to be so generous to charity? Isn't there a hypocrisy out there? But then, it is all about control isn't it? It is about the president choosing those things that he feels are worthy and then heavily supporting those things, and you are most correct, that is his right to choose, but then why lambast the other candidates for making their own choices in how their charitable contributions need be allotted.
Let the final four debate the issues tonight. If Mitt and Newt want to get into a one-on-one, fine let them have a 3 hour debate and bring all their papers. I figure there would be some news organization that would cover it just for fun. God knows they will run more than a few hours of sound bite sniping over and over and over.
The great Newt/Mitt debate - coming soon?
Mitt better learn to stand up to blowfish Newt. Big bag of useless wind raises his voice and tries to scold people can you imagine this guy's foriegn policy? LOL..OBAMA 2012
LOL - Obama lovers really fear a real candidate like Newt. All set to run against the rich white Eastern Republican. All those OWS, all tented up and nowhere to go. Too bad.
LOL why would anyone fear Ging"RICH'. A man that has no family values, apparently no ethics, and is on the payroll of Lobbyists? Please please please give him the Republican Nomination. I can't wait to watch Obama win in a landslide.
Newt Gingrich seems to have helped raise two fine children into very capable adults. He must have some family values too have done such job. He was Speaker of The House (third in line to the presidency) for longer than most who held the job. Some may disagreee, but there must have been some ethics to have been a college professor, elected to Congress several times, and to have risen to the highest position in the People's House. I know you want to be honest and fair about your evaluation.
Your charge "on the payroll of lobbyists" seems confused. Just which lobbyists do you claim Speaker Gingrich took money from? Fannie and Freddy I don't believe are considered lobbyists, if that is your poorly made charge. Please clarify.
I sincerely doubt Obama win at all. He has a solid 20% fringe and the black block vote. I do however hope Obama makes a decent showing. Would be a shame if black presidential prospects were so tarnished in the future by this first experience.
Newt is a gas bag; the snag is that what comes out is pretty foul - more like a ripe, two octave, beer fart. Unlike the latter, which is usually over in a few seconds, five at most, Newt can emit foul gas for hours on end and grins while doing so.
Obama is a gas bag; the snag is that what comes out is pretty foul - more like a ripe, two octave, beer fart. Unlike the latter, which is usually over in a few seconds, five at most, Obama can emit foul gas for hours while reading his lines and grins while doing so.
Grinspoon97 -
I am going to ignore your rather childish comment about Obama.. However, its very typical of someone who has not researched anything and has to resort to such childish behavior.
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/govt/leadership/ethics.htm <-- one article ALONE on this ethics violations. How scary that the majority of his own party voted against him.
Associated Press: Gingrich Was Hired In 2006 By Freddie Mac To Use His Influence To Keep Government Regulation Against Freddie Mac From Gaining Support In Congress. “Efforts to tighten government regulation were gaining support on Capitol Hill, and Freddie Mac was fighting back. According to internal Freddie Mac documents obtained by the AP, Reps. Bob Ney (R-Ohio), and Paul Kanjorski (D-Pa.) spent the evening in hard-to-obtain seats near the Nationals dugout with Freddie Mac executive Hollis McLoughlin and four of Freddie Mac’s in-house lobbyists. Both were members of the House Financial Services Committee. The Nationals tickets were bargains for Freddie Mac, part of a well-orchestrated, multimillion-dollar campaign to preserve its largely regulatory-free environment, with particular pressure exerted on Republicans who controlled Congress at the time. Internal Freddie Mac budget records show $11.7 million was paid to 52 outside lobbyists and consultants in 2006. Power brokers such as former House Speaker Newt Gingrich were recruited with six-figure contracts.” [Associated Press, 12/8/08]
THE GINGRICH GROUP WAS PAID BETWEEN $1.6-$1.8 MILLION IN CONSULTING FEES BY FREDDIE MAC BETWEEN 1999-2008
Bloomberg: Freddie Mac Paid Newt Gingrich $1.6-$1.8 Million In Consulting Fees, Not The $300,000 That Was Originally Thought. “Newt Gingrich made between $1.6 million and $1.8 million in consulting fees from two contracts with mortgage company Freddie Mac, according to two people familiar with the arrangement. The total amount is significantly larger than the $300,000 payment from Freddie Mac that Gingrich was asked about during a Republican presidential debate on Nov. 9 sponsored by CNBC, and more than was disclosed in the middle of congressional investigations into the housing industry collapse.” [Bloomberg News, 11/16/11]
GINGRICH’S CLAIM THAT HE WAS NEVER PAID TO LOBBY WAS CONTRADICTED BY FREDDIE MAC OFFICIALS AND POLITICAL INSIDERS WHO SAID HE WAS HIRED TO CONVINCE CONGRESSIONAL REPUBLICANS NOT TO CUT THEIR FUNDING
Gingrich Campaign: “Gingrich Has Never Lobbied For Freddie Mac…Nor Did Gingrich, As Part Of His Contract, Advocate Against Pending Legislation Affecting Freddie Mac.” “Gingrich has never lobbied for Freddie Mac, or any client, nor has anyone in any of the organizations he founded after leaving office as part of their work with them. Gingrich made a decision after resigning that he would never be a lobbyist so that nobody would ever question the genuine nature of his advice and perspectives. This prohibition against lobbying was made very clear to all Gingrich Group clients and strict internal protocals were developed to prevent lobbying. Today’s Bloomberg article confirms that Gingrich and his firm did no lobbying for Freddie Mac. Nor did Gingrich, as part of his contract, advocate against pending legislation affecting Freddie Mac, as Gingrich was accused of doing by the moderator at the CNBC debate in Michigan. This, too, was confirmed by the Bloomberg News article this morning.” [Des Moines Register, 11/16/11]
That should be plenty on his lobbyist activities... Do your own homework for more.
Do your own homework for more. Here is the real source - DEMOCRATS.ORG. LOL
http://www.democrats.org/news/december-15-GOP-debate/gingrich_tries_to_rewrite_his_lobbyist_history
Now look at the "quote" marks and show where it says Gingrich did any lobbying. You do read, right?
Grinspoon97, just go and leave the "smart talk" to the real reseachers...rofl. He really put you down. All you could come up with was that.
@Grinspoon97, "He must have some family values too have done such job."
I guess you consider leaving two sick wives and having extramarital affairs "family values"
family values my a**
"He must have some family values too have done such job."
Right, half-wit. And he banged another woman for years while still married to her. Then banged a new wh0re for years when the old wh0re got MS. Yep, that's some family values right there.
The rest of you imbecilic argument boils down to "he must have values because he's a politician." LMAO @ you
"Now look at the "quote" marks and show where it says Gingrich did any lobbying."
Right, half-wit. Mortgage companies routinely pay historians millions of dollars for history lessons.
What an imbecile.
Indeed, Leroy Gingrich said that Americans are a peaceful people and do not want to go to war. Even after the attack on Pearl Harbor the majority did not want to make war on Japan. This clown is a Historian? He is an idiot.
Grinspoon97 - Yes, I do read.. and when a man says he takes a fee of 1.7 million as a HISTORIAN for Freedie Mac - that equals LOBBYIST. If you can't read between the lines, then I suggest you take a 8th grade english class. Start with something called "Comprehension and Interpretation 101"
It also looks like you missed the whole question about ethics.. so does that mean you think that Ging"RICH" is an ethical man?
ItsAboutTime, they don't want the truth... they are too afraid of the truth. It is obvious they are no better than the lying sack of garbage known as Newt Gingrich.
Newt is a master spinner.... nothing more! Well, maybe a master cheater too... for just a second, I almost forgot about all the ex-wives. And that wife of his is nothing more than a whore... what decent woman could screw around with a man whose wife is in the hospital with cancer???? Most women will not vote for this POS... every woman I have talked to feels the same way about him and his wife.
Newt used his two daughters from his first wife to argue the things said by his second wife about his third wife. I'm surprised his daughters heads haven't spun completely off their shoulders.
Descrs - not to quibble, but it sure appears that a lot of women in South Carolina voted for him. I'm not disagreeing with your assessment of the man, but it doesn't seem to have made a damn bit of difference to the "family values" crowd.
Larger question is whether it will matter to middle America and the independents. You know, those at the top of the bell curve, not the flat fringes . . .
And how ironic that he's now a candidate for the Presidential nomination for that same party. Says more about the party than Newt, IMO.
Is America marrying the Newt or possibly hiring him to be POTUS for 4 years or so? If we are looking for a life long commitment from our next POTUS then I would suggest that the Newt is not the man. If we are looking to hire/elect someone to run this country in the role of POTUS for the next 4 to 8 years who knows the workings of Washington politics inside and out then the Newt is qualified.
Make up your mind America. The Newt for a long term/life time commitment such as in marriage? He is not the man for the job. But if you want someone who has the savvy to be POTUS for the next 4-8 years and manipulate (as made necessary by congress) Washington for the good of America, then the Newt has the qualifications for the job. Will he likely profit from all this? YES! But then again if America as a country profits as well, who cares? If we once again become a economically world leader, who cares if the person we elect POTUS next also profits? Not saying that it will and I doubt it would be this soon but hypothetically speaking if the Newt got elected POTUS and the unemployment rate dropped to 3% or less in his first 4 years, the size of our federal debt shrunk by several trillion dollars and over all our economy was back on track again, would anyone out there truly care if at the end of his term our next POTUS had set himself up to profit from his hard work as well?
Think about it America: We had a morally righteous man in Jimmy Carter and what did it get America as a country? We have one in Obama ( or at least one who is good at burying his past from prying eyes that is) and how has America profited from it? Time to get real and elect someone who can do a good job as opposed to someone who looks good but knows nothing. We are going on 4 years with that type of person at the helm. He has run the train toward a cliff at full speed. Do you really want to give him another 4 years to reach the cliff and wreck the train we know as America?
Only if it's an open marriage.
I honestly have to wonder if ANY Newt supporter was born before 1998...
Politics is dirty and ugly, and the business world is largely dirty and ugly. Recently, a study was published that demonstrated that those who are congenial and co-operative do not do as well in the workplace, furthering their career, being considered for promotions etc as those who are significantly less affable...so why do we want the slick, pretty, popular crowd to run things. It seems to fly in the face of all research as to what is effective business practice and demeanor. You need somebody to march into the valley of darkness with the aim of being the biggest and baddest in the valley, and that is not going to be a pretty process. If we hope to clean all the debris out of our government, clean up corruption, somebody is going to have to wade in and get their boots and hands dirty in the process.
The Moderates and the Conservatives (tea party) in the Republican party are enjoying the same dynamics that they brought to the House in 2010, which led to deadlock and disarray. There is no common theme or voice in this party in the current age. This is why, although I voted Republican in most of the elections since achieving the voting age (currently 56 years old), I will be voting with the Democrats in 2012. The party of "no" will get their reward this election.
Over half of us believe the Country and economy are going in the wrong direction. The Dems got a shellacking in 2010 and are setting up for another in 2012. The party refusing to hear we want smaller government and less taxes will earn the boot.
Given either deadlock or more the wrong way, Congress is doing the right thing. Just say NO till they listen.
55plus-If you are really interested go research the 30 plus jobs bills the House has sent to the Senate that have all been squashed by Harry Reid without debate. The idea that Republicans are the party of "no" is false, they are the party that is standing up for the Constitution and individual liberties while the Democrats are doing the opposite. If you can find this blog then you can google Tea Party to find out what they really stand for. The media and liberal elites (one in the same) do a dis-service to this nation when they demonize and marginalize millions of Americans on behalf of their rigid, left wing ideology. The Constitution and our Bill of Rights isn't something to be admired in a museum, it's what we base our freedoms on so when the left starts talking about taxing this group or that group more, when they start taking over your health-care, when they start telling you what you can and cannot eat, when they start taxing "carbon" among other things and when they start using your tax dollars to invest in their "pet projects" without oversight, without accountability, then you should start worrying if anything will keep them from taking the rest of your (our) hard earned freedom.
Thank goodness the GOP elected by the majority of voters in 2010 has not allowed the destructive and heinous Leftwing bills getting through.
That's why we elected them. To stop Obama's systematic destruction of this country.
You do not pass a bill just to pass something. NO, that is not in the best interest of this country.
Grinspoon97 - is that why congress has a 13% approval rating? We all know that the Tea Republicant's only job is to cost Obama his job. They have failed to accomplish anything in the last 2 years of their rule. Oh wait, they did manage to continue defense spending... yep, gotta make sure people like Dick Cheney continue to receive their corporate welfare dividends via the military industrial complex.
Defend America - Vote out the TeaParty Republicants
Glad you asked. Just when was it Congress had a good approval rating. LOL
Trouble with Congress is that we hate everyone elses guy but keep voting for our own. They Gerrymander the districts to keep the same winning ratios. As long as we keep throwing the same tired old lines at each other, they will control the verticle and the horizontal.
And that welfare thing - you ever consider that all government spending is stimulus? Space program, military, food stamps. We are spending about 40% more than revenues and the younger generation will try to pay it back. They will fail just as the Greeks are today.. Keep 'em flyin.
Grinspoon97
Glad you asked. Just when was it Congress had a good approval rating. LOL
lol, well I do have to admit, Congress doesn't always have a great approval rating... However, you can do your own homework here: www.gallup.com/poll/145238/congress-job-approval-rating-worst-gallup-history.aspx
Trouble with Congress is that we hate everyone elses guy but keep voting for our own. They Gerrymander the districts to keep the same winning ratios. As long as we keep throwing the same tired old lines at each other, they will control the verticle and the horizontal.
We as a society have gotten very lazy. We sit back on our lap tops, talk about what we like/don't like, but do nothing about it. If we held our Congress to similar ideals in the private sector (i.e., if you don't do your job, you are fired), things would change.
And that welfare thing - you ever consider that all government spending is stimulus? Space program, military, food stamps. We are spending about 40% more than revenues and the younger generation will try to pay it back. They will fail just as the Greeks are today.. Keep 'em flyin.
Honestly, we do not need to raise taxes in this country one bit. We also do NOT need to lower them one bit. What we need to do is go through all welfare (Corporate/Social) alike and start cutting out things that make no sense. We should not allow oil companies to continue to receive 4 billion in 'loop'holes, while making record profits. GE should be paying their fair share of taxes, and not receiving rewards for moving jobs overseas. Welfare recipients are not entitled to use this program as a way of life. There must be a cap, there must be limits. We cannot allow lobbyists (from Corporate America, the Unions, etc.) to buy Congressional favors. If both sides of the aisle would sit down and compromise, and become accountable to the american people, things would change.
Grinspoon97, verticle, is that like testicle? like you? Did itsabouttime put you to school too! wow...like i said leave the "smart talk" to the people who can research.
Are you INSANE, grinspoon??? The GOP Teabaggers have done practically NOTHING to help America. Other than bringing up the important debt issue, they have done BUMPKISS!!!!!!! They twice sabotaged a deal to get something done about our debt: the first time by rejecting Obama's generous compromise and secondly by hijacking the supercommittee and the rest of the GOP!!! They wasted a precious opportunity to create 2 MILLION jobs (and union jobs are better than no jobs) while adding NOTHING to our future deficits!!! All because it was payed for by a slight tax on millionaires. And after all their talk about keeping taxes down, they balked at providing a TAX CUT for the MIDDLE CLASS!!!!! THE GOP and the Tea Party are a bunch of lying SOBS. I pray for a REPUBLICAN shellacking in 2012, or this country is DONE FOR.
OBAMA BIDEN 2012
Itsabouttime: How does the federal government know the welfare needs of every person, or every county, or ever state for that matter?
Welfare is best taken care of at a smaller level. Leave welfare, and many other things, to the states.
@lukewarm
"55plus-If you are really interested go research the 30 plus jobs bills the House has sent to the Senate that have all been squashed by Harry Reid without debate."
Um, right....Those "30 plus 'jobs' bills" you are referring to were nothing MORE than additional tax cuts (let's see how DID those Bush Tax Cuts work out for our economy?) and less regulation, particularly of the market and financial institutions (again, you don't have to have a long memory to recall what an under-regulated market & banking industry looks like...2008 again, anyone?) Dude, seriously, turn off Fox Noise -- you are about to OD on that toxic kool-aid they are serving!
JoobyFoo - How does the state government know the welfare needs of every person or county in their jurisdiction? How can the states ensure everyone is treated equally and fairly? How come some states can deny a minority of the population equal rights and 6 give equal rights?
I agree, there are certain things that should be left at the state level, but when it comes to equal rights, the federal government has 100% jurisdiction in my opinion. If you want to limit the $ for social welfare programs and leave that to the states, no problem, but what you will find, is a severe imbalance in most, and there would be NO social programs at all. I'd also say then, we have NO corporate welfare either if it's left to the states.
A good point was made that both social and corporate supports need to be cut in order to help our deficit situation. And, I don't think that an even handed approach of looking at everything, absolutely everything, our government spends money on with an eye to how we can cut cost, economize, eliminated duplications, cut non-essential programs, we could make great progress. But liberal mindset sees social spending as inviolate-can't be touched, and conservative mindset sees the same for corporate spending with the fear that jobs and salaries will be further depressed, productivity will drop. Daily, we all hear about things that are funded by our government and we scratch our heads and wonder why....There was a huge tempest in a teapot about spending $500 per toilet seat at the Pentagon several years back, and we could certainly all see where a trip to the local Home Depot would save the government hundreds of thousands of dollars. Obscure research grants for topics that probably do not have any immediate impact on the good of the people of America are funded in the hundreds of thousand of dollars in the name of education, but yet we are not educating our children, and the school districts and teacher's unions keep asking for more and more money. When as a society, will we learn that throwing money at any problem is not a solution, but rather a large green bandaid over something that isn't functioning properly, hiding the real problem.
Gingrinch is leading Romney by 8 points in the latest Florida poll.
obama is not only thanking jesus for that, but all the jesus freaks as well.
Jesus was a black man!
jesus loves every color and every one
Jesus approved of dumping your wife for some random wh0re. Oh wait...
mark,get a brain scarecrow!
What's a brain scarecrow?
lukewarm- my favorite jobs bill tied up in the senate is hr2681 the cement sector regulatory relief act.
it is estimated that 2500 Workers inhaling the cement dust contract lung cancer. It is required that the industry provide breathing equipment for the workers. This bill will remove this heavy expense from industry and allow them to hire more workers. But the Dems are holding this jobs bill hostage in the Senate.
Paxil-Truth be known, new regulations scheduled to go into effect would have shut down 20% of the cement factories in the United States and shipped those jobs overseas. This bill doesn't get rid of all regulations or safety requirements but it does get rid of archaic, stupid, over-intrusive policies from the left wing environmental wacko's that are killing our economy. Then again, the left isn't interested in the truth, just fear mongering.
Yep luke, osha and the epa are two of the main reasons that jobs have left the country. It's not that what they are trying to accomplish is wrong, it's the way they are trying to accomplish it.
The cost to a company for any reportable osha injury is close to being enough to pay an employee for a year. Robots do not report injuries.
Here is another thing your wonderful bill will do, earthjustice org blog 2011, look that up on a search engine
Robots don't buy products and they cant feed your family. Don't be a schmuck
Your post is such a bumper sticker for the GOP's complete ignorance of the Middle Class.
You nutbag corporate allegiance types just wont be satisfied until they pay no taxes, can have everyone making $4.00 an hour (or outsourced entirely) and no benefits all while having the 'freedom' to make poison products and toxic waste
And the 2,500 cement workers dying of lung cancer due to toxic dust, do you really expect all of us to swallow that these deaths are a 'cost of doing business'? Is child safety so remote from your philosophy that the 'freedom' to use a toxic substance in a toy is also a 'cost of doing business'?
Why does the GOP want the Middle Class to be Chinese or Indian? Why are the deaths of consumers a 'free market' expense. Totally sick and typical of what is in the heart of Republicans and TeaBaggers alike.
The GOP assault on the Middle Class continues......
They're just waiting on the right vulture to come and pick up a supplier to make money off of it to give to them...
Just like Romney's top campaign donor did with the asbestos issue...
2Lane: Well you're point was terrible. This economy proves the jobs aren't there... so again, Robots don't report injuries
2Lane: You are also a fear monger. $4/hr? really? Ca' mon.
I get confused with you right wingnuts, so if Corporations are people and robots are employed by corporations, then are robots people too?
Ok, Ill change it to minimum wage. My argument remains the same. And seriously..is that the best you got?...(chuckle)
Obama/Biden 2012
We live in a hazardous world. The potential for injury and illness exists everywhere. Unfortunate things happen to innocent, hardworking, decent people, and yet, we somehow believe that the government can correct everything and make the world a totally safe utopia. Millions of dollars are expended to determine if children have been exposed to toxic levels of lead in this country, and on the surface, that sounds wonderful-welfare and health of children, but the reality is that for those children affected by lead poisoning, the diagnosis from testing comes after irreparrable damage has already been done, and for a large majority of children, there is no evidence of exposure or poisoning. We had a family physician who was part of a research group on this very topic. They chose a population living in and around an oil refinery area with the thought that this would result in the greatest possible contact with lead based substances, but after testing all the children, the incidence was no higher than children living in a rural area removed from manufacturing and other contaminants...Many occupations carry risks, and perhaps that is one of the reasons that these occupations also offer higher salaries than another worker might receive. In our modern world, I don't imagine that coal miners go about their job without an understanding that he work carries specific health hazards. That is not to say that we shouldn't try to minimize the hazard, but instead of being adversarial between government and company, it should be a joint effort benefitting all. Once again, finger pointing gets in the way of real problem solving and nobody can agree upon who should be responsible. An individual can choose not to work in a given job or industry if they feel the risks are too great, and to say that those are the only jobs that pay well, brings us back to the notion that the higher pay might well be a recognition of higher risk to the employee.
Sue There are many jobs that can be life threatening.I have worked in a few places that have them.The government and their unions are the only hope that people working in those jobs have.The employers do not want to lose the money protecting those people.If you believe that those dangerous jobs are high paying jobs you are mistaken.
Is Harry Reid going to look at any of the 30 shelved jobs bills passed from the House? He won't even debate them with the Seante or make possible changes to them? Just simply shelve them?? Why is the House considered the party of no. It has been 1000 days. Are we getting a budget yet Mr. Obama?
Latest polls show Newt leading Romney in Florida by 8 points Dee!
People of Florida please do not make the same mistake that just happened in South Carolina. Do not be taken in by a Smooth talking Lobbist. Newt is playing on what got the last current bum elected on our emotions. Newt,s got more baggage than a trailways bus. He owes more favors and has more dirt on him than any other candidate. Think we need at this time an actual businessman to take control of this great nation. Simply put we need a businessman not a true politician. Get behind Mr. Romney We cannot afford 4 more years of Obama. My children cannot afford 4 more years. My grandchilkdren cannot afford 4 more years. Wake up AMERICA.
Congress is the one who never came up with a budget. Obama presented one and both houses turned it down. In case you have forgotten the Constitution, the president PRESENTS a budget outline to Congress. Congress then determines WHAT in that proposal will become part of THEIR BUDGET RESOLUTION, which is then to be their guideline to pass ALL appropriations bills BEFORE the beginning of the fiscal year (October 1). We are now four months into the 2012 fiscal year....NO Congressional Budget Resolution, and ONLY the DOD appropriations passed so far.
The 2013 busget proposal will be sent to Congress in early February. Want to bet that Congress will once again take NO action on that budget....other than turning it down with no discussion like the last budget proposal?????
anti-trust: it must have been terrible...
Dee, I have read several of the bills. I encourage everyone to do the same. They all contain poison pills along with the job idea. Same crap they tried with the Obama tax cut extension. If they removed the poison provisions, they would sail through. But that's just it with the mob mentality of the GOP crowd...they wont compromise, even to the detriment of the middle class, They still believe in the trickle down unicorn. They're supply side economics doesn't work in modern times.
So Dee's argument that they are being held up just for the sake of saying no, fails miserably. They cant put out a bill without attaching some far-right agenda item.
They want invest in robots, and 3rd world workers . I prefer the the approach of Democrats and Independents, invest in the middle classworker and our own infrastructure
Obama/Biden 2012
They are to busy trying to feel up there own pockets so why should they worrie about the people ,we'll just b..s the hole bunch...LOOK at Ginh witch and Fanny the money they made off of the gov at our exp..
Did any of you ever take time to actually read the president's 2012 budget proposal? The Senate 0-97 vote against his proposal was political procedural grandstanding....Reid knew that the GOP was going to filibuster any attempts to even consider the proposal. Both houses of Congress are supposed to complete their Budget resolutions no later than April 15 each year.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=155
I'll be watching the scyfi channel. I've heard ALL the candidates already.........none are getting my vote.
Obama/Biden 2012
Someday, I actually hope to vote FOR a candidate, instead of AGAINST one.
Ron Paul is the only candidate not bought and paid for by corporations he gets most donations from active duty military personnel and grassroot campaigns Romney biggest contributor is Goldman Sachs.
need i say more ?
Why Paul does not have a chance!!
They should each be packing a Colt 45 or some long range shotgun, especially Newt. Just hope the Lizard doesn't shoot the moderator. (And this guy's running for President - go figure the GOP!) Anyway, the debates have turned out to be one of the most ridiculously entertaining things on TV - a couple of clowns & a lunatic!
SHOWDOWN - Western style - What could be more American than that! Gun duel @ the OK Corral. Couldn't have worded it better myself!
I'm rooting for Mitt Romney in the white cowboy hat!
I think so carolina was correct. That gingrinch presents a more clear choice than romney. It's because with gingrinch, you get everything mr grover, the gop, & the rushbo are known for. Lies, immorality, anti-environmetalism, incompetence, corruption - just a typical gop'er.
But according to what i read, romney got special low tax rates that only the upper 1% can get. It has to do with investments. For example, say you get interest from stocks & bonds. Would you ever pay 15% on that. No. No. But check his tax return. Romney did.
Newt McPherson (his real name) aka “Gingrich” is correct when he describes Mitt Romney as a Wall Street insider. Mitt Romney is correct when he describes Former Speaker of the House Newt as a lobbyist and Washington insider. They both are correct in their characterizations of each other. Unfortunately these “types” are responsible for the mess they got the country in to. But they (and the Republican electorate) do not see this but want to get back to the way things were that lead up to the 2008 crash.
I am sure that Ron Paul would be happy to bring us a government just like what is gripping Somalia at this moment. None of the Republican candidates meet the standards that this country needs. They are all basket cases.
I remember ( Eye of a Newt ) when he was speak the the House 15 years ago.
That guy is bought and paid for , Forget Ron paul ..he's trying to save the USA and i don't think it's worth saving
anymore. I would love to see your faces when the skys light up and everybody gets blowin away,
cause thats whats going to happen !
predicting WWIII???
Romney, republicans , or the just plain greedy ; have been whinning like toddlers since the death of TRICKLED DOWN ECONOMICS. it's time for them to grow up , and face the generational changes of life in AMERICA. the BUSH REGIME bankrupt america with their arrogant and flawed cowboy diplomacy. insisting on speaking WMD's into existance, just to occupy iraq and get even with SADDAM HUSSIEN. forget usama bin laden, is what bush said. all he did was occupy the USA TAX PAYERS MONEY until we were in the red. can you remember the surplus he inherited ? in just 36 months it was history, '' thanks to the spoiled brat republicans. rush limpbrain always said he can out think democrats with his brains behind his back. apparently that american bankruptcy came on his and the repugs watch. in 36 months, OBAMA killed usama, killed ga goofy and his insane followers, killed key leaders of usama's followers, and is still offering JOBS BILLS, and working hard to get america out of the quagmere BUSH AND HIS WMD ADMINISTRATION put the USA in. Romney JUST ''FORGOT'' TO MENTION THAT. like '' PERRY,'' haaaaaaaaaa haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
how can you pay to create jobs with no money? get outta here... he's added more to the debt than Bush... how was that possible?
Screw 'em both!
The problem was the republicans did not see that the unbudgeted war spending was bankrupting this country along with 123% loans on your house. The USA was on the brink of a major depression, with us loosing 500,000 jobs plus per month and it was going to continue across many sectors of the economy. Once the turn around is in full swing the excessive spending will stop and government will contract and yes there will be cuts. Read about John Maynard Keynes. Trickle down or voodoo economics does not work.
I'm laughing all the way to my independence
Watching the Nightly News or watching Meet The Press, the main point I hear from ALL of the candidates is how they are going to do this or that to "BEAT OBAMA"! They chat from time to time about issues, now they need to focus on fixing the country! I first voted Republican for Richard Nixon and I have been voting Republic ever since. However, right now NONE of the candidates have said anything to impress me and convince me to vote for them! I don't know the answers, but right now I may be leaning towards 4 more years! Republican candidates stop making "BEATING OBAMA" your focus and start focusing on fixing the economy and helping small business create more jobs! The common man will support you and follow you if you give us a good reason!!
You obviously don't know anything about Dr. Ron Paul...
www(dot)ronpaul2012(dot)com/the-issues/ron-paul-plan-to-restore-america/
I sure do...hes senile and makes John McCain look virile
He has some good ideas but its just not going to happen, Sorry.
Although it would be great if Ron Paul went 3rd party. He would be most useful to Obama's re-election
Obama/Biden 2012
(Got candidate?)
More Republicans coming to Florida, we will NEVER get this place fumigated now, crap.
A poster above labeled Ron Paul as "Off The Wall." I don't know exactly what that means, but Doctor Paul is talking about us moving forward and up instead of forward and down. Ladies and gentilmen, we can't keep playing as if we are children spending our Chineese parents money. We can't keep running red ink and spend ourselves into prosperity. We have to stop making war and start making exports. We need to hand the keys to the treasury and the printing machine back to the people in congress that we can control and take them away from the faceless money changers at the FED. They want you dependant and Doctor Paul wants you independant. Do you think that this upstart two hundred and forty year old nation needs seven hundred and sixty military bases around the world? We have bombed twenty-six nations since World War two and many of them two, and some three times. Our CIA has made such a mess of foreign policy; they couldn't even see that The Soviet Union was collapsing, couldn't say out loud what they knew, that Saddam Hussein had no nukes, no active WMD program, and no real army to speak of. The Bush White House would have court marshaled the CIA hiarchy had they spoken up against this three trillion dollar fiasco. Time to admitt it folks, we suck at running the world. Time for an off the wall solution.
We actually want to continue to move Our Country, while Mr. Paul would take us back to when the Buffalo roamed. No Thanks
Forward, like in what? The direction this nation is taking FORWARD is that of an authoritarian police/warfare state ala Nazi Germany or the USSR. Has Obama rid us of the stupid TSA? Nope he has given us the MDAA. All you need now is for the whole deck of cards to collapse in 2013 and you will see what "going forward" is all about with Obama and his GOP Establishment friends. Do you love freedom or do you think going FORWARD towards a police state is a good thing. Our grandparents, great grand parents, and especially great great grandparents knew what true freedom was. There was no need for big government, as people took care of themselves and their communities. Along with freedom, comes responsibility for how one conducts his or her life. It is too bad we have too many folks in this nation that don't want to do that.
moveforward: You obviously watch too much television.
www(dot)ronpaul2012(dot)com/the-issues/ron-paul-plan-to-restore-america/
If todays Americans did any research on candidates, we would not be in this mess. They do vote in Congress, who gave the power to the very people you are trying to blame for our problems.
With all the talk by Paul and the others on these stages, our tax rate is at the second lowest EVER! We have always raised taxes to pay for wars, ecept the Bush Wars. We cannot continue to cut our income and expect to get out of debt, that is foolishness. Yes they cut taxes after 1945..from 93% during the Regan years...from 70%. If we raised taxes on everyone by 5% we would still be in our lowest 10% of anytime in our history. Even Bush wanted these to be temporary. what is wrong with everyone? FYI- our lowest ? Just before the Depression- do you see a pattern?
Mr Bruce
Ive been lookin for someone that supports taking care of SELF.
Well, technically, the Republicans gave us the MDAA. Obama is just the fool that signed it. But at least I can laugh every time someone mentions Obama's "radical socialist" policies. Let's see, extended Bush tax cuts, implemented Romneycare nationwide, Gitmo, and now we have the MDAA.
Anyone believing in politics needs their head examined..... All of them are puppets who serve their 1% masters....
ron paul thank you so much for what you are going to do for this country!!!!!dr. paul if the republican party does not give you the nomination please run independant
ron paul is a democrat much like Obama only trying to sell himself as a republican. he wimpers like a coward when he talks. we need a person with real balls to lead this nation of heros. not a winny little old man who wants to blame all the worlds problems on the very country he is purposing to lead.
rpisagenius: HA, you are funny...
Your an idiot. So I guess your more interested in a younger president with bigger balls.
"Gingrich tax returns raise questions"...well, there's a surprise. I must say, I am shocked by this news....can't wait to see Romney's tax returns.....should be a lesson in how the wealthy avoid paying anywhere near the taxes that are already too low....
Who pays more to the IRS than the law requires? Be fair. Not me. I pay the least amount I can. You can give more if you want to. Who does that? Do any of you?
bd17 (i think i had a dyslexic moment), wright it off if you can. it's not avoidance, it's the law. Get use to it...............Unless your smarter than the tax code!